Waratahs vs Sharks - RD5 2012

[qwerty51]

I wouldn't be surprised if he's cited.

 

[Badger]

Good effort by the Tahs. Not perfect, but better than what was dished up by the team last week. Credit to the Sharks as both teams came to play a more open game. A few more efforts like that and the bigger crowds may return. Hope the Tahs keep the ball in hand more often like they did in this match. Had my heart in my mouth when Barnes fielded the kick deep in the Tahs 22 with a few minutes to go thinking he would kick back. Instead, was happy/relieved etc that he did a Cooper-like jink and kept it in hand and then after a couple of phases later Mumm had taken the ball deep into the Sharks 22. Looking forward to the Chiefs match to see if this continues or is an aberration.

The beer queues seems to be an SFS issue as there doesn't appear to be an issue when you line up at the SCG. A good reason not to buy beers at the SFS as you miss large chunks of the game.

When is the next arvo game!? Great to finally see the Tahs win a tight one, they finally looked like they were playing for something!

The Tahs play the Crusaders on Sunday April 29 at 4:10pm. The later start could qualify it for a Twilight game as Daylight Saving is over by then. Once Daylight Saving is over, a 3:10pm start may be better for afternoon matches.

 

[Lee Grant]

It was good to be at the ground to see the Tahs win a close one for a change. The Tahs did some good things but they were their own worst enemies sometimes.

Some thoughts in no particular order:

• During the week I was going to mention that I didn't think much of McKibbin's short performances to date and I was going to question his selection in the run-on team. Just as well I didn't: I've seen him play well a lot in the Shute Shield but to see him do so at the Super level of rugby was a pleasant surprise. He got to just about to every ruck in good time and I can't recall too many boo-boos apart from a decision to use the blind side once too often, with AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper), and the odd crook kick. It's good to see that the Tahs have another good goal kicker in the side. The Tahs goal kicking at 77% in the season to date is better than in some recent years.

• Tom Carter's enthusiasm infected the Tahs like the swine flu; he was just the kind of guy needed when things went wrong for the team in the game, and they did. He has been sorely missed. On the other hand Robbie Horne has lost his mojo and also is giving away penalties with the best of them. He won't be on the Deans' list on current form.

• The Tahs were bloody lucky not to suffer a yellow card for repeated infringements defending their goal line and before that, not to concede a penalty try when Foley interrupted a pass from an offside position. Sharks' coach Plumtree expressed a gentlemanly regret about the matter after the game; mind you the Sharks were also lucky not to earn a card later on for an egregious offside incident near their goal line.

• The Tahs did well with their big ball runners Palu, TPN, Douglas and Dennis, whereas you could see that the Sharks missed their injured big boppers: Beast, Deysel and Kankowski, especially in the last quarter. Bismark, Lambie and scrummie McLeod had top games for the Sharks and it was a pleasure to see young gun flanker Marcell Coetzee at the ground for the first time. He's a keeper.

• The Sharks started well and for a time it looked like the 1sts versus the 2nds as their backs exploded onto the ball thrown just in front of them. The Tahs started their runs from too deep and by the time they had reached their tacklers, who were waiting patiently for them, they had fooled nobody. Eventually the effects of travel to Sydney seemed to affect the Sharks and this was about the same time as the Tahs bench was lifting its team. It was a close run thing, but in the end it was probably the missed tackle count of 30+ for the Sharks that was the difference.

• When I was having a leak after the Force game last week one of the guys there said to a mate that he regretted bringing his kids to watch "that crock of shit" though he didn't care too much about who won the game. There wouldn't have been too many complaints about the match today. It was good running rugby with the odd kick into the sun to force a mistake; so let's not talk about a few silly kicks by the Tahs towards the end of the game and spoil a good story.
.

 

[qwerty51]

Top post LG as always. The maul defence desperately needs work on as well. Any clue what's going on there?

Thought Maloney did another good job commentating, like to hear more of him.

 

[Newter]

The Spear-Fend!

(thanks Akkerman on PR)

The tackler has made a weak player look good. Why jump into the waiting fend when a good ankle-chopper would have done the trick?

