Julia's Reign

[matty_k]

Have you read Bolt's latest missive on the issue.
From I understood of it was that is ok to write what ever you want about someone as long as it is raising an issue.

He also said that he almost quit because of The Australian removing the Milne piece and apologising. If only.

 

[Scotty]

Milne on behalf of the Australian lied to the readers so why would I trust the accuracy of anything quoted in the Australian?

Gillard lied to the Australian people on the eve of the last election. Does that mean I shouldn't trust anything anyone in the Labor party says?

 

[Scotty]

While we're on the GFC, here's the paper my economics professor wrote on it
http://epress.anu.edu.au/apps/bookworm/view/Agenda,+Volume+18,+Number+1,+2011/5511/valentine.xhtml

So he is basically saying that the government just threw money away? Fair summary?

 

[Bruwheresmycar]

Have you read Bolt's latest missive on the issue.
From I understood of it was that is ok to write what ever you want about someone as long as it is raising an issue.

He also said that he almost quit because of The Australian removing the Milne piece and apologising. If only.

I love how these journalists think media regulations are an infringement on free speech. If Andrew Bolt and co want to lie about Julia Gillard, they have an endless list of platforms to do so. Make a youtube account, a website, a blog! Stand in a pub, on his front lawn, in a community centre, at a local sporting club ect...

They are against being held to their own words, not against censorship. Also, the only censoring going on in this case is from News Limited Themselves!

 

[matty_k]

Gillard lied to the Australian people on the eve of the last election. Does that mean I shouldn't trust anything anyone in the Labor party says?

But they also won with a minority government. At what point do you think that the Government wouldn't be making compromises to take control?

Next

Lets say that LNP made the deal and took control do you really think they wouldn't be making similar compromises to to do so?

Also does anyone else remember the difference between core and non-core promises?

 

[Scotty]

But they also won with a minority government. At what point do you think that the Government wouldn't be making compromises to take control?

Next

Lets say that LNP made the deal and took control do you really think they wouldn't be making similar compromises to to do so?

Also does anyone else remember the difference between core and non-core promises?

Just pointing our the irony of a liar calling another liar a liar. Can't you see it?

 

[matty_k]

Exactly my point. Politics.

 

[matty_k]

Also the Malaysian "solution" has been shot down by the High Court.

 

[chief]

Milne was out of order with that article as Bolt was with his. Milne was of course News Limited Sunday Newspaper Editor. Chris Mitchell and John Hartigan I feel really have questions to answer. And Gillard has every right to be pissed. Although The Australian certainly leads with National Affairs Coverage, they have a lot of questions to answer and so many of the once every two week journalists are known with the Liberal Party. Van Onselen (Although he is as Anti-Abbott as Malcolm Turnbull), Nikki Savva, Chris Mitchell, Greg Sheridan and Glen Milne to name a few.

As for the Carbon Tax "lie", you think Gillard wanted to introduce a Carbon Tax. She knew it would be just about the end of her, but the reality is to get through an ETS the Independents and Greens wanted to start with a Carbon Tax. The debate for a ETS and Carbon tax are stupid as a ETS is just a significantly more market based mechanism, but still pretty much works as a tax. In fact Abbott lies every day, he just hasn't lied about a tax, and Australian's hate being lied about a tax. Especially when the video is clear as crystal (think Howard's "never ever GST"). Even though Howard took it to an election, they gave him a shellacking.

Australian politics pisses me off. But I'm sure glad, I don't live in America. God that Bachmann lady is a idiot, and Obama's bought them so much further into debt.

Also and wait for the WorkChoices scare campaign concocted by the Labor party and their bunch of Union officials into Abbott's claims he will bring back Individual Contracts.

 

[chief]

http://video.theaustralian.com.au/2113303507/Carbon-tax-protesters-abuse-Albanese

For the Albanese fans. This was absolute gold by Anthony Albanese. Absolute gold.

 

[Bruwheresmycar]

"how dare you call our convoy names...YOU MAGGOT"

LMAO...What a bunch of clowns.

