Waratahs 2010
- Thread starter fatprop
- Start date
- Status
Lee Grant
John Eales (66)
Ishmael
Holmes has all the skills - always had, but they of too languid a nature. Until he is more alert around the scrum base and the ruck - his value as a 9 in pro rugby will be marginalised.
This year he needs to work on his sharpness and be more lickety-split.
He has disappointed me to date. When he was at school I picked him to be a Wallaby by now.
Holmes has all the skills - always had, but they of too languid a nature. Until he is more alert around the scrum base and the ruck - his value as a 9 in pro rugby will be marginalised.
This year he needs to work on his sharpness and be more lickety-split.
He has disappointed me to date. When he was at school I picked him to be a Wallaby by now.
Lee Grant
John Eales (66)
Junior Tahs 15 Australian Barbarians 5
For once the hard heads in the Sydney comp (the Barbarians) were beaten by the mostly younger guys.
Don't ask me why I went to Knox when it was pissing down with rain to watch this, but I did.
It was hard to recognise the players. I took my trusty list and most of the Tahs numbers were right but they all looked like wet dogs.
As for the Barbarians who I had no numbers listed for (and some of the numbers fell off their backs anyway): I couldn't even recognise the two Rats players unless they were close. Then I realised the players were wearing their club socks as the Baa-Baas always do, and it helped a bit. Then when you thought you had an idea - 5 players from each side would run on - and later some would come back.
At least another Rat, lock Chris Thomson, was easy to spot for the Tahs. He's the tallest guy in Oz rugby.
It was also hard to identify who played well throughout the game and sometimes it was the player who made the fewest mistakes who looked the most valuable. But Ed Gower playing 8 had a storming game for the Barbarians though dropping a couple of pills and Steve Brennan also looked strong. Terry Preston played fullback mostly and he was sound in the conditions, which pleased his parents sitting behind me.
The most memorable bit of play was when Tah lock Dylan Sigg picked up the ball 20 metres out and ran for the corner. The two tacklers coming across obviously didn't remember how fast he is and didn't get there on time. Try. Pencil this fellow's name in, S15 scouts guys.
Other players who were good for the Tahs were:
• 15. Adam D'Arcy didn't do anything flashy but played as though it was a dry night and looked class.
• 13. Cam Mitchell - good to see he's still healthy. If he keeps this standard up in this years Shute Shild he could find himself with a rookie contract somewhere next year. Tonight it looked like a Kings School reunion of the 2008 team as once Mitchell, Jelodudev, McDougall and Bennett were all on the park for the Junior Tahs at the same time.
• 7. Chris Alcock - it's the first time I've seen him play 7. He's supposed to be the backup for Waugh, and he went OK but that's about all.
• 10. Flyhalves Ben Seymour and Harry Bennett both played well in the conditions.
That is all. You had to be there. On second thoughts: no you didn't.
For once the hard heads in the Sydney comp (the Barbarians) were beaten by the mostly younger guys.
Don't ask me why I went to Knox when it was pissing down with rain to watch this, but I did.
It was hard to recognise the players. I took my trusty list and most of the Tahs numbers were right but they all looked like wet dogs.
As for the Barbarians who I had no numbers listed for (and some of the numbers fell off their backs anyway): I couldn't even recognise the two Rats players unless they were close. Then I realised the players were wearing their club socks as the Baa-Baas always do, and it helped a bit. Then when you thought you had an idea - 5 players from each side would run on - and later some would come back.
At least another Rat, lock Chris Thomson, was easy to spot for the Tahs. He's the tallest guy in Oz rugby.
It was also hard to identify who played well throughout the game and sometimes it was the player who made the fewest mistakes who looked the most valuable. But Ed Gower playing 8 had a storming game for the Barbarians though dropping a couple of pills and Steve Brennan also looked strong. Terry Preston played fullback mostly and he was sound in the conditions, which pleased his parents sitting behind me.
The most memorable bit of play was when Tah lock Dylan Sigg picked up the ball 20 metres out and ran for the corner. The two tacklers coming across obviously didn't remember how fast he is and didn't get there on time. Try. Pencil this fellow's name in, S15 scouts guys.
