Wallabies v Italy - 9 November

[Dctarget]

Ikitau and Sua'ali'i will need to be on their best, the Italian centre pairing is probably 2nd best in Europe.

 

[JRugby2]

Ikitau and Sua'ali'i will need to be on their best, the Italian centre pairing is probably 2nd best in Europe.

Feel like JAS is slowly showing himself to be a bit of a handbrake on this side at 13. It's not an original point - nor his fault, he can't pick himself there - but he rarely performs in positional play. All of his highlights tend to be in area's he could realistically perform from the wing without having to also carry the weight of arguably the most difficult position in the backline.

 

[Dctarget]

Feel like JAS is slowly showing himself to be a bit of a handbrake on this side at 13. It's not an original point - nor his fault, he can't pick himself there - but he rarely performs in positional play. All of his highlights tend to be in area's he could realistically perform from the wing without having to also carry the weight of arguably the most difficult position in the backline.

I liked his big hit on the English player that jolted the ball out. Impressive at 21.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

Don't agree myself. I think Ikitau and JAS have the makings of a pair that worry oppositions far more than any alternate combo the Wallabies could put out there since it seems Kerevi is off the radar.

I do agree he could be good on the Wing but with Nawaquinitawse coming back into the fold that is going to be a full group. JAS and Marky Mark (Nawaqanitawase) would be some targets though on the Wings for a 10.

 

[PhilClinton]

Feel like JAS is slowly showing himself to be a bit of a handbrake on this side at 13. It's not an original point - nor his fault, he can't pick himself there - but he rarely performs in positional play. All of his highlights tend to be in area's he could realistically perform from the wing without having to also carry the weight of arguably the most difficult position in the backline.

JAS has been thrown into the fire but you've got to think it's to ensure we have a potentially world class centre pairing for the RWC.

He's 21yrs old and is only going to keep getting better and better. Much harder to find good centres in Oz than Wallabies wingers (Pietch, Potter, Marky Marky, Jorgo to name a few who should be in their prime for RWC).

 

[Dctarget]

Don't agree myself. I think Ikitau and JAS have the makings of a pair that worry oppositions far more than any alternate combo the Wallabies could put out there since it seems Kerevi is off the radar.

I do agree he could be good on the Wing but with Nawaquinitawse coming back into the fold that is going to be a full group. JAS and Marky Mark (Nawaqanitawase) (Nawaqanitawase) would be some targets though on the Wings for a 10.

Few big ifs here but: if Nawaqanitawase is available to Wallabies, if Wright is fit and back to his top pace (difficult), if Jorgo, Ikitau and JAS remain fit then our back five of 12. Ikitau 13. Sua'ali'i 11/14 Nawaqanitawase/Jorgensen 15. Wright is up there with the best in the world.

Flyhalf and scrumhalf will be our hand break (and of course our paper thin depth).

 

[Tomthumb]

Slim was also saying QC (Quade Cooper) (Quade Cooper)'s opinion was not as idiotic as the guy I spoke to - who said Edmed was barely Super Rugby quality (which I have since retracted from the conversation)

Dan McKellar would agree with the guy you spoke to

 

[Tomthumb]

He didn't really give his view as a former international player though. He tweeted as a fan after a test loss and then apologized later for his tweet.

I'd happily respect a well thought out opinion from him but this wasn't it.

He apologized for being critical but in the same message he doubled down on his belief that Edmed shouldn't be playing Test match rugby, which no one has been able to counter with any actual on-field showings by Tane

 

[Tomthumb]

Feel like JAS is slowly showing himself to be a bit of a handbrake on this side at 13. It's not an original point - nor his fault, he can't pick himself there - but he rarely performs in positional play. All of his highlights tend to be in area's he could realistically perform from the wing without having to also carry the weight of arguably the most difficult position in the backline.

I do think that has as much to do with the system as anything. The ball hasn't been flowing through the backline at all the last few months, so it's really hard for a 13 to get himself ball in space when there is nothing productive happening inside him

Putting him on the wing wouldn't change anything as evidenced by Jorgenson touching the ball 2 times the whole game vs England

 

[Brumby Runner]

JAS appears to me to have difficulty getting up to speed. He just looks lumbering in his first 5 or so metres of a run. I don't think he's ever going to beat a good defensive line through footwork but has to rely on being put into space to be an effective attacking weapon. I am also unconvinced about his ability to set up his wingers. When he does pass the ball, it can often be much too hard for the distance between himself and the receiver, resulting in stuttering attack or dropped/missed pass.

