Where to for Twiggy Rugby?

[wamberal]

If it attracts an audience it is a good thing. Maybe it will, but I hae me doots.



Anyway, I do have an open mind. When you are my age, and have seen and done (and lived) as I have done, an open mind is a necessity.

 

[wamberal]

Really? in my 5 or so visits to Malaysia I have never seen any evidence of that at all

I worked in South East Asia for a number of years, and I can say with certainty that rugby supporters in Malaysia are a bit like good Malaysian restaurants in Australia. Few and far between.

 

[daz]

Really? in my 5 or so visits to Malaysia I have never seen any evidence of that at all

I lived in Thailand for 6 years, with a week each month in travelling around places such as Cambodia, Vietnam, Malaysia and Singapore for work activities.

I can tell you, with no hesitation, that if there is a "massive" following of rugby in those areas, it is mostly within the rather small and transient ex-pat population only. There are varying sized pockets of club support at local level, for sure, but massive?

My son played rugby with the Bangkok Lions for 2 years, and whatever games they played on the weekends was almost entirely against kids from other private British ex-pat schools.

 

[daz]

Malaysia has massive rugby following as well. Potentially a shit load more in those 2 than Melbourne or Sydney will produce in a sitting.

Absolute bollocks. Have you lived in Sth East Asia? Been involved with rugby there? I have, and you are presenting what can most charitably be called "alternate facts".

 

[Boof1050]

Well daz the question was asked and as alluded to in my post that it was something I had previously read. But by all means tear me another one! You rugby geniuses obviously have all the answers to rugby in this world so don't ask the questions! I'm just trying to enjoy the conversation and be positive not get castigated like I'm on a witness stand in court.

 

[p.Tah]

From what I hear Malaysian Tourism board will be the Rebels jersey sponsor

 

[daz]

Well daz the question was asked and as alluded to in my post that it was something I had previously read. But by all means tear me another one! You rugby geniuses obviously have all the answers to rugby in this world so don't ask the questions! I'm just trying to enjoy the conversation and be positive not get castigated like I'm on a witness stand in court.

See, this is the kind of thing that gets up peoples noses. There is not a rugby person in Oz who doesn't want to see rugby become bigger and better. I don't personally care too much about this World Series/IPRC thing, but clearly lots of people do and good luck to them.

Want people to engage in conversation? Get on board the TwiggyTrain? Then perhaps refrain from sweeping statements being presented as facts, bearing little actual substance, that causes people to turn off.

 

[swingpass]

Boof i think what most are saying, is that the IPRC/WSR/Twiggy ball - whatever it is eventually called, will rely on the established Rugby nations and established players being transplanted to exotic places. there is no untapped source of Rugby in SE Asia and to suggest that a competition based around Perth even involving the island nations and ex-pat Australians, Kiwis, Saffers and Europeans playing out of Singapore, KL, Jakata or Hong Kong, is going to supersede Super Rugby is fanciful. we all hope that Twiggy (and his $$) can do great things for all Australian Rugby as he seems to be doing in the West, but until it actually gets underway AND succeeds, many of us will remain sceptical. (ps choosing WSR as a name was not a great idea)

 

[Boof1050]

Thanks swing understanding what you’re saying I’m on board with making the game better and stronger. Hell I’ve just had my winter joy with my son ripped away from me after 15 years due to some dubious decisions and shit politics that I’m not going to get into here. But the tubby prop sled if there was any sort of potential or otherwise with Asia or so so I rendered my post as I’m able to do on an Internet forum and then got pretty well sorted by several people who are obviously in the know. My Bad. And if we can’t use the services of a few billionaires then Ra and Sanzaar are obviously our solution then.

 

[Boof1050]

From what I hear Malaysian Tourism board will be the Rebels jersey sponsor

P-yah do you have proof of that? Do you work for Malaysian tourism? Cause I formerly worked on the wharves and can assure you that none of their ships or employees would be interested in sponsoring of being associated with Melbourne! Too cold apparently! True that I worked on the wharves though! Let me rephrase attended work on the wharves.

 

[Braveheart81]

P-yah do you have proof of that? Do you work for Malaysian tourism? Cause I formerly worked on the wharves and can assure you that none of their ships or employees would be interested in sponsoring of being associated with Melbourne! Too cold apparently! True that I worked on the wharves though! Let me rephrase attended work on the wharves.

It was a joke.

 

[barbarian]

I don't really care about the name, the World Series is a great idea. If Twiggy is stepping up and paying players then bloody good on him. The program of games looks competitive, and will be a fantastic lead-in to the NRC. Especially if the modified scoring thing dies a quiet death.

Given the discussion in the last page or so, it does beg the question - why do we need the IPRC? Or, to put it another way, how do we build on this 'World Series' concept, rather than start something in non-rugby countries?

The fundamental flaw in the IPRC, from my perspective, is the other teams in the competition. The idea that Sri Lanka, Malaysia, China or Singapore could ever field a competitive XV is slightly ridiculous. Unless you are shipping in players from around the Pacific.

So why ship them? Why not just create teams in those nations? I think the World Series gives you a blueprint - use teams around the Pacific Islands, and in New Zealand. Create one invitational HK/Singapore team if you need to.