Other players who were good for the Tahs were:
• 15. Adam D'Arcy didn't do anything flashy but played as though it was a dry night and looked class.
• 13. Cam Mitchell - good to see he's still healthy. If he keeps this standard up in this years Shute Shild he could find himself with a rookie contract somewhere next year. Tonight it looked like a Kings School reunion of the 2008 team as once Mitchell, Jelodudev, McDougall and Bennett were all on the park for the Junior Tahs at the same time.
• 7. Chris Alcock - it's the first time I've seen him play 7. He's supposed to be the backup for Waugh, and he went OK but that's about all.
• 10. Flyhalves Ben Seymour and Harry Bennett both played well in the conditions.
That is all. You had to be there. On second thoughts: no you didn't.
W
waratahs_2010
Guest
Lee Grant said:
Cameron Mitchell has a heap of potential. If he can stay away from injuries, he should come good soon. Also Tim Bennetts is another player to keep an eye on. He went very well in his appearances in the Shute Shield for Eastwood. Although out of the Eastwood young guns, Locky McCaffrey is the one I will tip to go on and play a fair bit of S14 at some stage during his career. He is a great player and is tough as nails.
Hopefully they will look like this
1 Robinson
2 Nau
3 Baxter
4 Douglas
5 Mumm
6 Mowen
7 Waugh
8 Palu
9 Burgess
10 Barnes
11 Turner
12 Beale
13 Carter
14 Betham (would be my choice, but Nadolo)
15 Anesi
16 Frieir
17 Palmer
18 Jowitt
19 Dennis
20 Holmes
21 Hangers
22 Sidey
Lee Grant
John Eales (66)
fatprop
4. Douglas - it would be a big step for the young bloke. I spoke to one of the Tahs officials on Thursday and he said they have huge wraps on him after his trials in Lismore and Orange. He didn't take my eye in the Canberra match as much as Jowitt, but that probably says more about my watching than his playing.
Chris Thomson seems to be falling away, yet it is he that has the S14 contract and Douglas an Academy contract. That will change next year methinks. Then the Tahs should have a lock stable of a healthy Caldwell, Mumm, Jowitt and Douglas, with ace 2009 Oz Schools lock Peterson (now in the pro Academy) having a year of rugby (hopefully with a bit of grade) by then. Useful.
11. Turner hasn't got a lot of good press from the trials and looked listless to me in Canberra; but he'd have to be in, wouldn't he?
13. Carter didn't look like a 13 defensively on Thursday night (not reading the play) and the Tahs were a tad lucky that the Brumbies dropped the ball so much out wider. He is a good chaser of the pill though, as BR points out and this attribute is becoming more important in the modern game. It's a pity that Anesi didn't trial once at 13 as he seems to be a man for all seasons - all rather, all positions from about 13 back.
14. Betham will probably not be picked for budgetary reasons as he is not on the payroll now, but based on that one half of play on Thursday night he should walk into the team. I don't know that S14 teams can employ somebody on a match payment system to see how they go. Nadolo was surprisingly competent at Viking Park - and looked trim by his standards. If he plays, Turinui will be contributing some Randwick inside info on the big fella and the Reds will kick behind him and turn him around.
16. Freier must be injured as he hasn't featured in the trials; if so Fitzy will be on the bench.
17. Palmer - Kepu will probably get the nod. Fat Cat and Baxter are specialists in their LHP and THP spots. People could argue that they have seen Baxter play LHP and so have I, but it was with no great distinction. Hickey will no doubt rotate the 4 props throughout the season and ignore Tilse. Kepu is key to that scenario.
PS - anybody know the whereabouts - or fitness situation of Ed Jenkins and Tim Bennetts from the Tahs pro JW group? I know Ed was chosen in the greater Oz 7s squad, but he wasn't used. If he wasn't needed for tournaments you'd think he should have been trialling.
4. Douglas - it would be a big step for the young bloke. I spoke to one of the Tahs officials on Thursday and he said they have huge wraps on him after his trials in Lismore and Orange. He didn't take my eye in the Canberra match as much as Jowitt, but that probably says more about my watching than his playing.