I think the England game has also put to rest his reputation under the high ball. I reckon he lost more high ball than Tane, and certainly didn't collect as many as Tane did.

 

[Wilson]

I think the England game has also put to rest his reputation under the high ball. I reckon he lost more high ball than Tane, and certainly didn't collect as many as Tane did.

He got beaten badly for one high ball off an English kick I remember, but the issue there was that he was at centre and they targeted him directly - the ball was out just behind him, forcing him to compete on the ground while back tracking, when ideally the Kellaway (or whoever else in the back 3 was closest) would've come forward onto the ball to compete.

If Sua'ali'i is shifted into the back 3 he can play that role competing in the air properly which suits him much better, assuming he can get his positioning right. That might be a big leap (pardon the pun) but it's definitely something Kellaway has struggled with compared to Wright and even Jorgenson to a lesser degree.

The other part is making sure it's our best high ball proponents dropping back each time, rather than always using the 10. While Tane managed to catch more than previous games, he never really took them in a position of strength and was repeatedly turned over immediately afterwards.

 

[Strewthcobber]

He got beaten badly for one high ball off an English kick I remember, but the issue there was that he was at centre and they targeted him directly - the ball was out just behind him, forcing him to compete on the ground while back tracking, when ideally the Kellaway (or whoever else in the back 3 was closest) would've come forward onto the ball to compete.

If Sua'ali'i is shifted into the back 3 he can play that role competing in the air properly which suits him much better, assuming he can get his positioning right. That might be a big leap (pardon the pun) but it's definitely something Kellaway has struggled with compared to Wright and even Jorgenson to a lesser degree.

The other part is making sure it's our best high ball proponents dropping back each time, rather than always using the 10. While Tane managed to catch more than previous games, he never really took them in a position of strength and was repeatedly turned over immediately afterwards.

Squidge has a good piece on this - England's tactics and executaion were really good. Wallabies were getting caught out using the furtherest back defender catching the ball and then getting isolated, and then getting turned over, so they started using Suuallii etc further up field, who were in worse positions to make the catch, but meant they had some protection behind the ball for the ruck cleanout/dropped ball.

Neither approach really worked in the end

 

[Wilson]

Squidge has a good piece on this - England's tactics and executaion were really good. Wallabies were getting caught out using the furtherest back defender catching the ball and then getting isolated, and then getting turned over, so they started using Suuallii etc further up field, who were in worse positions to make the catch, but meant they had some protection behind the ball for the ruck cleanout/dropped ball.

Neither approach really worked in the end

No they definitely didn't work to well, but it was much more of a patch job then a plan when they started having players come back onto the ball.

The big issue for mine is that we've found ourselves in a position where the 10 is receiving more contestable kicks than anyone else in defence, despite that not ever really being a core skill we select them on or develop in them the whole way through. Either we need to significantly change what it is we look for and value in a 10 (untenable in the short, and maybe even medium term for mine) or change our structures so that we can get our best players at competing in those situations (both in the air and on the ground immediately afterwards), taking those high balls most often.

 

[BDA]

I think you have to play CG in this game. I honestly just can't see us beating France or Ireland with Edmed at 10.

If CG plays the house down against Italy I'd be much more optimistic about our chances for the remainder of the tour.

Besides, even if he's shit there's enough quality in the team to get the win anyway.

 

[whitefalcon]

I think you have to play CG in this game. I honestly just can't see us beating France or Ireland with Edmed at 10.

If CG plays the house down against Italy I'd be much more optimistic about our chances for the remainder of the tour.

Besides, even if he's shit there's enough quality in the team to get the win anyway.

I reckon we will see
9. Lonergan
10. Edmed
12. Ikitau
22. J. Gordon
23. C. Gordon

With the intention of a bit of continuity between 9/10/12 to start with.

I would like to see C. Gordon get a start but I'm not sure if we will see that this match as well as giving J. Gordon a bit of a rest AND see Ikitau start (as he should) whilst keeping some connections/continuity

 

[HogansHeros]

I reckon we will see
9. Lonergan
10. Edmed
12. Ikitau
22. J. Gordon
23. C. Gordon

With the intention of a bit of continuity between 9/10/12 to start with.

I would like to see C. Gordon get a start but I'm not sure if we will see that this match as well as giving J. Gordon a bit of a rest AND see Ikitau start (as he should) whilst keeping some connections/continuity

Who kicks when Lonergan and Edmed both come off? JAS?