Pumas v Wallabies, Rosario, 5th October 2013

[The Red Baron]

Absolutely.

But I reckon it is more than that. The Wallabies have had a pretty bloody good track record when it comes to dangerous play and that something to be proud of. We have never had players of the likes of Schalk Burger, Dylan Hartley and Ma'a Nonu. Although Rob Simmons is starting down that path. Yes he shouldn't do it because it's 10 minutes in the bin, but I reckon there is a pride factor in there as well.

Justin Harrison played a pretty good thug.

 

[Scrubber2050]

what annoys me and is a cause of our scrum problems is the 6, 7 and 8 not properly engaging and giving weight.

look at the scrum on Dwyers View. fardy Hooper and Mowen all have their fucking heads in the clouds but the Pumas are all in there. Next bloke who does that should be hooked,

 

[gel]

An

I think I would prefer one missed tackle as opposed to giving away a penalty and spending the next 10 minutes a man down. But that might be just me.
.

Yeah, it was daft. At least Timani has never done anything so daft as to get sent to the bin for something so retarded. :/

 

[Brumby Runner]

Fairly simple solution here; When Higgers comes back (even for EOYT) start him at 8, move Mowen to the bench, keep Fardy at 6, give Pyle a run at 4 and boot Simmons to the bench or out of the match day 23.

(no bias was used in the creation of this post).

This would get rid of both lineout callers, unless you see Pyle performing this task until Mowen joins from the bench. If he can do that, I would agree with those changes.

 

[cyclopath]

An
Yeah, it was daft. At least Timani has never done anything so daft as to get sent to the bin for something so retarded. :/

He didn't say that, and remember, you said you'd prefer a player off for 10 than a missed tackle, and going to the back catalogue will be fraught with problems. Try and pick any of the forwards without a history of yellow cards / penalty infringements, even the ones you like. And some of them will be dumb! If gets challenging.
For mine, a yellow card is always a problem, but some just happen with players pushing the edges. Off-ball stuff that adds nothing to our team's effort just doesn't fly. Simmons even looked like he knew it was dumb as soon as he did it. Shame, as it detracted from an otherwise decent effort.

 

[gel]

I reckon he gets singled out a lot more than others is my main point.

Regarding the specific issue of the off the ball stuff... Well I don't think there was a massive amount of damage there to the opposition in terms of danger and again nothing that doesn't happen in other games with the all blacks, springboks or lions without any attention being brought to light about it until after the game when the losing team starts to whine and moan about it. Contemponi wasn't injured.

as I said - stupid and daft but no more daft than being lazy defender in your own 22 with a possible try on the line (which gets looked over only because we weren't playing all blacks or springboks who would have capitalized.)

 

[daz]

Some hard markers around here!

Yes, one decent win at the tail end of a pretty ordinary RC does not make us world beaters, but let's see how the boys did against what we asked them to do:

We asked the Wallabies to step up and show us something, and they did. They flogged the Argies at home and it was terrific to watch.

We asked them to attack. They did. We asked them to keep the ball in hand. On the whole, they did. We asked them to show some cohesion and intent. They did. We asked them to be more disciplined. Simmons brain fart aside, they were. We asked the scrum to step up. 15 minutes of scrum after scrum 5 metres out from our goal line in the first half and the Argies came away with nothing. Fucking exceptional.

Was it perfect? No. Would we have got away with it quite so well against the Saffas or the Darkness? Probably not. Was it a bloody good win in the context of circumstance? You betcha.

Will it be a foundation to move forward into the EOYT and 2014? Let's hope so.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

It certainly was a hugely improved performance. We'll have to step up the defence around the fringes, because the Argies broke the line what seemed like a hundred times there, but there were steps forward in many areas, including the scrum. Just keep doing it boys and the results will come.

 

[Athilnaur]

I am just rapt that the team played so well and Cooper showed a true test class game for the first time in ages.

Comparing Simmons to Nonu is a bit rich, one is a hard competitor who is a world class centre the other is a want to be hard competitor who in my opinion would struggle to get test honours in any of the other top six nations.

Biggest highlights for me were Tomane 's breakthrough to test std and Cooper's form, big relief to see him show the mojo.

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[barbarian]

I reckon he gets singled out a lot more than others is my main point.

Regarding the specific issue of the off the ball stuff. Well I don't think there was a massive amount of damage there to the opposition in terms of danger and again nothing that doesn't happen in other games with the all blacks, springboks or lions without any attention being brought to light about it until after the game when the losing team starts to whine and moan about it. Contemponi wasn't injured.

as I said - stupid and daft but no more daft than being lazy defender in your own 22 with a possible try on the line (which gets looked over only because we weren't playing all blacks or springboks who would have capitalized.)

It is MUCH more daft.

There have been occasions this year where Simmons has been a bit hard done by, and your defence would be warranted. This is not one of those occasions.

What he did was dumb, dumb, dumb. And no it doesn't happen every game. The fact that Contemponi wasn't injured is irrelevant.

I don't understand why you have picked this incident to defend Simmons.


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[daz]

What he did was dumb, dumb, dumb. And no it doesn't happen every game. The fact that Contemponi wasn't injured is irrelevant.

I don't understand why you have picked this incident to defend Simmons.

Could not agree more with this. I couldn't care less about what Rob has done in the past, or his intent, or what he was thinking, etc, etc.

Looking at the incident in isolation, which is the only way to do it, it was a dumb, stupid, idiotic and thuggish act.

I went ape-shite when Nonu did it, and my feeling hasn't changed just because the bloke that did it this time was wearing a Gold jersey.

