Wallaby 31 players for 2015 RWC

[Groucho]

Its very surprising to hear we were playing a game based on spreading the ball wide, quickly and at every opportunity with that pack.
I would have thought that we had the cattle with Palu, McCalman, Douglas, Simmons, Slipper, TPN & Holmes to go right up the middle and make it work effectively. McMahon is a very direct player as well. I assume if the pack is like that against Uruguay then we we will go forward before we attempt to go wide. We may not need to go wide that much.
As for the rush defense, a couple of chips in behind would slow that down. Foley did a good one that nearly came off and should have done a few more in quick succession.

We lacked leadership in the first half. That has been our downfall in most of our losses to lesser ranked sides in the last 10 years. Gateau should have been the one to redirect our game if Slipper didn't see it was needed.

Isn't that the ideal pack for playing a wide game correctly? You have to go forward before going wide, as the Fox commentary team keeps telling us. They're big. but they're mobile with skills.

You'd only use a pack like that play a pressure game when you don't have the backs to capitalize on it, or you're England.

 

[Joe Blow]

Isn't that the ideal pack for playing a wide game correctly? You have to go forward before going wide, as the Fox commentary team keeps telling us. They're big. but they're mobile with skills.

You'd only use a pack like that play a pressure game when you don't have the backs to capitalize on it, or you're England.

I would suggest going hard up the middle for the first quarter and establishing dominance and then pick when and where you want to go wide. The problem was that we were trying to go wide under enormous pressure against a very fast rush defense.
Establish dominace in the middle, at the set piece and at the ruck and then give your fast men space out wide and in the centre when it presents itself.

The coaches are talking about two separate 15s within the squad. They are very different 15s suited to two different types of game. The Pooper automatically presents the skills to play fast and wide from the kick off and to have an undeniable presence at the breakdown. The other back row.... not so much.

 

[Joe Blow]

Also assuming the other pack has Skelton in the second row. Play hard and close and basically smash the other pack.
We play the Pooper 15 against England and the other against less robust packs

 

[Groucho]

I would suggest going hard up the middle for the first quarter and establishing dominance and then pick when and where you want to go wide. The problem was that we were trying to go wide under enormous pressure against a very fast rush defense.
Establish dominace in the middle, at the set piece and at the ruck and then give your fast men space out wide and in the centre when it presents itself.

The coaches are talking about two separate 15s within the squad. They are very different 15s suited to two different types of game. The Pooper automatically presents the skills to play fast and wide from the kick off and to have an undeniable presence at the breakdown. The other back row.. not so much.

Sure, I agree with the first part. That's what "Cheikaball" is. Smash it up the middle then go wide when gaps appear. I don't think anyone is suggesting we play helter-skelter rugby. We don't need to.

I'm not sure about this 2x 15s part. Do you have a link?

 

[Joe Blow]

http://www.news.com.au/sport/rugby/...g-two-pool-games/story-fndpt9s1-1227519937487

It's just for the two games and then other things will come into it. We will come up against other sides that a power game will be needed against if we get through into the knock out rounds

 

[Groucho]

http://www.news.com.au/sport/rugby/...g-two-pool-games/story-fndpt9s1-1227519937487

It's just for the two games and then other things will come into it. We will come up against other sides that a power game will be needed against if we get through into the knock out rounds

Sure, two distinct teams for those two games, due to the schedule. Then the team for Fiji plays on for the rest of the tournament, barring injuries. The team for Uruguay becomes the pool of reserves.

 

[Joe Blow]

I guess it will be something like that. There may be sides along the way that require a different approach. I imagine starting Pooper will be kept in the back pocket for the really big games.

 

[Groucho]

It is a very good article, it highlights our challenges in the first half.

The big disappointment being the lack of adaption in that first half.

Between the experienced players and the water boy/coach it shouldn't have taken 40 minutes to adapt

He had me until "This is not 'depth'". Why isn't it? Why is it so hard to grudgingly acknowledge something being right with Australian rugby?

 

[fatprop]

Larkham confirmed that there will be two separate 15s for the first two games today in the Fox.
http://www.foxsports.com.au/rugby/r...g-two-pool-games/story-e6frf4pu-1227519937487

That I guess explains some of the selection choices

Assuming AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) is the first choice 14 in the "a"s, it may explain why Speight was selected and played as a 13 on Saturday.

Also using the presumption of Simmons & Mumm being our first choice lineout locks

I can see the Simmons\Douglas & Mumm\Skelton pairings being used and Sio getting some time again at hooker vs Uruguay

 

[upthereds#!]

A) Fiji & England
- Mcmahon has the Hits, Leg drive and Speed to be dangerous for 20. Limits lineout to 2 specialists but again..only for 20ish most likely
- To'omua over Quade as covers the 12 more safely V England.
- Maybe Horne for same reason over Beale

1. Sio 2.Moore 3.Kepu
4. Simmons 5. Douglas
6. Fardy 8. Poey 7.Hoops
9. Phipps 10.Foley 12. Gits 13. Kuridrani 11/14. - Mitchell / AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) 15. Folau

16. TPN 17. Slipper/Smith 18. Holmes 19. Skelton 20. Mcmahon 21. Genia 22. To'omua 23. Beale


B) Uraguay & (MAYBE similar) Wales
- 7/2 split to cover Palu & Skelton
- Still versatile 22 & 23,
- Horne exp @ 13
- Sio chance at Hooker

1.Slipper 2.TPN 3.Holmes
4. Mumm 5. Skelton
6. Mccalman 8.Palu 7. Mcmahon
9. Genia 10.QC (Quade Cooper) 12. To'omua 13. Horne 11/14. Speight/Tomane 15.Beale

