Kane Douglas

[Jiggles]

Sorry I really think 90% of what you post is dribble So I rule 10 myself with you. If I could use the ignore button I would.

 

[barbarian]

How can you rule 10 when you have never argued back? You just spout shite, I disagree, then you get snarky and don't respond constructively. You may well disagree, but never say why. It isn't like my views are waaay out there mate.
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[matty_k]

How about we all get back to talking about Kane Douglas. Which is what this thread is about.

It is pretty hard to single out his performance from this game and say sometime else should get a run instead. I doubt any of the other suggested names would have played better.

 

[ChargerWA]

Agreed Matty. Douglas has as much potential as any of the there or thereabouts lock in the Wallaby setup. His style is completely different to Timani's. I see Douglas to be the Brad Thorn type lock. Does the tough stuff you don't always notice.

Timani on the other hand, I can't really think of a comparative example in the modern game. His size and style make him fairly unique, which I think is why Robbie has perservered with him so long. If he can up the quantity and quality of his involvements consistently he could be anything.

 

[kiap]

Both Douglas and Shipperley should get more opportunities at test level.

My 2c on Cummins and Shipperley. Neither of these guys would probably be getting a chance without the injury toll but it's good to see them get a shot. Cummins is a robust player who can bust tackles in the backline. Wouldn't say he has magic hands but he is solid enough with the ball and almost always bends the line. Good size too and a strong defender. I'd compare him somewhat more to a player like Tomane, but I actually think the Honey Badger could end up as a centre, maybe in the mould of AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) of old. Diggers would be our #1 wing at the moment and combines power with some good footwork. Mitchell was our best finisher until he was crocked, but it took a few years before people saw him reach top level.

Shipperley is another good finisher (and not just with speed like Davies). Still a bit raw but with age on side. Scored ~10 tries for the Reds. Half were simple catch/fend/low-dive stuff (or backing up at pace against the Chiefs) but he also got some great ones. Bulls: step off left foot from almost standing start, beats Sideshow Bob all ends up to score. Force: step off right through the line, jink and then sheer pace to score. Rebels: step off right, pass outside, backup for the return and leg drive through two defenders to score. Bagged a couple against the Tahs including step off left, acceleration, swerve, jet shoes and fend. He has all the skills but will need to grow into any test role.

 

[DPK]

How can you rule 10 when you have never argued back? You just spout shite, I disagree, then you get snarky and don't respond constructively. You may well disagree, but never say why. It isn't like my views are waaay out there mate.
.

Surely this is conduct unbecoming of a moderator?

 

[Jiggles]

Both Douglas and Shipperley should get more opportunities at test level.

Rebels: step off right, pass outside, backup for the return and leg drive through two defenders to score.

That try against the Rebels was very intelligent. I enjoyed it for two reasons.

Firstly an Australian outside back thought to pass the ball rather than try and beat the man. Ball always beats man, period. More senior players like Beale, Ioane, AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper), JOC (James O'Connor) etc. always try and see how they can beat the man individually first before exploring other options. See the youtube clip below and the play from 34 Second onwards. From Memory a try is scored by Alexander over on the other side a phase or two later, but if JOC (James O'Connor) had drawn and passed to Cooper the try would have been done and dusted in that movement. I was at that game and swore my head off when JOC (James O'Connor) didn't pass.

Secondly, He backs up. I think the importance of backing up after you pass the ball has been lost, to some extent, in the modern game. I think this is a symptom of the first point I mention which is a player will try and beat the opposition individually first. More often and then not they are taken to ground and put out of the play for 2 phases. Shipperley draws his man, avoids contact and takes his defender out of the play, but at the same time keeps himself in the play. If Shipperley made the hit, that try would not have been scored whether he got the offload away or not.