 

[Hawko]

Well, the Tahs just beat the team that beat the 2011 champions convincingly last week. Took a four try bonus point in the process that will come in very handy later. Not a perfect performance and there are a lot of things that need to improve, but like in the Highlanders and Reds games there was also a lot to like. They won too.

The best thing though is that for at least a week I won't hear any more carping criticism of how awful the Tahs are, how bad their kicking is, how Tom Carter is worse than the U-13 centre for Kuringai, how Dean Mumm is useless in contact and how McKibben is totally clueless and a waste of space! Blessed relief.

There are a few people who should be eating their words right now. I don't include Growden in that list, he lives in another reality. But I look forward to Paul Cully admitting in print that his diatribe after the 90 point loss to the Force was just slightly over the top. I hope Spiro enjoyed the game but somehow I think not. He's only happy when the Tahs are losing so he can write negative stuff about them.

 

[Lee Grant]

The maul defence desperately needs work on as well. Any clue what's going on there?

Thought Maloney did another good job commentating, like to hear more of him.

Good point about the maul defence: the Sharks' try from one of them was embarrassingly easy. The Tahs don't seem to be able to align themselves, ant-like - as though of one mind - directly against the line of force of the maul, let alone deal with a change in the line of force. The Sharks fell over to score that try because there was nobody there to hold them up.

I wonder what the Tribe will do next week: go for 3 points or try the 5 metre lineout?

I've just watched my recording of the game. Can't say that I enjoy Maloney as much as you do; I know the players better than he does and he has a bloody annoying voice. Still, he was better than at Canberra a couple of weeks ago

 

[Lee Grant]

The tackler has made a weak player look good. Why jump into the waiting fend when a good ankle-chopper would have done the trick?

Correct, but the fend will be on Waratahs' promos for decades to come, nevertheless. Maybe they can get the AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) tumble on the same promo - "Don't sit on the fence" or "I'm head over heels for the Tahs."

Marcell Coetzee will learn from that mistake. He's only 20 but a future Bok in my book, and if he is smart he will learn the lesson you mentioned..

 

[Richo]

It's getting to the point that I rarely drink at the game. I was in the queue for just under 20 minutes and there were not that many in the queue. I dont buy a ticket to miss the game waiting in queues. It takes less than 2 minutes to get food, but way too long for alcohol.

I asked one of the bar managers why they only had half the tills open at all the bars and he said, quote, "we don't have enough trained staff." when I suggested that wasn't the problem of anyone paying $50 a ticket, he said that they'd had a lot of staff no shows. I then asked him why it was that only half the tills were open at every bar I'd tried to go to... But he was gone. Is the plan to punish us for attending an unpopular game? Don't think I've ever questioned my membership more than the 20 mins I spent in the bar queue as the second half played on...

 

[Richo]

All that said; what a cracker! C'arn the Tahs!

 

[kiap]

I'm sure Paul Cully will write some positives this week, Hawko. Wouldn't hold your beath hoping for any retraction, though. And why should he? His article last week was on the money.

In the same way that a disappointing loss on it's own hasn't killed the season, an encouraging win on it's own hasn't made the season. The point that was made is not wiped away in one game. Don't discount the notion, either, that candid spurs like these are a part of getting things back on track.

Cully was looking for the Waratahs freshen up their stale game. But, as his parting words showed, he hadn't actually written them off.

"... the Waratahs aren't dead, this season or beyond, they've just had their eyes closed."

 

[Piglet]

That was highly entertaining in perfect weather. Should be more of this Saturday afternoon rugby stuff...

This. Absolutely agree. I went to the Force game last week and, in hindsight, it would have been much nicer going to this one, especially with a 2 year old in tow and getting home well after her bed time.

It's going to be harder taking the little one to games in Winter. More afternoon games!

 

[Hawko]

It was good to be at the ground to see the Tahs win a close one for a change. The Tahs did some good things but they were their own worst enemies sometimes.

