The Moana Pasifika Franchise

[Dan54]

What I find amusing is that for years now people on here have been saying NZR should put out more teams and/ or share their players with the RA teams to Level the playing field, but as soon as they add a team (technically two as I believe they also hold Drua's licence) it gets cast as a cunning plan to increase the AB selection base.

Yep, you and I both know if NZ released ABs etc to play in Aus teams etc, we would still get complaints that they didn't force them to do it!
I suspect it keeps a few of the posters going knowing in their mind that NZR are the evil empire, and conveniently overlook whatever comp etc we have is signed off by RA too!

 

[Rugbynutter39]

What I find amusing is that for years now people on here have been saying NZR should put out more teams and/ or share their players with the RA teams to Level the playing field, but as soon as they add a team (technically two as I believe they also hold Drua's licence) it gets cast as a cunning plan to increase the AB selection base.

I actually don’t have a problem with MP (Moana Pasifika) being an extra kiwi team if they were transparent about it. But that is exactly it - nzru are just not transparent and dress up their self interest as something purely altruistic which we all know is BS. Plus rather then do one set of rules for one team (all blacks selection) why not help level the playing field by doing it for all team’s in TT? I think we all know the answer to that...but of course nzru are the patron saints or mother Teresa of rugby who can do no wrong in the eyes of some one eyed kiwis on here (note only a few one eyed as many balanced ones too). Yes I await the one eyed oz fans comment as that would be fair. Point being we need someone more arms length involved in the design and running of a TT which even Dan agreed with.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Yep, you and I both know if NZ released ABs etc to play in Aus teams etc, we would still get complaints that they didn't force them to do it!
I suspect it keeps a few of the posters going knowing in their mind that NZR are the evil empire, and conveniently overlook whatever comp etc we have is signed off by RA too!

Dan come on you telling me RA and NZRU are all happy campers, holding hands and aligned.

Reality is we know RA does not have the stronger negotiating position here and you have agreed it would be better if had arms length organisation involved in designing and running it. And that is BS there would be complaints of forcing players as we just want the options available and rules in place. You are getting petulant with these sort of remarks. Please acknowledge that nzru have been far from perfect in stakeholder relations in the last 18 months and stop this one eyed nonsense. I call out when RA makes mistakes so stop pretending nzru is perfection and never makes any. Final post for me as we don’t need another 100 page tit for tat bunch of posts between us that goes no where.

 

[dru]

What I find amusing is that for years now people on here have been saying NZR should put out more teams and/ or share their players with the RA teams to Level the playing field, but as soon as they add a team (technically two as I believe they also hold Drua's licence) it gets cast as a cunning plan to increase the AB selection base.

Can't disagree. If NZ players are open to the team it can only help. It isn't enough though - another two teams? Or open up selection criteria?

It is a little cynical, but I don't mind the strength build for MP (Moana Pasifika). Can only be good for the comp.

 

[Adam84]

I not aware of any NZR appointments on MP (Moana Pasifika) board (but that not to say there not). I actually thought it was set up (with NZR help) by a group from Auckland (Iceman-BG etc) with conversations with Tonga and Samoa RUs. I see Toutai Kefu said he has been talking to Aaron Mauger for a while about Tongan players he suggests would be good for the team etc. Was pleased to hear that and assume the same with Samoan coaches is happening.
But like you I have never seen or really looked for governance structure for them.

I’ve heard theres 2 NZR appointments within MP (Moana Pasifika) board, Also heard very little dialogue has occurred with Samoa or Tonga

I actually don’t have a problem with MP (Moana Pasifika) being an extra kiwi team if they were transparent about it. But that is exactly it - nzru are just not transparent and dress up their self interest as something purely altruistic which we all know is BS. Plus rather then do one set of rules for one team (all blacks selection) why not help level the playing field by doing it for all team’s in TT? I think we all know the answer to that.but of course nzru are the patron saints or mother Teresa of rugby who can do no wrong in the eyes of some one eyed kiwis on here (note only a few one eyed as many balanced ones too). Yes I await the one eyed oz fans comment as that would be fair. Point being we need someone more arms length involved in the design and running of a TT which even Dan agreed with.

