Bledisloe #2 - AUS v NZL, Eden Park, Auckland, August 15th

[Lorenzo]

I have never been really on the MC bandwagon but it's just bloody batty to put the loss on the tinkering. The ABs missed two important tackles last week that they otherwise almost always make - when they let Kepu in and when they let White in. Now, that doesn't mean we didn't deserve the win, because we did, but pretending that last week we won because of who was wearing 1 through 15 and this we lost because of the "tinkering" is just really, really dim.

We have not won there since Moses wore short pants. Let's not act like starting Pocock and Foley would have fixed everything right up.

With the appropriate focus, a team made up of out best 31 can beat anyone in the WC. I'm not putting money on them to win the tournament, and I'm still not sure who starts at 10, but they are looking better now than they were a year ago.

 

[MrTabua]

Butch James says a little paracetamol will fix that usual structure fault.

Sorry, bloody obtuse, I just meant hopefully '07 Boks provide evidence of a RWC win without a standout 10.

 

[Lorenzo]

Giteau still won't run up the guts. We've enough players running across the paddock.

To'omua has the physical to lock down the 12 spot but does he have the mental? SOme of those kicks.....

 

[Brumby Runner]

After tonight's game, I think we are still just as far from knowing our best XV as we were before the RC started.

Locks are still a question. Skelton in half a match made a massive 13m carrying the ball. While he was on, the lineout was a shambles, but the scrum was strong. Horwill and Mumm both missed critical tackles that led to tries, and neither showed out with ball in hand. After Horwill was replaced, the scrum went to pieces. And Cheika made life for the lineout difficult by starting with only two jumpers.

Poey and Hooper together with Fardy look to be our best back row. Why not start with them? I think Cliff Palu doesn't offer enough to go to the RWC.

Halves are also still a mystery. Quade has not deserved his spot this year, and has really not done enough in the test matches to warrant his retention. But, lest anyone forget, Foley was probably even worse last week against a much tamer ABs side, and he hasn't earned his spot either. Despite the hate being expressed by some on here, Matt To'omua has been the standout No 10 whenever he's played there during the RC. And if he is to be pilloried for one poor kick that led to an AB's try, then so should Carter (?) who kicked to Izzy who then ran half the field to score. These things happen when the rest of the team is playing poorly or being lazy.

Where to for No 9? We have all seen that Nic White is slower to clear the ruck than Nick Phipps, but his passes invariably go to a player, not to grass about 20. behind our backline. And to those who claim Phipps suffers from not having runners, then I say the same situation exists for White as well at the back of the ruck. At Least, White has more strings to his bow in that he will take the line on himself from time to time, and his penalty kicking for line is the best we've seen all RC. Despite the problems, these are the two No 9s for the RWC. Larkham will just have to get Phipps to take better aim with his passes and to asdd a bit of variety to his game, and to get White to speed up his service from the ruck base.

These are our most obvious problem areas. I hope Cheika can continue to show the balls to make the calls needed to make improvements in the RWC squad.

 

[Bairdy]

Can't believe people are bagging our halves for the loss, I mean really?

We have been dominated at the contact area full stop. Our forwards struggled to get over the gain line, meaning our work at attacking and defensive breakdowns is hindered greatly.

What I will say is we need to get better at impeding opposition support players when the ball is being trucked up, as well as taking our sweet time to roll away back onside after the tackle has been made. They need to practice it more in training.

Our first-up tackling was poor, which meant the ABs were constantly over the adv. line, and the Wallabies - on the backfoot.

Palu was not up to speed as I foresaw pregame; Skelton played adequately; Horwill, while tireless around the park, did miss a couple of crucial first-up tackles that led to half breaks but to be fair, plenty of players did.

To'omua had an off night.

Nonu made a massive difference to the ABs. The more games Kuridrani struggles to stamp his presence on, the more convinced I become that he needs to be our 'Nonu' (battering ram) at 12.

Carter put on a masterclass in flyhalf play. He had the luxury of playing behind a pack going forward this week, but his tactical kicking and running was exemplary.

I think we got bogged down in playing a monster pack in the hope of bashing our way over the ABs. When we did not have gain line success, the ABs were able to run the big boys off their feet.

Our hope this gamble of ringing the changes at the cost of the Bledisloe has answered some questions for Cheiks.

 

[ChargerWA]

The concerning thing to me is that with all of the tinkering, we haven't seen what Lilo can do.

His long standing combination with To'omua would be handy. But I would have been keen to see him combine with Giteau.

 

[MrTabua]

After tonight's game, I think we are still just as far from knowing our best XV as we were before the RC started.

Nah, I think we got an inkling of our best XV after last week.

 

[galumay]

Nah, I think we got an inkling of our best XV after last week.

I doubt it, we were playing a different side in a different venue last week.

 

[Lorenzo]

It has to be a one-game-at-a-time horses for courses approach, now.

Who starts against England in the 9 and 10 jerseys?

I would pick White at 9 for his kicking prowess and becuase the other two don't bring anything else to the table.

10? I don't even know.

 

[Lorenzo]

Nah, I think we got an inkling of our best XV after last week.

So who was it?

 

[Pfitzy]

Can't believe people are bagging our halves for the loss, I mean really?

We have been dominated at the contact area full stop. Our forwards struggled to get over the gain line, meaning our work at breakdowns is hindered greatly.

But when we DID get over the gain line, our halves took away that momentum with poor service. Its a team effort, after all.

Kiwis played negative rugby most of the time.

They interfered with our ruck nicely. And besides one incident where Woodcock slowly got up right into White's passing line, we didn't make enough of an issue out of it to gain ourselves some more penalties.