Chris Thomson seems to be falling away, yet it is he that has the S14 contract and Douglas an Academy contract. That will change next year methinks. Then the Tahs should have a lock stable of a healthy Caldwell, Mumm, Jowitt and Douglas, with ace 2009 Oz Schools lock Peterson (now in the pro Academy) having a year of rugby (hopefully with a bit of grade) by then. Useful.
11. Turner hasn't got a lot of good press from the trials and looked listless to me in Canberra; but he'd have to be in, wouldn't he?
13. Carter didn't look like a 13 defensively on Thursday night (not reading the play) and the Tahs were a tad lucky that the Brumbies dropped the ball so much out wider. He is a good chaser of the pill though, as BR points out and this attribute is becoming more important in the modern game. It's a pity that Anesi didn't trial once at 13 as he seems to be a man for all seasons - all rather, all positions from about 13 back.
14. Betham will probably not be picked for budgetary reasons as he is not on the payroll now, but based on that one half of play on Thursday night he should walk into the team. I don't know that S14 teams can employ somebody on a match payment system to see how they go. Nadolo was surprisingly competent at Viking Park - and looked trim by his standards. If he plays, Turinui will be contributing some Randwick inside info on the big fella and the Reds will kick behind him and turn him around.
16. Freier must be injured as he hasn't featured in the trials; if so Fitzy will be on the bench.
17. Palmer - Kepu will probably get the nod. Fat Cat and Baxter are specialists in their LHP and THP spots. People could argue that they have seen Baxter play LHP and so have I, but it was with no great distinction. Hickey will no doubt rotate the 4 props throughout the season and ignore Tilse. Kepu is key to that scenario.
PS - anybody know the whereabouts - or fitness situation of Ed Jenkins and Tim Bennetts from the Tahs pro JW group? I know Ed was chosen in the greater Oz 7s squad, but he wasn't used. If he wasn't needed for tournaments you'd think he should have been trialling.
Lee Grant
John Eales (66)
Recognised Turner - his pass is hard to miss - but some of them were off target and didn't think otherwise he was good as they said. Didn't recognise Jones and thought the only good running lock on the night was Dylan Sigg for the Tahs, but it probably says more about me than the players.
Haven't seen A-N since his school days; so I would have missed him.
Haven't seen A-N since his school days; so I would have missed him.
Bruce Ross
Ken Catchpole (46)
Today's Australian carries a most extraordinary article by Bret Harris titled "Waratahs to try Phil Waugh at No 8".
Apparently coach Chris Hickey proposes switching positions in the scrum between Phil Waugh and Wycliff Palu "in different situations on the field." Fair enough, but it is his justification for doing so that casts grave doubt on his fitness to be coaching the team I support:
"Sometimes you actually get away from eight because you are not pushing, whereas when you are on the side of the scrum your first job is to push."
Please tell me he didn’t say that. Or at least that his scrum coach Michael Foley doesn’t subscribe to such nonsense.
At eight "you are not pushing"?? No wonder Australian scrums have been such a laughing stock if the 8 is told not to bother pushing. The ‘Tahs finally get a dominant scrum and the coach wants to depower it.
Who is supposed to maintain the shape of the scrum and control the wheeling tendency if the bloke at the back is just leaning on the scrum, Jone Tawake style?
"On the side of the scrum your first job is to push." Does anyone at the ‘Tahs know the first thing about biomechanics and the application of force? On the side you are pushing with one shoulder from a body position where you cannot possibly deliver effective force straight ahead. Compare that to the 8 where both shoulders are engaged and the natural force direction is through the centre line of the scrum. Think barbell squat.
Hickey then goes on to say: "Playing the seven in the No 8 position can release him quicker. He (Waugh) loves to get his hands on the ball. It suits him." But even if this were true, the only way that Waugh could get to the ball carrier quicker from 8 than from 7 is if he is defending behind the advantage line.