It was and is indefensible, full stop.

 

[daz]

Oh yes, for what it is worth, Wayne Barnes was very, very good as usual.

Best ref in world rugby today, with Nigel Owens in second place.

 

[redveincheese]

A much improved performance by the wobs, but what concerns me is the lapses in defence. We still at times lacked the urgency to reset our defensive line when needed. Our kick chase is also still weak. We seem to have the attack side of things going in the right direction so hoping our defence will improve. It will have to, or darkness will give us a spanking again in Dunedin.

 

[gel]

I don't understand why you have picked this incident to defend Simmons.
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Perhaps it is more the other previous times that has made me so aware of this campaign and not so much this one - and I possibly am a bit off in my timing to bring it up in this particular instance...

I just saw the incident as little more than what happens 10 times a game in the springboks and all blacks games where they take out defenders around the rucks, or tackle other players without the ball. When the wallabies are competing strongly , they do the exact same thing. I thought he used his arms - ref saw it differently so fair enough - yellow card. I don't think anyone would be thinking "OMG he could've DOIDed!!!11!!!one11!!" in this instance.

I find it a bit odd how strongly he is being treated for this particular brain fart - and others in the past. It is just very apparent that if he does anything wrong in a game, then absolutely nothing else he can possibly have done in the game can counter that by the looks of it.

He seems to attract a lot of criticism, whilst others in similar circumstances do not.

I don't know what he has done to engender such a strong feeling of ill will. I am curious.

"Penalty Magnet" does not appear to be anything other than a gut feeling people have...

 

[Sully]

Guys I really think all of you should take an unbiased second look at Simmons tackle. He just stood there and conteponi ran into him. Dumb maybe. wrong place wrong time definitely. On purpose? no.

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[gel]

Could not agree more with this. I couldn't care less about what Rob has done in the past, or his intent, or what he was thinking, etc, etc.

Looking at the incident in isolation, which is the only way to do it, it was a dumb, stupid, idiotic and thuggish act.

I went ape-shite when Nonu did it, and my feeling hasn't changed just because the bloke that did it this time was wearing a Gold jersey.

It was and is indefensible, full stop.

Ah I see now... It is not the taking out the player without the ball - it is the shoulder charge?

Given how many incidents have not been penalised this year in super rugby I thought that his movement of his arms around the player were sort of OK as a basis of a tackle attempt and what I thought most of the refs were sort of adjudicating on... I haven't really had a close look at it in replay.

I have no problem with anyone criticising him for dangerous play if that is what they think he did.

 

[chiraag]

I'm not really getting all the gushing over the performances of Quade and Kurindrani. Quade was definitely better than he has been of late, but he still made a lot of errors and poor options that would be severely punished against the Boks or Kiwis, and result in him probably being a net loss overall. I would much rather work with Lilo, To'omua or Foley at 10 going forward, and perhaps have Quade on the bench if we need a spark late in the game. He just isn't the solid test player we need in pressure games against Tier 1 countries, with our forwards more often than not on the back foot.

Kurindrani was rather poor in my opinion as well, dropping a fair few balls and missing a hell of a lot of tackels with some rather weak defense for a man of his size and athleticism. Again this would have been exploited by a better team into far more points. AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) to go back to 13 once our winger stocks are back to normal.

 

[daz]

Guys I really think all of you should take an unbiased second look at Simmons tackle. He just stood there and conteponi ran into him. Dumb maybe. wrong place wrong time definitely. On purpose? no.

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Sully, have a closer look. He took two or three side steps to line FC up and dropped the shoulder into him.

It could not have been more on purpose, and it did not even get into the same ball-park definition of the word "tackle".

.

 

[Pfitzy]

Guys I really think all of you should take an unbiased second look at Simmons tackle.

Good idea - why don't you try it too?

He just stood there and conteponi ran into him. Dumb maybe. wrong place wrong time definitely. On purpose? no.

Oh. Right.

You forgot "lowered the shoulder" and "while he should have been running back onside".

Fail hard at unbiased from you Mr Sully.

Generally I thought Simmons was OK. But if he's in possession of this mystical lineout general ability that apparently makes him first choice, why can't we steal bagloads of opposition ball? Other than his complete idiocy, an above average game from him.

Anyway, the bigger problem still remains the front row:

1) Slipper got dicked. I really think he should concentrate on tighthead, and that's good news for him, because:

2) Alexander still can't bind and still can't bend. He's showing a wonderful lack of commitment to the dark arts of tight head prop, and should be flicked. And maybe Blades should too, because clearly he's not in possession of a sound understanding of the Laws in this area, or the physics. And that call he made on Fox about not having the ref instruct the 9 - what is that? Jeez...

(MOD EDIT: Cutting out a load of tripe)


1 Robinson
2 Moore
3 Kepu
4 Timani
5 Horwill (if he's not broken)

16 Fainga'a (who I thought played well... for him...)
17 Sio (loosehead)
18 Slipper (tighthead)

Rest of the team is pretty much the same for Dunedin.

 

[barbarian]

Guys I really think all of you should take an unbiased second look at Simmons tackle. He just stood there and conteponi ran into him. Dumb maybe. wrong place wrong time definitely. On purpose? no.

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Just looked again now. Simmons definitely dropped his shoulder and stepped into Contepomi.

If he 'just stood there' then why was Contepomi hurled backwards and winded, while Simmons remained on his feet unharmed? Contepomi was the one running forward, remember.

And I love the use of the word 'unbiased' there too.



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