Some thoughts in no particular order:

• During the week I was going to mention that I didn't think much of McKibbin's short performances to date and I was going to question his selection in the run-on team. Just as well I didn't: I've seen him play well a lot in the Shute Shield but to see him do so at the Super level of rugby was a pleasant surprise. He got to just about to every ruck in good time and I can't recall too many boo-boos apart from a decision to use the blind side once too often, with AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper), and the odd crook kick. It's good to see that the Tahs have another good goal kicker in the side. The Tahs goal kicking at 77% in the season to date is better than in some recent years.

• Tom Carter's enthusiasm infected the Tahs like the swine flu; he was just the kind of guy needed when things went wrong for the team in the game, and they did. He has been sorely missed. On the other hand Robbie Horne has lost his mojo and also is giving away penalties with the best of them. He won't be on the Deans' list on current form.

• The Tahs were bloody lucky not to suffer a yellow card for repeated infringements defending their goal line and before that, not to concede a penalty try when Foley interrupted a pass from an offside position. Sharks' coach Plumtree expressed a gentlemanly regret about the matter after the game; mind you the Sharks were also lucky not to earn a card later on for an egregious offside incident near their goal line.

• The Tahs did well with their big ball runners Palu, TPN, Douglas and Dennis, whereas you could see that the Sharks missed their injured big boppers: Beast, Deysel and Kankowski, especially in the last quarter. Bismark, Lambie and scrummie McLeod had top games for the Sharks and it was a pleasure to see young gun flanker Marcell Coetzee at the ground for the first time. He's a keeper.

• The Sharks started well and for a time it looked like the 1sts versus the 2nds as their backs exploded onto the ball thrown just in front of them. The Tahs started their runs from too deep and by the time they had reached their tacklers, who were waiting patiently for them, they had fooled nobody. Eventually the effects of travel to Sydney seemed to affect the Sharks and this was about the same time as the Tahs bench was lifting its team. It was a close run thing, but in the end it was probably the missed tackle count of 30+ for the Sharks that was the difference.

• When I was having a leak after the Force game last week one of the guys there said to a mate that he regretted bringing his kids to watch "that crock of shit" though he didn't care too much about who won the game. There wouldn't have been too many complaints about the match today. It was good running rugby with the odd kick into the sun to force a mistake; so let's not talk about a few silly kicks by the Tahs towards the end of the game and spoil a good story.
.

Some further thoughts on your thoughts:

1. I have always liked McKibbens work and I struggled to see why he was given so few chances. From today's game I conclude that McKibben is definitely Super grade, you could quibble with a few of his decisions but for a first start it was an excellent performance and I don't think Pretorius's last game against the Force was in any way better than McKibben's tonight. Although Pretorius is our number one half I would have no qualms about McKibben starting again, he could do with a couple of runs to help him settle in.
2. Carter played really well to go along with the morale uplift he always gives the team. He continues to improve his game and some of the things he did tonight he just cannot do according to the critics. But they'll never admit it. Horne on the other hand has lost his mojo. As soon as Pakalani comes good (surely that must be soon) Kingston should be moved in and Horne given a chance to find his form from the bench.
3. The Sharks got plenty of help from the referee too, particularly as Pollock could only see Tahs players offending in the rucks. The Sharks never once missed the gate when entering, even when they came in from oblique angles. Overall I thought that it all evened out. The Tahs do not seem to get any home ground advantage as other teams seem to do.
4. While the Sharks missed Deysel and Kankowski, the Tahs would love to have Vickerman and Elsom in the line-up, so I think the losses even out. And Mitchell would be carving it up out wide, he would have given Nduganie nightmares. And if Deysel, Kankowski and Alberts are in then Coetzee has to be out. He really impressed me, despite his self-inflicted spear tackle, he was very good.
5. My first impression of the game was that the Tahs got closer to the gain line (flatter if you like) as the game progressed but I want to watch the game again to confirm that. The backline is certainly well off the place I would like it to be but its only round five and I have faith that Gaffney will, over time, get them playing better systems. The passing at first looked to be "to the man" but it seemed to improve as the game went on. And the passing and handling did seem to be better when players had less time and did it on instinct. Lots of improvement to come though.
6. Yes, the Sharks tired but I think that was a function of how the Tahs played too. The Sharks started very physically because everyone "knows" the Tahs pack are hard to overcome. Maybe they just burnt too much petrol in the first quarter and got real low at the end. The Tahs were very committed tonight and didn't drop their heads when the Sharks scored, just reloaded and went again.
7. I liked the way Barnes used the All Black flat restart kick rather than the hanger. A couple of times it worked a treat.
8. Three years ago teams avoided lineouts and mauls when playing the Tahs. We need to get that fear back again, we seem to have little idea on the other team's throw and we have totally forgotten how to defend the rolling maul. Where are the old gamebooks? We need to dust them off and go back to playing them with aggression.
9. Next week the Chiefs will be fresh and rested after their bye. They are looking way better in the flesh than they looked on paper before the start of the season. Their forwards are no pushovers, their scrum taught the Saders a lesson. It will be a step up from this week right across the park. But we won't be disgraced. Tonight looked good, with improvement to come.