 

[Scotty]

I can't help feel that Gillard is now getting what is coming to her. She is woeful inept, and is now leading the worst government for over 20 years. But particularly as she appears to have been one of the ones that convinced Rudd to drop the ETS, which ultimately sunk him, then promised no carbon tax before the election and now wants it all back.

The Australian people should have seen the writing on the wall, with her policy for political sake decision making. Now we are paying for it in a big way. The growing list of failures of this government is getting a little hard to believe.

 

[matty_k]

I can't help feel that Gillard is now getting what is coming to her. She is woeful inept, and is now leading the worst government for over 20 years. But particularly as she appears to have been one of the ones that convinced Rudd to drop the ETS, which ultimately sunk him, then promised no carbon tax before the election and now wants it all back.

The Australian people should have seen the writing on the wall, with her policy for political sake decision making. Now we are paying for it in a big way. The growing list of failures of this government is getting a little hard to believe.

You should have watched Q&A last night. The LNP rhetoric is that they are now the worst government since Federation.

 

[Scotty]

I'm not going to go that far. I assume you agree with me on the 20 year one though?

 

[chief]

I'm not going to go that far. I assume you agree with me on the 20 year one though?

Of course they (RUDD) was, worst since Whitlam. But we've had pretty good governments in the meantime. No one government since Whitlam has fucked Australia around significantly. Not one. Certainly Julia Gillard hasn't. But they aren't really that bad. I'll note a few failures under Rudd.

- BER handling (admittedly that was Gillard, but it had 97 percent accuracy, and it was mostly Swan and Rudd who went far with that stimulus
- The pink batts problem (ALL RUDD) not Garrett all Rudd
-Weak on tax reform (look to Swan and Rudd) Gillard has embraced it in some manner with Carbon Tax and widening the tax free threshold
-Stimulus- I think the stimulus was too much too fast, I've always thought this. You don't hand out 900 dollar cheques, and install a few quick fix stimulating sections of the economy (which ended up being far from value for money), and build a useless school hall somewhere else.

Most problems are Rudd's legacy. Which I think in 10 years time, he will be seen as one of the worst PM's ever. And the idea of having him back. It scares me. I know many will talk about NBN and Mining tax and Carbon Tax. But reality is, a lot of people agree with each one of these things. Admittedly the people used to want a Carbon Price. But they just don't want it called a tax.

Gillard's been a lousy saleswoman the last 12 months. Absolutely lousy. She's also been unlucky. This High Court blow could very well be the nail in her leadership coffin before she is replaced. And we all know this asylum seeker issue is absolute rubbish. But reality is Gillard's isn't going to be seen as one of the worst PM's ever. Many people will applaud the carbon tax in 20 years time (if climate change is true, I believe in it) and the carbon tax is really what will cost Gillard at the next election. She will go down as pretty bold, similar to Keating. Every Liberal/half of Labor used to despise Paul Keating in 1996, look at him now. He is celebrated by both sides of politics as without doubt Australia's best Treasurer.

This government isn't the worst since Federation, and the worst government since Whitlam's is Rudd's and not Gillard's. They really aren't that incompetent. Being said I think Swan should be moved.

 

[Bruwheresmycar]

Agree with that summary. The main problem with Labor is how they can't sell any of their reforms to the public. And how they are always fiddling around with the details of their reforms in an attempt to please any industry or political party that disagrees with them. That way, no one is ever sure what the actual reform will end up being. And the government end up looking like fools.

If they just got their crap sorted. Came up with a price on carbon, or a fair mining mining tax. Sold it to the public, implemented it and then used all the extra money to improve healthcare, education and living standards. They would be considered a good government by a lot of people. (I doubt this will become a reality anytime soon though)

Btw, I wouldn't take anything that lady said on Q&A last night seriously. I don't know who she is, but she could not be more bias/ignorant if she tried. "this is the worst government since federation"... Really? What was your opinion on the government in 1905? How much thought when into this claim? Not much I bet. I suppose there is always one person on the panel that causes viewers to lose brain cells during the process of watching the show.