I think he's crabbed the starting 12 jersey.

Fixed.

 

[galumay]

Here's an idea, lets leave the selection of the team to the coaching staff! After all they should have some idea what they are doing, I know they arent as qualified as us couch-coaches but it might be worth a try.

On second thoughts, that wont work, we wont have anything to discuss between games!

 

[Teh Other Dave]

Here's an idea, lets leave the selection of the team to the coaching staff! After all they should have some idea what they are doing, I know they arent as qualified as us couch-coaches but it might be worth a try.

On second thoughts, that wont work, we wont have anything to discuss between games!

You must be new to the information superhighway.

 

[Beefcake]

Here's an idea, lets leave the selection of the team to the coaching staff! After all they should have some idea what they are doing, I know they arent as qualified as us couch-coaches but it might be worth a try.

On second thoughts, that wont work, we wont have anything to discuss between games!

Yes the blame game soooo much more interesting

 

[MrTabua]

So who was it?

hey, I hated the loss tonight too.

But I think maybe Pocock and Hooper starting together. Mumm in the 2nd row, with, what about Simmons, and then, yes, take your pick on the contentious positions. I'd go for a selection that tasted victory.

Open to offers though. What a bastard that second 40 was.

 

[CTPE]

1. Fardy and Izzy our best forward and back respectively tonight and their consistency together with that of AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) makes those 3 our only absolute certain starters.
2. Think Giteau needs to be added to the above three as a certain starter. Noticed he was doing all the talking in the huddle at games end.
3. Uncharacteristically quiet game from Hooper but that 1st half head knock might have shortened him up.
4. Thought Horwill was very physical and did plenty of work but his lateral movement is poor.
5. Looking forward to Kane Douglas becoming match fit as he had good impact when he came on.
6. White tried too hard but generally got poor ball at the breakdown. He's a finisher for me. Yes Phipps had a poor game last week in a winning team but prior to that he'd been one of our most consistent players.
6. As for QC (Quade Cooper) I'm not a fan - prefer players who offer more consistency and can deliver in the really big games plus I'm very much a believer in the "no dickheads" policy.
7. As for the 10 spot think Cheik has to give Giteau/To'omua a shot and let them interchange between 10 and 12 as he lets Foley/Beale do at the Tahs.
8. Mitchell is our best winger at involving himself in the game in attack with AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) close behind. Despite their lack of sheer pace I think the backline is more balanced with them both in.
9. Pity Sean McMahon hasn't had the opportunity as yet to have some game time. Understand that it's difficult with Hooper/Pocock ahead of him but he offers a lot (this said Liam Gill can't even make the current squad - wish we could produce depth and consistency at 10 as we can at 7)
10. AB's kicked as much tonight as any northern hemisphere teams but showed that when executed properly that kicking can be integral to providing a great platform for attacking rugby.
1. Sio
2. Moore
3. Kepu
4. Simmons ( when healthy)
5. Douglas (when match fit)
6. Fardy
7. Hooper/Pocock
8. MacCalman
9. Phipps
10. Giteau
11. AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)
12. To'omua
13. Kuridrani
14. Mitchell
15. Folau
16. TPN
17. Slipper
18. Holmes
19. Horwill/Skelton
20. Hooper/Pocock
21.White
22. Beale
23. Tomane

 

[Upthenuts]

to be fair to the wallabies is there a greater fortress in world rugby than Eden Park? Ive enjoyed watching the father n law see the wallabies destroyed there before, and i barely remember your last win there, sadly france. 94 still sticks out, goid luck to anyone playing us at eden park

 

[drewprint]

Does anyone know how Lilo went for the World XV?

 

[tragic]

Bloody hell 7 weeks till our next game against a top tier nation is a long time to wait to see if tonight was just an aberration.

 

[Ruggo]

Well the natural order of things was restored, sad as I am to see the Wobblies thrashed, there were a number of things I predicted, I thought the AB's would come back strongly and win this game - although I didnt pick such a huge margin, I warned that we could not keep expecting the bench to salvage wins in the last 20 minutes or so as had happened through the RC, I had also made the point that we were very lucky to win a couple of those games.

I think its simply ridiculous to critisise Cheika for the loss, equally its silly to critisise individual players, they were blown off the park by the world's best team playing at 100% for 80 minutes, a team that we annoyed into form by beating them last week. The wobblies were simply not allowed to play any better than they did. Its a credit to a superb team that has dominated a sport like no other I can think of.

No doubt the couch-coaches will now ring the changes and come up with a team that could beat the AB's when they are on song, at home, in the fortress - sorry, but you are wrong.

The critics of Shags and his team of worn out ancient heroes look rather silly tonight, those old, past it buggers took us apart comprehensively and it seems the coach was able to get a little bit more out of them this week!

Well dont AB's, you truly are a champion team, commiserations Wobblies, you werent actually that bad, you have a team that can beat most sides in the world at the moment and even the better ones if they are a little bit off their best. There are great signs coming into the RWC and at least we now know just how much the gap is between number 1 and the rest!

No, he can own the changes he made. I'm sure he had his reasons but he still has to own it. Only the bloody stupid would be taken by surprise at the quality of the AB performance tonight. It's obvious they would have been hurting after last week. None the less they were there for the taking if we were smart enough and we were not. The forwards performance last week was dynamic, striking a good mix of physicality, mobility and set piece capability (remind anyone of what makes the AB's so good?). Arm chair coach or not, I question why it was tampered with and the result really doesn't come as a surprise.