I dont either, i just think transparencry is necessary here since World Rugby made a funding commitment to Moana Pasifika which was explained as helping Tonga and Samoa, i just assumed that meant they would be key partners in the relationship. I’d prefer to see Tonga and Samoa have equal or greater representation in the MP (Moana Pasifika) committee then NZRU, which doesn’t seem to be the case.

I think its important for these countries to have skin in the game, and also provided the opportunity for development of their own rugby administrators not just the players.

 

[Bullrush]

What I find amusing is that for years now people on here have been saying NZR should put out more teams and/ or share their players with the RA teams to Level the playing field, but as soon as they add a team (technically two as I believe they also hold Drua's licence) it gets cast as a cunning plan to increase the AB selection base.

Exactly.

Apparently NZ is supposed to identify and identify Pacific Island players AND fund their international teams as well.

NZ can be criticised for how it's dealt with the island nations on certain issues but I don't think this is one. It's also a bit rich coming from a country where nearly half the national squad this year are islanders.

 

[Adam84]

Can't disagree. If NZ players are open to the team it can only help. It isn't enough though - another two teams? Or open up selection criteria?

It is a little cynical, but I don't mind the strength build for MP (Moana Pasifika). Can only be good for the comp.

Absolutely, competitive teams is critical to the success fo the tournament, ultimately I’d like MP (Moana Pasifika) to be the pathway for rugby players in Tonga and Samoa, but that takes time and in the short term they need success.

 

[Adam84]

Exactly.

Apparently NZ is supposed to identify and identify Pacific Island players AND fund their international teams as well.

NZ can be criticised for how it's dealt with the island nations on certain issues but I don't think this is one. It's also a bit rich coming from a country where nearly half the national squad this year are islanders.

Have i missed something, i don’t believe anyone in this thread has said this?

 

[Dan54]

Dan come on you telling me RA and NZRU are all happy campers, holding hands and aligned.

Reality is we know RA does not have the stronger negotiating position here and you have agreed it would be better if had arms length organisation involved in designing and running it. And that is BS there would be complaints of forcing players as we just want the options available and rules in place. You are getting petulant with these sort of remarks. Please acknowledge that nzru have been far from perfect in stakeholder relations in the last 18 months and stop this one eyed nonsense. I call out when RA makes mistakes so stop pretending nzru is perfection and never makes any. Final post for me as we don’t need another 100 page tit for tat bunch of posts between us that goes no where.

No what I mean by forcing would be if not enough came, the call would be (and already seen it suggested in here and you liking it) to have a draft, that is forcing players mate, regardless of what anyone says! Of course NZR aren't perfect , but by christ neither have RA, and reading your comments they gaone from being a firm rugby board (last year) to this year being weak and rolling over. I don't believe RA are as bad as you lot are making out and got most of what they wanted in Super comp.

And note I said whar RA wanted, not a few posters on a forum!

 

[kiap]

What I find amusing is that for years now people on here have been saying NZR should put out more teams and/ or share their players with the RA teams to Level the playing field, but as soon as they add a team (technically two as I believe they also hold Drua's licence) it gets cast as a cunning plan to increase the AB selection base.

The bolded bit is actually the more cunning. Why do they "hold" the Drua licence if they don't run the team?

In terms of Moana Pasifika, probably the only sustainable option is it being the sixth NZR team in all but name.

Short step from there to call it as such (for those who'd say it).

 

[Adam84]

For the record World Rugby is actually funding $3.3million annually over the next 3 years for MP (Moana Pasifika) and Drua and making this happen

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

The bolded bit is actually the more cunning. Why do they "hold" the Drua licence if they don't run the team?

In terms of Moana Pasifika, probably the only sustainable option is it being the sixth NZR team in all but name.

Short step from there to call it as such (for those who'd say it).