 

[MrMouse]

Unfortunately it might stop Mumm getting dropped because I thought he was crap up until that. He's giving away way too many penalties.

I actually thought (live) that Mumm had his best game in years, and that he and Douglas did a lot of really good work at the breakdown, particularly clearing out effectively with low body height, intensity and plenty of oomph.

I also thought the Timani boys were fantastic off the bench, but Sitaleki is some way off being fit enough to start.

 

[MrMouse]

Some further thoughts on your thoughts:

1. I have always liked McKibbens work and I struggled to see why he was given so few chances. From today's game I conclude that McKibben is definitely Super grade, you could quibble with a few of his decisions but for a first start it was an excellent performance and I don't think Pretorius's last game against the Force was in any way better than McKibben's tonight. Although Pretorius is our number one half I would have no qualms about McKibben starting again, he could do with a couple of runs to help him settle in.
2. Carter played really well to go along with the morale uplift he always gives the team. He continues to improve his game and some of the things he did tonight he just cannot do according to the critics. But they'll never admit it. Horne on the other hand has lost his mojo. As soon as Pakalani comes good (surely that must be soon) Kingston should be moved in and Horne given a chance to find his form from the bench.
3. The Sharks got plenty of help from the referee too, particularly as Pollock could only see Tahs players offending in the rucks. The Sharks never once missed the gate when entering, even when they came in from oblique angles. Overall I thought that it all evened out. The Tahs do not seem to get any home ground advantage as other teams seem to do.
4. While the Sharks missed Deysel and Kankowski, the Tahs would love to have Vickerman and Elsom in the line-up, so I think the losses even out. And Mitchell would be carving it up out wide, he would have given Nduganie nightmares. And if Deysel, Kankowski and Alberts are in then Coetzee has to be out. He really impressed me, despite his self-inflicted spear tackle, he was very good.
5. My first impression of the game was that the Tahs got closer to the gain line (flatter if you like) as the game progressed but I want to watch the game again to confirm that. The backline is certainly well off the place I would like it to be but its only round five and I have faith that Gaffney will, over time, get them playing better systems. The passing at first looked to be "to the man" but it seemed to improve as the game went on. And the passing and handling did seem to be better when players had less time and did it on instinct. Lots of improvement to come though.
6. Yes, the Sharks tired but I think that was a function of how the Tahs played too. The Sharks started very physically because everyone "knows" the Tahs pack are hard to overcome. Maybe they just burnt too much petrol in the first quarter and got real low at the end. The Tahs were very committed tonight and didn't drop their heads when the Sharks scored, just reloaded and went again.
7. I liked the way Barnes used the All Black flat restart kick rather than the hanger. A couple of times it worked a treat.
8. Three years ago teams avoided lineouts and mauls when playing the Tahs. We need to get that fear back again, we seem to have little idea on the other team's throw and we have totally forgotten how to defend the rolling maul. Where are the old gamebooks? We need to dust them off and go back to playing them with aggression.
9. Next week the Chiefs will be fresh and rested after their bye. They are looking way better in the flesh than they looked on paper before the start of the season. Their forwards are no pushovers, their scrum taught the Saders a lesson. It will be a step up from this week right across the park. But we won't be disgraced. Tonight looked good, with improvement to come.

