Australian Rugby / RA

[Mr Wobbly]

you've got to be joking - he was CEO of Rebels in 2011 when he handed the job to Steve Boland and CEO VRU until Aug 2013 when he handed the job to Peter Leahy. In 2013 he was in semi-retirement mode. Surely guys, we are not going to trawl through yesteryears blokes - we need someone with vision and strategies to grow and strengthen, not some old bloke who did a good job once. (Sorry Ross if you are reading this, no offence mate, you did a good job then, but this requires someone else IMO)

Like I said, he's too old now but he is someone that has (or at least had) vision and strategy. He took the VFL from struggle street, with a heap of broke and under performing clubs, and turned them into the AFL in ten years.

 

[James Pettifer]

The SS has been worth watching all season. If the future Is not built upon something like the SS, traditional teams playing in our time zones, then the future is bleak.

There are 3 ways to do it. The first is the VFL/AFL method which would involve taking the Shute Shield, expanding to incorporate teams outside of Sydney and cutting some of the Sydney teams. Of course, this has been tried a number of times with expansion to Canberra, Newcastle, Illawarra and the Central Coast - each time the SS has eventually told the expansion team to #$^* right off.
The second way is the A-League way. Take a combination of existing clubs and new clubs from around the country. Mix together and hope it works
The third way is the Big Bash way. Start from scratch. Have all of the top players and wait for a couple of years for people to catch on.

 

[wamberal]

We cannot start from scratch if we accept that traditional entities will need to be part of the future.


Even the Big Bash is based on traditional entities, they have fancy names, that's all.


The future has to encompass the best of the SS, and add the best of the rest, and has to be managed by an independent body. In other words, the SS would cease to exist.

 

[Braveheart81]

The future has to encompass the best of the SS, and add the best of the rest, and has to be managed by an independent body. In other words, the SS would cease to exist.

The problem with that though is that if the Sydney teams in a future competition were three Shute Shield teams, how much does having that tradition bring in fans who didn't follow one of those teams?

It's a challenge however you do it, but let's say you put Randwick, Sydney Uni and Manly as the three Sydney teams in a national competition, there are large portions of the Sydney rugby base who would struggle to support that.

 

[Brumby Runner]

And paid peanuts.which is why unfortunately I don't think we will end up with the calibre of candidate with the herculean will and skills to turn around what is the Titanic of rugby...

Are you suggesting Pulver was paid peanuts? If not, what leads you to think the next CEO will be on lower money than Pulver was? And, if that's your idea of peanuts, I have to say that you come from a very different mob of monkeys than I do.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Are you suggesting Pulver was paid peanuts? If not, what leads you to think the next CEO will be on lower money than Pulver was? And, if that's your idea of peanuts, I have to say that you come from a very different mob of monkeys than I do.

Compared to what leading sports administrators paid for other professional codes yes it is peanuts. All relative as might sound big dollars to you or I but about ARU would need a highly talented and successful sports administrator to turn this around and given poison chalice that is head of ARU position and money involved yes I believe it will be difficult to get the person of calibre needed.


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[Rugbynutter39]

Compared to what leading sports administrators paid for other professional codes yes it is peanuts. All relative as might sound big dollars to you or I but about ARU would need a highly talented and successful sports administrator to turn this around and given poison chalice that is head of ARU position and money involved yes I believe it will be difficult to get the person of calibre needed.


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And no I think with bill we got what we paid for but need someone much higher calibre than Bill


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[Dan54]

I am a little surprised there are not more names being bandied about, surely with all the calls for ARU board to resign , the people calling for it whether in the press or even on here must have alternatives in mind. Someone that calls for mass resignation without replacements in mind is just crazy, and really probably not really worth even listening to.

 

[No4918]

I am a little surprised there are not more names being bandied about, surely with all the calls for ARU board to resign , the people calling for it whether in the press or even on here must have alternatives in mind. Someone that calls for mass resignation without replacements in mind is just crazy, and really probably not really worth even listening to.

http://www.shoreoldboys.org.au/

There you go. I'm sure you'll find plenty of names to pick from.

 

[zer0]

http://www.shoreoldboys.org.au/

There you go. I'm sure you'll find plenty of names to pick from.

Was half expecting that site to be another Dismal special.

 

[No4918]

Was half expecting that site to be another Dismal special.

What is a Dismal special? I'm too scared to click on the links.

 

[daz]

Compared to what leading sports administrators paid for other professional codes yes it is peanuts. All relative as might sound big dollars to you or I but about ARU would need a highly talented and successful sports administrator to turn this around and given poison chalice that is head of ARU position and money involved yes I believe it will be difficult to get the person of calibre needed.


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It's also (arguably) barely in the top 5 of national sports in Australia, has a pretty low revenue base and a closed broadcast deal that is about the same operating model as the self-titled cable show in Wayne's World.

I'm not sure the new ARU CEO is going to be gunning for Gill McLachlan's salary.

 

[Sauron]

The problem with that though is that if the Sydney teams in a future competition were three Shute Shield teams, how much does having that tradition bring in fans who didn't follow one of those teams?