I'm assuming that as it's an NZR/ RA comp one of them has to hold the licenses & for whatever reason(s) they've agreed that NZR do it. Not sure if that means NZR are underwriting one or both - per Adam 84 above, WR (World Rugby) are providing some funding but I'm not sure who's providing the rest or bearing the risk of one or both going belly-up.

 

[Adam84]

Australian Government has also committed $million in support to the Drua through the AusPacific grants program

 

[Rugbynutter39]

I’ve heard theres 2 NZR appointments within MP (Moana Pasifika) board, Also heard very little dialogue has occurred with Samoa or Tonga



I dont either, i just think transparencry is necessary here since World Rugby made a funding commitment to Moana Pasifika which was explained as helping Tonga and Samoa, i just assumed that meant they would be key partners in the relationship. I’d prefer to see Tonga and Samoa have equal or greater representation in the MP (Moana Pasifika) committee then NZRU, which doesn’t seem to be the case.

I think its important for these countries to have skin in the game, and also provided the opportunity for development of their own rugby administrators not just the players.

Nzru accessing world rugby funding for a sixth kiwi team...hmmm...I guess we get to more the real reasons why nzru support MP (Moana Pasifika). Self interest rules

 

[Adam84]

Nzru accessing world rugby funding for a sixth kiwi team.hmmm.I guess we get to more the real reasons why nzru support MP (Moana Pasifika). Self interest rules

I’d hate to be cynical, but thats my concern as well…
That WR (World Rugby) funding intended to support Tonga/Samoa inadvertently ends up supporting New Zealand.

 

[Dan54]

Nzru accessing world rugby funding for a sixth kiwi team.hmmm.I guess we get to more the real reasons why nzru support MP (Moana Pasifika). Self interest rules

Geez so NZR is supporting a MP (Moana Pasifika) team that costs approx $10 mill a year so they can get at some o the 1.75 mill a year? Geez I don't know how that evil empire even exists with whoever is doing the budgeting for them, and on top going guarantee for Drua who it seems will be based in Aus?

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Nzru accessing world rugby funding for a sixth kiwi team.hmmm.I guess we get to more the real reasons why nzru support MP (Moana Pasifika). Self interest rules

I’d hate to be cynical, but thats my concern as well…
That WR (World Rugby) funding intended to support Tonga/Samoa inadvertently ends up supporting New Zealand.

And hence why nzru will support

Geez so NZR is supporting a MP (Moana Pasifika) team that costs approx $10 mill a year so they can get at some o the 1.75 mill a year? Geez I don't know how that evil empire even exists with whoever is doing the budgeting for them, and on top going guarantee for Drua who it seems will be based in Aus?

Geez so NZR is supporting a MP (Moana Pasifika) team that costs approx $10 mill a year so they can get at some o the 1.75 mill a year? Geez I don't know how that evil empire even exists with whoever is doing the budgeting for them, and on top going guarantee for Drua who it seems will be based in Aus?

Bit over dramatic - cunning maybe - but Evil Empire...have you been watching too many Star Wars movies in lockdown Dan.

 

[Dan54]

And hence why nzru will support


Bit over dramatic - cunning maybe - but Evil Empire.have you been watching too many Star Wars movies in lockdown Dan.

Na mate , missed them all, but you maybe almost right, I probably been reading to many posts in here during lockdown

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Na mate , missed them all, but you maybe almost right, I probably been reading to many posts in here during lockdown

Omg the Star Wars one released in 1977 - biggest and best - worth watching mate. Tell me have you watched the castle - as given you lived in oz that is also a must see film for your right of passage.

 

[Brumby Runner]

The bolded bit is actually the more cunning. Why do they "hold" the Drua licence if they don't run the team?

In terms of Moana Pasifika, probably the only sustainable option is it being the sixth NZR team in all but name.

Short step from there to call it as such (for those who'd say it).

Most of us think the SRSP competition will die in 2 years time due to lack of capability to compete with the 5 NZ sides. If it then splits back to a version of the separate Super Rugby competitions, would it be easier for NZ to stuff up the Aus deal by refusing to nominate the Drua to participate? Always hope for the best but expect the worst.