1. I, on the other hand, liked McKibben's work in Clubland but have thought his service was slow and sloppy, and decision making truly atrocious at Super level. Now, I must agree. Based on that game, he makes the grade and comfortably. His service was good, he went on some useful little runs (inc the try) and he was impeccable with the boot. He still had some brain fades, but not nearly as bad.
2. YES YES AND YES AGAIN
3. Agree, but don't understand why (other than the crowd's lack of vigor at times)
4. Fair
5. Yes! I thought we were way too flat at times, but still, we seemed to get the job done. Still much improvement to be had though.
6. Agree. When we dropped our heads/intensity was usually when WE scored!
7. Yeah, even Lamby started using it. It was great, but jeez Lamby's restarts were good. The kid can kick the ball a mile high and land it on a dime!
8. To be fair, the Sharks were very good on their maul ball but yes, I agree. What had me worried was that a couple of times, including leading up to Daniel's try, was that guys disengaging from the maul were walking around to re-engage. That kind of intensity in defence is lousy. I actually thought our defence was well down, but that probably contributed to the great spectacle.
9. Hmmm yeah, we'll need to step up again. This will be the real challenge, and I genuinely don't know if we're up to it or not. That is, repeat efforts. Hopefully some more honesty and a bit of positive feedback within the group will help...

 

[Nusadan]

Bit concerned about AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)'s performance of lately....he's not as robust or effective as he usually has been in the past...hope he gets over very soon his mental fugue over the recent break up with his girlfriend (if it is the case) who was the reason for his move to Sydney.

Perhaps spell him and Horne next match? Worked for Carter and to a lesser extent, McKibbin...

 

[Cave Dweller]

Really impressed with Coetzee. He has been very consistent for the sharks and is having a good season.
The Sharks had the better of the first half. They used the rolling maul effectively throughout the match as well as catch and drives. But as the jetlag kicked in the Sharks faded. Nice comeback by the Tah's. Mckibbin got another chance and he grabbed it with both hands.

 

[fatprop]

Good, but flawed effort by the Tahs

The support play is still pretty average but having Palu & the Timani brothers (and Tom Carter) added real threat/directnesses in attack and defence.

Last week with Barnes and Horne in the centres the only direction was lateral

Horne is really struggling at the moment, but apart from the penalties, he was better. I think he is lucky we are short of backs, if we had a few wingers he could be on the bench.

 

[cyclopath]

I agree with Mumm having a good game. It is easy to trot out the "Mumm was poor" comment of late, but he played well yesterday. I'd even forgive one of the penalties he gave away, as the ref kept yelling "Get out 6", when he was wearing 4.
Horne was unspectacular, but not poor. He still has defensive lapses with timing of rushing up, but this was less a problem with Carter next to him. He hit it up well enough, but I agree he has none of the spark to get through and offload that he has briefly shown before (in between injuries). Maybe he's still in shock at being "unbroken" for so many games.
The big boppers all added something - Timanis and Palu, which was good to see, because they seriously make a difference to the Tahs game plan when we crack the advantage line so much. Just look at Barnes to see how much better he got the attack going forward because of it. I just like Dennis more and more. May need a head transplant though.
And Carter. Back, annoying, yappy, getting it across the gain line (although not always), making tackles, scoring a try. It's games like that where his worth is clear.
Barnes - the commentators were a bit unfair early on, carping about him being too deep immediately after he had hit the line flat and fast and thrown a bullet to ? Horne. I sometimes wonder if they're watching the game, or a saved file. McKibben stood out for me as he almost always grabs the ball and PASSES THE FUCKING THING! No minuet, two-step or achy-breaky heart line dance across the field before releasing it.
The kicking - better, but still some poor ones. Chasing was improved, which can turn a poor kick into an OK one.
It was a cracker game against a good Sharks team, and I relished watching my replay last night.
IF the Tahs play at or near that intensity week-in, week-out, I'll be happy. Big if.

 

[wamberal]

Oh how I wish all games were played in the afternoon.