It's a challenge however you do it, but let's say you put Randwick, Sydney Uni and Manly as the three Sydney teams in a national competition, there are large portions of the Sydney rugby base who would struggle to support that.

Not only that, but rugby has an extremely narrow geographic range. If you were to start a national comp, it'd be geo/demographically logical for a couple of mergers of neighbouring teams, but then you'd lose some of the most passionate rivalries.

 

[TOCC]

The problem with that though is that if the Sydney teams in a future competition were three Shute Shield teams, how much does having that tradition bring in fans who didn't follow one of those teams?

It's a challenge however you do it, but let's say you put Randwick, Sydney Uni and Manly as the three Sydney teams in a national competition, there are large portions of the Sydney rugby base who would struggle to support that.

At the end of the day there is no perfect solution, look at the NRL and the North Sydney Bears, there are some who claim there are 500'000 who still consider themselves North Sydney Bear supporters or aligned. But, they all recognise they can't re-introduce another Sydney team.

If a competition born out of the Shute Shield/QPR were to be formed, clubs will be excluded and some fans of those teams may struggle to support that, for every team included there will be opportunity cost of those excluded. Which is why they would need to do conduct some proper analysis and find the teams which have the broadest support base, and the team likely to most appeal to new markets.

Its not easy task and is highly subjective i concede, but its increasingly a model which appeals to me. Just think some teams like UQ and Sydney Uni may struggle due to their ability to appeal to new markets, but bot teams are heavyweights in their respective competitions. So what then is the weighting between performance and future potential?

 

[Braveheart81]

At the end of the day there is no perfect solution.

I agree and in the end it may be better keeping some of those traditional clubs for a national competition rather than going with merged entities like the NRC teams.

The biggest challenge would be getting the Shute Shield (and QPR) to completely reorganise.

If the "professional team" from 3 Shute Shield clubs was to enter a new competition and then the grade teams continued playing Shute Shield and below you would need to find a way to ensure that the existence of the professional teams didn't destroy the competition below by making three clubs the haves and the rest the have nots.

It would definitely be challenging.

Maybe there's a better option still trying to work within the traditional landscape and have a NSW Waratahs side, a Sydney Shute side and then a Western Sydney side.

The idea being that the Sydney Shute side would try to leverage those who love club rugby but not the Waratahs and get them all to band together.

Of course there's then the Waratahs fans who have liked Super Rugby but might not be engaged with club rugby.

 

[Leo86]

Knowing absolutely nothing about shute and its traditional rivalries. I am naive.

In the NBL Melbourne had many teams over the years. In the end they were left with Tigers. Problem was any supporter of the other teams would not support the only team of Melbourne. The Tigers CEO who was a huge fan himself made the call for the good of Melbourne basketball and ended the Tigers and created Melbourne United. A team for all of Melbourne to get behind. Which they have.

My point is tradition while should be respected can hold back progress. Can the shute shield not operate seperate from the NRC? Can shute shield supporters not also support Rays, Eagles, Rams or Stars and promote the NRC? Going down the pick certain clubs and axe others route, take it from me, will hurt more than embracing another comp that keeps your own comp/teams/traditions/rivalries.

One again im naive to Shute, so please educate me if im so wrong and i meant no offence. Just an outsiders perspective.

 

[Hoolly Doolly]

Nah melb are still widely pissed about what happened to the melb tigers who still operate at state level.....ever wonder why andrew gaze is heavily involved with the tigers but coach sydney instead of melb united? We call them Melb Divided instead.
On the topic of NBL the league collapsed with its failed "sydney/melb success = code success". They were dellusional much like the ARU. The NBL demerged from Basketball Australia .......NBL to soley run proffessional league.......Basketball Australia to taker care of state leagues and growing at grassroots. FUARU needs to follow the same model. Either take care of the professional game or look after the rest. Not both.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

It's also (arguably) barely in the top 5 of national sports in Australia, has a pretty low revenue base and a closed broadcast deal that is about the same operating model as the self-titled cable show in Wayne's World.

I'm not sure the new ARU CEO is going to be gunning for Gill McLachlan's salary.

don't disagree which given magnitude of problems rugby faces and issues you raise which I concur with is why I am somewhat pessimistic we would get calibre of candidate required.


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[daz]

Of course there's then the Waratahs fans who have liked Super Rugby but might not be engaged with club rugby.

That is a very interesting point and well worth exploring, because I would suggest that there are many Super Rugby fans who have no tribal/locked on local club (Shute/Dewar/Premier/Pindan, etc) affiliation.

When I spent time in Perth, I got involved with Joondalup, because my son played for them, so lots of junior rugby, but I rarely watched any of the top level senior club rugby.

In Melbourne, I will occasionally go watch a Dewar game, but I don't really follow any particular team.

For me, my rugby affiliation and day to day support (time and money) is Melbourne Rising (NRC), Melbourne Rebels (Super Rugby) and the Wallabies (National).

I wonder if, teams aside, that level of engagement matches the experience of anyone else on these boards.

 

[MarkJ]

Same hear, I watch the odd club game but have no real strong connection. And I think that's the same for most of the Brumbies fans I know (a fairly small sample size admittedly).