Wallabies v Lions Game 2 MCG 26 July

[Linerunner2023]

Perhaps in terms of performance so far. Certainly not when it comes to personnel. You’ve got the nucleus + coach of an Irish side that’s been the most consistent performing team over the last 5 years. A few very good English players and a Scottish 10 that has been in sublime form in Europe. I think we’re quick to forget their bench players would probably start in our 15. Yes, a very disappointing result. But it’s got to be kept in perspective.

Was and very little wales players which doesn’t help them
Allthough even form Irish fans they have peaked and fallen back in the last year or two! Finished 3rd in 6 nations behind England. Tuipulotu and Duhan the winger are better then Aki and Lowe
They have some decent Personel however both games I don’t think they beat the boks and ABs and would be down 0-2

 

[KOB1987]

We keep telling ourselves it takes so long to improve, but I don’t think it does. England post 2015 World Cup debacle became one of if not the best team in the World 12 months later, and the Springboks lost 57-0 to NZ 18 months before they won the World Cup

It comes down to the cattle, both England and South Africa had serious depth of talent at those times, and England in particular just needed to bring the next lot through instead of trying to conquer the universe with players like Sam Burgess. We had our own example of that in 1997 (yeah I know, that's real old school stuff) when we got flogged 60 something by South Africa and then won the World Cup in 1999. Point is, we don't have the depth and that's where we need to be spending the money - getting more kids playing rugby, keeping them, and then developing them, and that all takes time. I'm not opposed to using some of the money to get a sugar hit in 2027 as we need to at least be in the semis of the world cup - whether that be a couple of well targeted leaguies (e.g. getting Marky Mark (Nawaqanitawase) back), or bringing some of our offshore players back home.

 

[Omar Comin']

Any ramifications if World Rugby go onto clarify it should have been a penalty at the end, given the enormous consequences? The ref justifed it as a dynamic incident (and therefore ignoring the head/neck contact) because both players 'arrived at the same time.' Which, as Joe Schmidt said is blatantly false. It's amazing after being so slow with so many other TMO decisions that they rushed this one. Tizzano was there first, on his feet, hands on the ball, then gets cleaned out illegally, with the first contact to the head.

I suggest, given the circumstances there should be a significant cash bonus, and some sort of prize to the team that wins on aggregate over the 3 games. We could revive the Tom Richards Cup for this purpose. Obviously any points from tries that World Rugby clarify should not have been awarded will need to be taken off this score. That will leave the Lions ahead by 6 on aggregate going into the final game (unless their first try is subsequently deemed illegal too).

So everything to play for in Sydney!! The Lions have their hands on the tainted 'Lions Series Trophy,' but who will win the moral victory, and the prestigious Tom Richards Cup?

 

[KOB1987]

Also I just joined Wallaby First, which for this year is basically just a $100 donation.

 

[PhilClinton]

Point is, we don't have the depth and that's where we need to be spending the money - getting more kids playing rugby, keeping them, and then developing them, and that all takes time. I'm not opposed to using some of the money to get a sugar hit in 2027 as we need to at least be in the semis of the world cup - whether that be a couple of well targeted leaguies (e.g. getting Marky Mark (Nawaqanitawase) (Nawaqanitawase) back), or bringing some of our offshore players back home.

The ship has sailed unfortunately in terms of making rugby a top tier sport again and getting that depth and talent away from our competition. The NRL and AFL aren’t sitting on their hands, even if we really push to build that depth, they’ll be looking to counter us. Exhibit A - Perth Bears.

Im not saying this as an overreaction to last night either - it’s just the reality the Australian sporting landscape. The rest of the world don’t see Australian rugby in the same light as South Africa, NZ, dare I say even England these days.

Look at the timeline of Lions tours and the expectations:

2001 - we were world champs and probably expected to win that series (we did)
2013 - it had been a difficult couple of years but we had good young talent but were expected to lose (we lost)
2025 - almost everyone in the world thought we’d get flogged by 50 each game. Wasn’t that bad but we have still lost the series.

The trend is an ongoing decline unfortunately.

 

[Yoda]

Wallabies will definitely not want Lions to win 3 nil. Test is still a chance to salvage some pride. Lions will not be gifting them anything so a victory by Australia will be great. Go get 'em boys.

 

[drewprint]

There’s two seperate questions here I feel:

Should that be a penalty? Maybe not, visually a fairly innocuous rugby incident that Tizzano did ham up.

Is it a penalty? Absolutely yes, as defined by the framework and every game of rugby we’ve seen for the last few years where this gets pinged.

As always it’s the inconsistency that’s the killer. And we’ve been burned. Again. I’m just sick of it.

None of this excuses that we let a golden lead slip. Two things can be true at the same time: we blew the lead, but the ref bottles the final penalty.

 

[KOB1987]

The ship has sailed unfortunately in terms of making rugby a top tier sport again and getting that depth and talent away from our competition. The NRL and AFL aren’t sitting on their hands, even if we really push to build that depth, they’ll be looking to counter us. Exhibit A - Perth Bears.

Im not saying this as an overreaction to last night either - it’s just the reality the Australian sporting landscape. The rest of the world don’t see Australian rugby in the same light as South Africa, NZ, dare I say even England these days.

Look at the timeline of Lions tours and the expectations:

2001 - we were world champs and probably expected to win that series (we did)
2013 - it had been a difficult couple of years but we had good young talent but were expected to lose (we lost)
2025 - almost everyone in the world thought we’d get flogged by 50 each game. Wasn’t that bad but we have still lost the series.

The trend is an ongoing decline unfortunately.

Rugby has always been a niche sport in this country. We don't need to try to retain/recruit every top junior in the country, what we need to do is provide a better pathway that has more players earning money from it sooner, and more of it.

