The Wallabies Thread

[tragic]

Have we forgotten that Phipps erratic pass gave up two tries in matches that were lost by less.
And our inability to exit our half was the biggest single factor in losing the series to the soap Dodgers.
Surely we aren't going to rinse and repeat.
The ABs will exploit those deficiencies even more than the poms did.
If genia trains well he should start
And as Seb said Gits (and Mitchell) need to be there to help our ineffectual kicking game untill we find a more well rounded 10.

 

[Gnostic]

Have we forgotten that Phipps erratic pass gave up two tries in matches that were lost by less.

And our inability to exit our half was the biggest single factor in losing the series to the soap Dodgers.

Surely we aren't going to rinse and repeat.

The ABs will exploit those deficiencies even more than the poms did.

If genia trains well he should start

And as Seb said Gits (and Mitchell) need to be there to help our ineffectual kicking game untill we find a more well rounded 10.

So what are the options?

A Brumbies reserve 9. A Force reserve 9. Both in craptastic attacking backlines.
A Reds 9 who was in an even worse attacking backline that was surely in the negatives for running metres gained past the add line.
Or a Rebels 9 in Stirzacker who was knocking on the door last year but has struggled since injury?

 

[Viking]

So what are the options?

A Brumbies reserve 9. A Force reserve 9. Both in craptastic attacking backlines.
A Reds 9 who was in an even worse attacking backline that was surely in the negatives for running metres gained past the add line.
Or a Rebels 9 in Stirzacker who was knocking on the door last year but has struggled since injury?

Our incumbent 9, Genia, returning from injury...

 

[tragic]

So what are the options?

The other halfback in the squad..

 

[Braveheart81]

Most people expect Genia to start like he did at the RWC.

 

[The torpedo]

And as Seb said Gits (and Mitchell) need to be there to help our ineffectual kicking game untill we find a more well rounded 10.

In the distant mountains you will see this mythical more well rounded 10:

 

[Lorenzo]

For the life of me I don't understand bringing back players who are certainly on the downslope of their careers - Giteau, Mitchell, AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) - that have won absolutely all of their caps across a period in which we won absolutely no desirable silverware? What are they going to teach the younger guys? How to get dominated by the ABs 90% of the time?

I think in the year following a WC we should be trying to build a side by giving promising younger players - DHP and Kerevi come to mind - as much experience as possible. I mean, it's not like we've got Michael Jordan coming back and it's 1995. It's Matt bloody Giteau. Surely someone else can crab across field?

 

[Braveheart81]

Our side's performance has been better with some or all of them in it.

Experienced players assist the inexperienced players and hopefully make them improve faster.

One of the key things lacking against England was our ability to capitalise on huge possession and territory advantages. Some sounder heads and more leaders within the team might have helped us overcome that.

I can understand perfectly well why Cheika wants these guys around the team.

 

[Slim 293]

You always pick the best players available..........

Are they the best players available?

Yes.

 

[Lorenzo]

Experienced players assist the inexperienced players and hopefully make them improve faster.

How does that work? What does Kerevi (or any other inside back) learn from watching Giteau play that he can't learn by watching the 100 other tests that Giteau has played? Wouldn't he learn more by actually playing?

Again, when it comes to the tests that we really want to win - those against the ABs - these guys are accustomed to losing. It's not like they have some killer instinct they can pass on.

 

[Braveheart81]

Should we stop selecting our best players after they lose to the All Blacks half a dozen times?

You are acting as if the only reason we lose to the All Blacks most of the time is because the players get overcome by the occasion.

I think the clear reality is that they are substantially better than us and it is very difficult for any side to beat them. We need to play our best rugby to do it.

It's not just a case of picking guys who haven't lost to them much so they're not phased by the situation.

 

[Lorenzo]

You always pick the best players available....

Are they the best players available?

Yes.

Best at what, though?

Giteau has never performed well against the All Blacks. None of his cross field crabbing has any effect at all. Yeah, he looks swish playing Super/Top rugby but that was always the case.

We're just going to be friggen mediocre whilst we keep playing these guys that were the cornerstones of teams that were mediocre.

 

[Lorenzo]

Should we stop selecting our best players after they lose to the All Blacks half a dozen times?

You are acting as if the only reason we lose to the All Blacks most of the time is because the players get overcome by the occasion.

I think the clear reality is that they are substantially better than us and it is very difficult for any side to beat them. We need to play our best rugby to do it.

It's not just a case of picking guys who haven't lost to them much so they're not phased by the situation.

I dispute that Giteau is our 'best' anything. That's probably where I'm starting from. He has looked excellent his entire career playing against most opposition. He's been quite regularly found out against the best. What's the point of perservering with that?

We're just going to lose again, and next year or the year after all these guys will be done, and the replacements will have no experience under their belts. Great.

 

[Braveheart81]

Let's pick To'omua at 12 then who also gets accused at times of running across field. (just like every 12 we pick).

Or pick Kerevi at 12 and then complain that Foley did nothing because the All Blacks managed to shut him down because they knew the play was only ever going one way.

We're almost certainly going to pick a ball player at 12 and it will be Giteau or To'omua. You'd probably assume based on previous selections that Giteau will get the first crack.

 

[Slim 293]

Best at what, though?

Giteau has never performed well against the All Blacks. None of his cross field crabbing has any effect at all. Yeah, he looks swish playing Super/Top rugby but that was always the case.

We're just going to be friggen mediocre whilst we keep playing these guys that were the cornerstones of teams that were mediocre.

So by that logic we don't pick Kerevi or DHP because they play in the two of the worst Super Rugby teams?

 

[Lorenzo]

So by that logic we don't pick Kerevi or DHP because they play in the two of the worst Super Rugby teams?

Er, no? I'm happy for them to play their own 10/20/30/40/50 tests before we judge whether they can cut it at test level. They're proven Super performers and deserve their shot. Giteau and the others have had their shot. We know what their ceiling is. And it's mediocre.

 

[Highlander35]

If we're arguing that players shouldn't be in the squad because we're rebuilding, then TPN is the one with the target on his back IMO. Hooker is an extremely important position, even moreso than the 12 and wing positions people are arguing over, and while Moore will likely make it to 2019, hopefully as the bench or 3rd string option, TPN chances are more akin to the snowballs. Hanson should bench every game this Bledisloe/Championship, and Ready should play at least 2 games in the Autumn Internationals.

Of course, that's not what's happening, and that's the right thing.

 

[Slim 293]

So who are we going to field after we turf the vast majority of our current squad for proving mediocre in recent years?

Somehow I don't think the 2015 Brisbane City NRC team is going to be an improvement...........

 

[Lorenzo]

So who are we going to field after we turf the vast majority of our current squad for proving mediocre in recent years?

Somehow I don't think the 2015 Brisbane City NRC team is going to be an improvement.....

I'm specifically talking about bringing back aging players that are not even as good as they were, and they weren't ever that good when they were peaking.

If it's such a good idea to bring back the older guys from France, why isn't New Zealand doing it?

 

[Lorenzo]

Our side's performance has been better with some or all of them in it.

Experienced players assist the inexperienced players and hopefully make them improve faster.

So why aren't the All Blacks doing it?