Or just keep the World Series concept, which uses established, recognised teams. Sure they are essentially trial games with low stakes, but I can't see how that's worse than a game in the IPRC against Sri Lanka.

This is not me 'hating' on the IPRC. I think the efforts put in so far have been amazing. I just wonder if they have actually hit on the answer in creating this interim solution, and it may actually work better than the final product.
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[Killer]

I don't really care about the name, the World Series is a great idea. If Twiggy is stepping up and paying players then bloody good on him. The program of games looks competitive, and will be a fantastic lead-in to the NRC. Especially if the modified scoring thing dies a quiet death.

Given the discussion in the last page or so, it does beg the question - why do we need the IPRC? Or, to put it another way, how do we build on this 'World Series' concept, rather than start something in non-rugby countries?

The fundamental flaw in the IPRC, from my perspective, is the other teams in the competition. The idea that Sri Lanka, Malaysia, China or Singapore could ever field a competitive XV is slightly ridiculous. Unless you are shipping in players from around the Pacific.

So why ship them? Why not just create teams in those nations? I think the World Series gives you a blueprint - use teams around the Pacific Islands, and in New Zealand. Create one invitational HK/Singapore team if you need to.

Or just keep the World Series concept, which uses established, recognised teams. Sure they are essentially trial games with low stakes, but I can't see how that's worse than a game in the IPRC against Sri Lanka.

This is not me 'hating' on the IPRC. I think the efforts put in so far have been amazing. I just wonder if they have actually hit on the answer in creating this interim solution, and it may actually work better than the final product.
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Yes, as I have said previously we do not know what the final shape of the competition will be in 5yrs. The current Super rugby comp may be part of it.
I wouldn't underestimate what can be done in 5 to 10yrs especially with 7's now part of the Olympics and hopefully for good.
Who would have imagined Japan beating the Saffa's or the way the Canada, the US and many others are playing 7's.
The new pro comp in the US, it goes on, the world is becoming more and more homogeneous.

 

[barbarian]

That may be so Killer, but I'd wager Sri Lanka are a bit further away than 5-10 years.

Your examples aren't really apt - Japan played in the 1987 Rugby World Cup, and the US/Canada have a far richer heritage than what we are talking about in the Indo-Pacific.

Now if these nations were just playing themselves, I'd say it was great. But aren't you a bit worried about the Force putting 100+ points a game on against these teams? I just can't see that is a positive for anyone.

 

[Killer]

That may be so Killer, but I'd wager Sri Lanka are a bit further away than 5-10 years.

Your examples aren't really apt - Japan played in the 1987 Rugby World Cup, and the US/Canada have a far richer heritage than what we are talking about in the Indo-Pacific.

Now if these nations were just playing themselves, I'd say it was great. But aren't you a bit worried about the Force putting 100+ points a game on against these teams? I just can't see that is a positive for anyone.

Yes, we want a competition. Hence Twiggy wanting OS based Australians and others to bolster some of these teams.
Granted it won't happen overnight but the concept is solid if we want to grow the game and the audience rather than relying on Sth African audiences and sponsorship to pay our way.
Currently Australian professional rugby can't survive in its current format. We have a wealthy benefactor in Twiggy who is offering to find a better way with no financial risk to Aust rugby.
Why not support it?

 

[kiap]

The fundamental flaw in the IPRC, from my perspective, is the other teams in the competition. The idea that Sri Lanka, Malaysia, China or Singapore could ever field a competitive XV is slightly ridiculous. Unless you are shipping in players from around the Pacific.

I think you're operating from different assumptions and therefore reach a different conclusion.

The first thing I would say is they WILL be shipping in players from around the Pacific.

So why ship them?

For good reasons.

The PI nations have bountiful player talent. But Samoa, Tonga (end even to a lesser extent, Fiji and that other banana republic, Australia) don't have the supporter base, potential viewers and commercial support (and sugar daddies) to sustain additional pro teams to employ all those players. Hong Kong, Singapore and other Asian locations do have that potential.

So you move players from where they can't get paid to where they can.

 

[Braveheart81]

You seem to suggest that people questioning how successful something might be or wondering how certain aspects will work as not supporting it.

Now people are being accused of not supporting the competition because they suggest that actually, rugby doesn't have a massive following in Malaysia.

It isn't binary. Someone not agreeing that it will replace Super Rugby within a couple of years and take over Rugby Australia in no way means they are saying it will fail or that they want it to fail.

 

[barbarian]

The PI nations have bountiful player talent. But Samoa, Tonga (end even to a lesser extent, Fiji and that other banana republic, Australia) don't have the supporter base (or sugar daddies) to sustain additional pro teams to employ all those players. Hong Kong, Singapore and other Asian locations do have that potential.

So you move players from where they can't get paid to where they can.

I think the Sugar Daddies are more important here than the supporter base, but I see your point.

If Twiggy can find other Twiggies in the Asia-Pacific then more power to him.
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[Boof1050]

It was a joke.

No shit BH! Hope you didn’t think mine was?

 

[barbarian]

Why not support it?

Just concur with BH on this one. I am supporting it. I will support it.

But we can have a debate here on the inner workings of the comp itself without it being a rejection of the concept as a whole.
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