Apparently coach Chris Hickey proposes switching positions in the scrum between Phil Waugh and Wycliff Palu "in different situations on the field." Fair enough, but it is his justification for doing so that casts grave doubt on his fitness to be coaching the team I support:
"Sometimes you actually get away from eight because you are not pushing, whereas when you are on the side of the scrum your first job is to push."
Please tell me he didn’t say that. Or at least that his scrum coach Michael Foley doesn’t subscribe to such nonsense.
At eight "you are not pushing"?? No wonder Australian scrums have been such a laughing stock if the 8 is told not to bother pushing. The ‘Tahs finally get a dominant scrum and the coach wants to depower it.
Who is supposed to maintain the shape of the scrum and control the wheeling tendency if the bloke at the back is just leaning on the scrum, Jone Tawake style?
"On the side of the scrum your first job is to push." Does anyone at the ‘Tahs know the first thing about biomechanics and the application of force? On the side you are pushing with one shoulder from a body position where you cannot possibly deliver effective force straight ahead. Compare that to the 8 where both shoulders are engaged and the natural force direction is through the centre line of the scrum. Think barbell squat.
Hickey then goes on to say: "Playing the seven in the No 8 position can release him quicker. He (Waugh) loves to get his hands on the ball. It suits him." But even if this were true, the only way that Waugh could get to the ball carrier quicker from 8 than from 7 is if he is defending behind the advantage line.
Scarfman
Knitter of the Scarf
Bruce Ross said:
They have ben playing Waugh at 8 for ages. And while I can see what you are saying, the world didn't collapse on any occasion.
This is exactly why I wanted the stupid Waratards to keep Beau Robinson. He replaces Waugh, Waugh replaces Palu, who is a 50 minute player anyway.
This makes me mad, but not for the same reasons as you, Bruce.
Bruce Ross
Ken Catchpole (46)
Scarfman said:
As you probably noted, Scarfman, I said in relation to the plan to switch, "Fair enough". What I was attacking was Hickey's reasoning for doing it.
The Australian disrespect for forceful scrummaging and seeming lack of understanding of the biomechanics involved exposes us to ridicule internationally.
Bruce Ross said:
This is one of those "it depends" moments, it isn't going to happen if the on an attacking scrum if we are under the pump all game.
But if we are rolling along comfortably on our ball, the backrowers have mentally detached after the hit and feed anyway unless the call is for a big push and it would be nice to see Waugh take it off the back and pop an inside ball to Palu, then some quick ball spread to the backs.
Lee Grant
John Eales (66)
Here we go again - talking about what people are talking about - and talking about what people talked about what was talked about.
Some people love pre-season comments but they are the same folks who examine tea leaves.
Steady on LG - we have to talk about something - and why not about what a coach said?
As you were then.
Come to think of it - if Foley had made the remarks you'd have to take it seriously and I might have mentioned a few things myself.
Some people love pre-season comments but they are the same folks who examine tea leaves.
Steady on LG - we have to talk about something - and why not about what a coach said?
As you were then.
Come to think of it - if Foley had made the remarks you'd have to take it seriously and I might have mentioned a few things myself.
Lee Grant
John Eales (66)
The Tahs are going to have to score a few tries this year. They were one short last year to make the finals and have not hired an elite goal kicker - not that there were a lot available.
Whilst fullback Adam D'Arcy is not proven in the Super14 obviously, a conversion from touch for the Junior Waratahs in the pouring rain on Saturday night brought me back to the Tahs goal kicking predicament. If Ansei or a winger goes down during the season, don't be surprised if D'Arcy gets a gig, at least from the bench.
Whilst fullback Adam D'Arcy is not proven in the Super14 obviously, a conversion from touch for the Junior Waratahs in the pouring rain on Saturday night brought me back to the Tahs goal kicking predicament. If Ansei or a winger goes down during the season, don't be surprised if D'Arcy gets a gig, at least from the bench.
Bruce Ross
Ken Catchpole (46)
Lee Grant said:
Settle, Lee. You were obviously feeling left out because this particular discussion gave you no opportunity to display your encyclopaedic knowledge of every rugby player who ever laced a boot on.
- Status