Waratahs 2010
- Thread starter fatprop
- Start date
- Status
Scarfman
Knitter of the Scarf
Yeah, I'm with Bruce and naza. I have never seen the evidence that Carter is too slow to adjust laterally in defence. The stats indicate the opposite, which puts the burden of proof onto the haters.
Mind you, NTA's stat would not be bizarre, but very useful. George Smith always missed a couple of tackles a game because he was doing 3 people's work. But that should be shown up in "tackles attempted" as Bruce indicates.
Peter Hewat was a pissweak tackler but excellent positionally. He deterred runners, rather than tackled them.
Mind you, NTA's stat would not be bizarre, but very useful. George Smith always missed a couple of tackles a game because he was doing 3 people's work. But that should be shown up in "tackles attempted" as Bruce indicates.
Peter Hewat was a pissweak tackler but excellent positionally. He deterred runners, rather than tackled them.
Biffo
Ken Catchpole (46)
Scarfman said:
I lean to the Bruce, Naza and Scarfie view. I have few worries about Carter at 13 defensively. I have many worries about him in attack - turning half breaks into full breaks and full breaks into tries doesn't strike me as his forte.
I confess outright that I have seen Carter only as 12 in S14 and have not seen him at all in club rugby. Notwithstanding that he may have been under certain instructions, the evidence of my eyes is not encouraging.
Bruce Ross
Ken Catchpole (46)
Lee Grant said:
You may or may not be surprised to know, Lee, that I agree that he does have a valid point. What I took issue with was not the sentiment but the dogmatic way it was expressed.
"Too slow defensively for 13."
"Carter does not have the LATERAL speed to play the defensive role in the 13 channel."
I happen to be convinced that he will handle defence at 13 as well as or better than any other Australian back, but that's my personal view based on observing a very large number of his games since he left school. But let's suspend judgement until he plays the position at Super level.
I also disagree with NTA's other dogmatic assertion that "he also does not have the straight line speed to capitalise on breaks," an opinion which seems to be endorsed by many posters. From my knowledge of his strength and sprint training in the off-season, I believe that he currently has more than adequate speed for the outside centre position. And in any case, if he is such a draft horse, how come he is consistently way out in front of anyone else on kick chases?
But again, let's see how he shapes up this season.
Bruce Ross
Ken Catchpole (46)
Biffo said:
There's an element of truth in that, Biffo. I remember last year thinking how much more potent his chases would have been with a couple of other backs trailling in pursuit. I really don't know what wingers think they are there for.
Scarfman said:
I think you might be pleasantly surprised this year, Scarfman. Not that I accept that he was slow last year, particularly if you make allowance for the amount of ground he covered during games and the energy he expended in breakdown situations.
Bruce Ross
Ken Catchpole (46)
You're not going to get me arguing against you on the issue of him being the sole chaser, Biffo. But I don't accept that his chases were in any way pedestrian.
Blue
Andrew Slack (58)
Carter at 13? Come on guys, I know Horne is injured but seriously?
At least now the wings will see some ball. Kurtley better get that cutout pass greased up.
If Carter put the same amount of energy into playing rugby as he does into chirping, pushing people after the whistle and generally acting the dickhead we may yet see a rugby player emerge. Until then he remains a pretender and lucky as anything to hold a S14 contract.
At least now the wings will see some ball. Kurtley better get that cutout pass greased up.
If Carter put the same amount of energy into playing rugby as he does into chirping, pushing people after the whistle and generally acting the dickhead we may yet see a rugby player emerge. Until then he remains a pretender and lucky as anything to hold a S14 contract.
Novocastrian
Herbert Moran (7)
Blue said:
It's the Fiji Warriors isn't it, development/'A' team same as the Tah's played last year in Newy.
Ash
Michael Lynagh (62)
Personally, I doubted that Carter had lateral defence good enough for the S14 and was a flat track bully two years ago. He proved me embarassingly wrong on the defence part - given some time to adjust defensively at the S14, one assumes he should make a good defensive 13. I also think that Carter's faster than he looks in a straight line, but he has below average acceleration (in stark contrast to a Mat Rogers, who had huge acceleration but low top end speed).
Perhaps with a bit more space Carter may find more of a gap or half gap. But so far, that's what he has lacked in the S14 - the ability to run a good line to find a gap / beat a man, and to put his outside man away (or really pass much at all). Carter at 13 wouldn't surprise me either way of the following: doing well enough with more space at 13 and pass more and find some gaps, or he could be a firewall again like Lee said.
With Horne still the serial crock, looks like Carter deserves a shot at 13. Wouldn't mind seeing Sidey get a chance as well, though.
Oh, and I agree with Blue - Carter should leave his ridiculous Monkey Magic try celebration and niggly behaviour behind. Looks silly on a 12.
I thought that the Fiji Warriors were a "barbarians" type side, with whatever Fijians they can find to play at the time...
Perhaps with a bit more space Carter may find more of a gap or half gap. But so far, that's what he has lacked in the S14 - the ability to run a good line to find a gap / beat a man, and to put his outside man away (or really pass much at all). Carter at 13 wouldn't surprise me either way of the following: doing well enough with more space at 13 and pass more and find some gaps, or he could be a firewall again like Lee said.
With Horne still the serial crock, looks like Carter deserves a shot at 13. Wouldn't mind seeing Sidey get a chance as well, though.
Oh, and I agree with Blue - Carter should leave his ridiculous Monkey Magic try celebration and niggly behaviour behind. Looks silly on a 12.
I thought that the Fiji Warriors were a "barbarians" type side, with whatever Fijians they can find to play at the time...
Spot on Ash. Carter is quick enough once going, but won't burn through a gap. And he is a twat. But for all that he makes the most of his abilities, and at least doesn't fall to bits 3 times a season. From what I've seen of him at S14 and club level, he defends fine. Remember, defense is a team thing, and it's as much about how he fits in the defensive plan and structure as anything.
- Status