 

[Strewthcobber]

There’s two seperate questions here I feel:

Should that be a penalty? Maybe not, visually a fairly innocuous rugby incident that Tizzano did ham up.

Is it a penalty? Absolutely yes, as defined by the framework and every game of rugby we’ve seen for the last few years where this gets pinged.

As always it’s the inconsistency that’s the killer. And we’ve been burned. Again. I’m just sick of it.

None of this excuses that we let a golden lead slip. Two things can be true at the same time: we blew the lead, but the ref bottles the final penalty.

Just to complicate the answers, I reckon we would see head/neck contact on jacklers at 20 breakdowns if we slowed each down and looked for it, and that incident is probably only looked at because of Tizzano's reaction.

 

[Giulia]

Also, I don’t really think there is such a thing as a dead rubber in a Lions series, look at the passion from supporters in the tour games.

Lions supporters will be blind drunk for their last weekend in Australia. Sydney Wallabies supporters who didn't buy a ticket before the end of game 2 will watch on TV or not at all.

 

[Sir Arthur Higgins]

Lynagh missing touch off a penalty kick some 5 minutes from full time a big miss. Nothing really said? Lolesio or Donaldson do that and they would be crucified! Gifting the Lions possession. Aus win that line out and possibly the match.

I think I said we need a better 10 in general

 

[molman]

I think I said we need a better 10 in general

There were a number of moments in that last 10mins where we didn't manage things well. The maul off the lineout that we got held up in. We should have been down the other end of the field not allowing another scrum which was creaking for us.

 

[molman]

Much as it sucks, we need to give the Lions a bit of credit here.

Lineout 51m out, 13 phases, 26 passes and 2 mins later they score. It's one of the all-timers.

Frost with the critical miss on Aki (it was a tired attempt, and he knew instantly that it was a big problem). 11 tackles and 9 carries for Frost. No wonder he was tired

Not to mention the majority of lineouts going to him. He looked spent tbh.

 

[Sir Arthur Higgins]

Lions supporters will be blind drunk for their last weekend in Australia. Sydney Wallabies supporters who didn't buy a ticket before the end of game 2 will watch on TV or not at all.

I’m 100% still going
Yea dissapointing but a great game of tier 1 rugby is still fantastic.

 

[Sir Arthur Higgins]

There were a number of moments in that last 10mins where we didn't manage things well. The maul off the lineout that we got held up in. We should have been down the other end of the field not allowing another scrum which was creaking for us.

Ya some bad decisions crept in. Tired. Some young players out there realistically.
I’m feeling positive for RC and 2027.
We need some monsters back / kept tho as presumably Skelton not around in 2027. For guys like Harry Wilson who didn’t bust the gain line much, the delta to me between him and say bobb v who got mad yardage seemed to be the acceleration into contact and presumably the body positioning
As someone else noted Harry seems to be perhaps overly focused on ball retention and laying ball back and so loses power/speed in contact. Like he’s a big fucking unit so something not working v Valetini

 

[Giulia]

Results aside, where the fuck were all these passionate local rugby fans on Friday nights when it was the Rebels faithful and 1200 seagulls supporting top flight rugby?

Heaps of people won't support two rugby union teams when the Wallabies play 15 games a year. It'd be a similar story in the NRL if Origin went on that long and AFL if there were something above clubs.

 

[Dctarget]

Best 79 minutes of a rugby game I’ve been to.

Absolutely, utterly gutted.

But so proud of the team and Joe, who got so much more right than wrong. I was in the stands in Lyon against Wales two years ago so I’m not ready to say that Joe fucked his selections here. I think he pulled off a minor miracle. Also surprised that the call didn’t come in to the ref to level the series, coward. Hopefully Brett Robinson brings in relegation to 6N to punish the Italians.

That 2nd half, really that last 50 minutes we were at sea. Our only defense was keeping the ball off them. The result was inevitable if the game went for another 10.

Aussie Rugby has life in it yet. I hope all the tourists had a merry time, it’s been a pleasure and you’re welcome anytime. Enjoy the trip back to your sad, grim, little countries

Also the ‘G is kinda okay to watch rugby at?

 

[John S]

There’s two seperate questions here I feel:

Should that be a penalty? Maybe not, visually a fairly innocuous rugby incident that Tizzano did ham up.

Is it a penalty? Absolutely yes, as defined by the framework and every game of rugby we’ve seen for the last few years where this gets pinged.

As always it’s the inconsistency that’s the killer. And we’ve been burned. Again. I’m just sick of it.

None of this excuses that we let a golden lead slip. Two things can be true at the same time: we blew the lead, but the ref bottles the final penalty.

A lot of NH peanuts are saying Tizanos head below the hips, so Lions penalty anyway

 

[Major Tom]

Just to complicate the answers, I reckon we would see head/neck contact on jacklers at 20 breakdowns if we slowed each down and looked for it, and that incident is probably only looked at because of Tizzano's reaction.

Yeah a lot of times that jackler isn’t really on their feet though. For me it’s always been about penalising the player off or going off their feet. That’s what the ref needed to call last night. They basically just said it looked like an accident play on. Odd stuff.

 

[PhilClinton]

Rugby has always been a niche sport in this country. We don't need to try to retain/recruit every top junior in the country, what we need to do is provide a better pathway that has more players earning money from it sooner, and more of it.

Maybe it’s a geographic thing, but in the 2000s in Brisbane, the coolest thing you could do on a weekend was head out to club rugby or go and watch the Reds play at Ballymore or Suncorp.

During that time we recruited the most entertaining league players and they were excited to play rugby, they weren’t simply being overpaid. We were a front page sport.

Saying rugby has ALWAYS been a niche sport is a fallacy.