 

[chief]

Just imagine with the benefit of hindsight what would occur had Abbott taken power. There would have been a stream of natural disasters, while the Coalition would have pursued a surplus by 2012-13 by making drastic cuts to spending. Don't forget there 10 billion dollar budget costings error. As well as administering there paid parental leave and Climate policy (which would have blown out in costs). Plus there Nauru solution would have been blocked by the High Court (embarrassment for Abbott). Plus he would be caught dealing with Labor's regulation in Industrial Relations which he promised he wouldn't amend. Which would have substantial internal rumblings. I know this is hypothetical but this country should be grateful we have a Gillard government.

 

[Ruggo]

Combet was outstanding on Q&A last night. I rate the bloke.

 

[Scotty]

Yep, I sure feel grateful. What an unbelievable statement, chief, and to compare Gillard to Keating is somewhat astounding. Actually not somewhat astounding, bloody hugely astounding. Keating wasn't disliked for his ability, he was disliked for his personality. Gillard is disliked for both. I can live with the accent and the rest of the personality, but I can't live with the complete lack of ability. She is most definitely not significantly better than Rudd, and we have no idea if Abbott would be a lot worse or not. At the moment I find it very difficult to contemplate anyone doing a worse job, even him!

Bru's first paragraph is a clear example of why you can't mention Gillard and Keating or Hawke or Howard in the same breath:

Agree with that summary. The main problem with Labor is how they can't sell any of their reforms to the public. And how they are always fiddling around with the details of their reforms in an attempt to please any industry or political party that disagrees with them. That way, no one is ever sure what the actual reform will end up being. And the government end up looking like fools.

Keating would never have done that. He would have decided on the policy, then implemented it.

It can't be that hard. Get the experts in, get the reports done, then work through to good policy. Labor's current way is to decide on a policy, announce it to everyone, then start listening to the experts and every other man and his dog.

 

[chief]

Yep, I sure feel grateful. What an unbelievable statement, chief, and to compare Gillard to Keating is somewhat astounding. Actually not somewhat astounding, bloody hugely astounding. Keating wasn't disliked for his ability, he was disliked for his personality. Gillard is disliked for both. I can live with the accent and the rest of the personality, but I can't live with the complete lack of ability. She is most definitely not significantly better than Rudd, and we have no idea if Abbott would be a lot worse or not. At the moment I find it very difficult to contemplate anyone doing a worse job, even him!

Bru's first paragraph is a clear example of why you can't mention Gillard and Keating or Hawke or Howard in the same breath:



Keating would never have done that. He would have decided on the policy, then implemented it.

It can't be that hard. Get the experts in, get the reports done, then work through to good policy. Labor's current way is to decide on a policy, announce it to everyone, then start listening to the experts and every other man and his dog.

In no way did I compare Keating's and Gillard's policy and political skills because Paul Keating is one of the main reasons this country is so prosperous today. Comparing Keating to Gillard is like comparing Kieran Read to Richard Brown. All I'm saying is that Gillard went ahead with a carbon tax not because she was forced into it, it is because she wanted to do it. I know you will talk about her lying about it before the election, but come on you and I both are intelligent enough to know an ETS is still a tax, and it has relatively the same effects as a flat price on carbon. Had Tony Abbott offered the Greens gay marriage, climate taxes and everything under the Greens dangerous manifesto, the Greens still would have said no. Because they lose their support base by supporting a Right Winger like Tony Abbott. Gillard was bold and wanted a Carbon price, and she negotiated it not straight to an ETS, but to a simple tax, then to be followed by an ETS.

She's incompetent at selling it, but there is no doubt this carbon tax is better than Kevin Rudd's. I have no doubt whatsoever. This tax incorporated tax reform, unlike Kevin Rudd's cash handouts. Much of the rationalists columnists like Paul Kelly applauded this reform.

I ask you over the last 15 months of Julia Gillard what has been that bad policy wise?

And please don't mention that she lied about a carbon tax. As for asylum seekers I will grant you that one.

Reality is, it hasn't been that bad. Gillard's been good compared to Rudd's micromanagement rubbish.