16. Sio 17.Smith 18.Kepu 19. Douglas 20. Fardy 21. Hooper 22. Gits 23. AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)

 

[Slim 293]

If we're running with two separate teams I'd like to hope for:

A

1. Sio
2. Moore
3. Kepu
4. Douglas
5. Simmons
6. Fardy
7. Hooper
8. Pocock
9. Phipps
10. Foley
11. Mitchell
12. To'omua
13. Kuridrani
14. AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)
15. Folau


B

1. Slipper
2. TPN
3. Holmes
4. Skelton
5. Mumm
6. McCalman
7. McMahon
8. Palu
9. Genia
10. Cooper
11. Horne
12. Gits
13. Speight
14. Tomane
15. Beale

 

[Braveheart81]

I think the biggest unknown is which team To'omua and Giteau are in. Up to this point I would have thought Giteau is the starter in the A team and To'omua is the bench option.

I'd like to see Horne and Speight swap for the Uruguay game. I tend to think that will achieve a better result.

 

[Slim 293]

The makeup for the bench of the A team would likely be:

16. TPN
17. Slipper
18. Holmes
19. Mumm
20. McCalman
21. Genia
22. Giteau
23. Beale

My only main concern is the lack of strike power out wide with Speight, Tomane and Horne not included........

 

[dru]

He had me until "This is not 'depth'". Why isn't it? Why is it so hard to grudgingly acknowledge something being right with Australian rugby?

Hey Grouch. My bad not the author of the referenced article.


I'm not having a go at Aussie rugby at all and get frustrated with the on-going fan negativity.

I suppose by definition it is "depth". But I don't think it's depth that is at international level. Cheika seems to me to be building a strong team rather than a team of champions, especially when you across the 31.

It isn't negativity, it's acknowledging how well the coaching and selection is doing with the material at hand.

 

[Viking]

The makeup for the bench of the A team would likely be:

16. TPN
17. Slipper
18. Holmes
19. Mumm
20. McCalman
21. Genia
22. Giteau
23. Beale

My only main concern is the lack of strike power out wide with Speight, Tomane and Horne not included....

I'd put money that Skelton will be on the bench. Cheika loves him.

Not sure you can say Horne has "strike power", certainly isn't any better then AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) and Mitchell in attack. Defence and commitment another story.

 

[Braveheart81]

AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) seems to be our best winger at finding the try line this test season.

I agree that Tomane and Speight are the wingers more likely to score a try out of nothing, but I think AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) is the most reliable at converting good opportunities.

Mitchell is somewhere in between.

 

[Slim 293]

I think Tomane is possibly the best attacking winger out of the lot of them, but defensively the weakest...........

 

[Hawko]

You may be pretty close to the mark utr. There are a couple of alternative strategies that the coaches might use given their previous dispositions. I think too that the Fiji team does not have to be the "best" team in all positions as someone could readily play Uruguay and England, especially in the backs. I also wonder whether Cheika will want to show off the Pooper too much before the England game. So, my crystal ball says:

FIJI:
1. Sio, 2. Moore, 3. Kepu
4. Skelton, 5. Simmons
6. Fardy, 7. Hooper, 8. McCalman
9. Phipps, 10. Foley
12. Giteau, 13. Kuridrani
11. Horne, 14. AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper), 15. Folau

16. TPN, 17. Slipper, 18. Holmes, 19. Mumm, 20. Pocock, 21. Genia, 22. To'omua, 23. Beale

URUGUAY:
1. Smith, 2. TPN, 3. Holmes
4. Mumm, 5. Douglas,
6. Pocock, 7. McMahon, 8. Palu
9. Genia, 10 Cooper,
12. To'omua, 13. Speight,
11. Mitchell, 14. Tomane, 15. Beale

16. Sio, 17. Slipper, 18. Kepu, 19. Simmons, 20. McCalman. 21. Phipps, 22. Giteau, 23. AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)

ENGLAND: (6:2 bench split)
1. Sio, 2. Moore, 3. Kepu,
4. Skelton/Douglas, 5. Simmons
6. Fardy, 7. Hooper, 8. Pocock
9. Phipps, 10. Foley,
12. To'omua/Giteau, 13. Kuridrani
11. Mitchell/Horne, 14. AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper), 15. Folau

16. TPN, 17. Slipper, 18. Holmes, 19. Douglas/Skelton, 20. Mumm, 21. McCalman/Palu, 22. Genia, 23. Beale.

Performance in the first two games would resolve the options, which in my mind are still not clear. Right now if I had to make a first choice it would be Skelton, To'omua, Mitchell and McCalman taking the spots but its pretty tight. Wonderful position to be in as a coaching team

 

[Braveheart81]

I'd be surprised if Cheika was worried about showing off Pocock and Hooper together too early or too often.

I don't think it is reinventing the wheel. Pocock is just playing a tight number 8 game better than any of our other number 8s at the moment. He is going to attack more defensive rucks than most number 8s but there isn't much else to his game in that position that differs from what we're trying to get Palu and McCalman to do when they play there.

Maybe the one area that Cheika might be keen on hiding a little is how our lineout functions in that situation.

If playing Pocock at 8 changes our lock combination then I'd be playing that forward pack against both Fiji and England and then hope we can move forward with that same team. Lock is certainly an area where several of our options (including potentially the two starters; if it's Douglas and Simmons) are underdone and could use more game time.

 

[BDA]

I think if you start Pooper, I think you forget about a 6:2 split.
Pocock and Hooper are both 80 minute players. Fardy can also play 80 if required. Skelton covers lock. Mumm cover a Backrow injury / back-up 6 / Back-up lock.