 

[ChargerWA]

God that video is depressing

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Secondly, He backs up. I think the importance of backing up after you pass the ball has been lost, to some extent, in the modern game. I think this is a symptom of the first point I mention which is a player will try and beat the opposition individually first. More often and then not they are taken to ground and put out of the play for 2 phases. Shipperley draws his man, avoids contact and takes his defender out of the play, but at the same time keeps himself in the play. If Shipperley made the hit, that try would not have been scored whether he got the offload away or not.

A thousand times yes. It's the classic Mark Ella method. Pass the ball, back up and stay alive in the movement. The amount of times he would appear more than once in a backline move were more than I could count. There is nothing that different about the modern game that this couldn't still occur. To me it's just basic stuff, like catch - draw the man - pass. Rugby 101.

 

[Groucho]

You did watch Super Rugby this year. Shipperleys tries weren't just from a foot race..

Yes, for the Reds. As a neutral I consider him in the low second tier so far, below Turner who has a wonderful show reel of both Supe and test tries, and very far below JOC (James O'Connor), Ioane and Mitchell.

He might turn out to be good but being a cheerleader is no recommendation.

 

[Jiggles]

Yes, for the Reds. As a neutral I consider him in the low second tier so far, below Turner who has a wonderful show reel of both Supe and test tries, and very far below JOC (James O'Connor), Ioane and Mitchell.

He might turn out to be good but being a cheerleader is no recommendation.

I wouldn't really say his show reel is all that flash actually. He had an amazing 2007 and I had high hopes for him, but he has stalled big time.

He had most of the skills bar that explosiveness which you claim Shipperley doesn't have, however he certainly has more top end speed. I think being stuck on the back end of the Tah back line killed it for him.

Mitchell is done I think so you can scratch him off that list above. Of course he is below JOC (James O'Connor) and Ioane, no one is saying he isn't.

 

[barbarian]

A thousand times yes. It's the classic Mark Ella method. Pass the ball, back up and stay alive in the movement. The amount of times he would appear more than once in a backline move were more than I could count. There is nothing that different about the modern game that this couldn't still occur. To me it's just basic stuff, like catch - draw the man - pass. Rugby 101.

I thought Beale did this well on Saturday. Had a fair few second touches, which seems to be a feature of his game at 10 that I haven't seen much from QC (Quade Cooper), Barnes and JOC (James O'Connor).
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[fatprop]

I wouldn't really say his show reel is all that flash actually. He had an amazing 2007 and I had high hopes for him, but he has stalled big time.

He had most of the skills bar that explosiveness which you claim Shipperley doesn't have, however he certainly has more top end speed. I think being stuck on the back end of the Tah back line killed it for him.

Mitchell is done I think so you can scratch him off that list above. Of course he is below JOC (James O'Connor) and Ioane, no one is saying he isn't.

Mitchell is done? Lets hope not, he is just too good a player to see him disappear via chronic injury. (like Peter Hynes)

Shipperley could learn from both Mitchell and Turner. From Mitchell the ability to beat that first defender in ball carries and from Turner workrate without the ball (chasing kicks etc)

 

[#1 Tah]

Didnt Lachie have a 95% tackle success rate in his last full year of Super Rugby? IMO we need that if Beale, JOC (James O'Connor) and Quade (I said if, ok) are going to be in the team.

 

[barbarian]

Well it seems far from being 'done', Mitchell may well be available for the test against the ABs in Brisvegas.

An excerpt from this article about Beale's charges.

In other news, winger Drew Mitchell believes he will be fit for selection for the final Wallabies Test of the season, against the All Blacks in Brisbane on October 20.

Mitchell looked to be facing surgery and as much as a year on the sideline after rupturing a tendon in his ankle in Australia's 22-0 loss to New Zealand at Eden Park recently.

He was put in a stability boot before surgery but discovered on its removal that he was feeling no pain and indeed was able to run without discomfort.

"Ten days after the All Blacks Test, I was back running again," Mitchell said.

"I feel I will be ready for the Brisbane Test if they need me. The final box I would need to tick is proving I can get through a full Test week of training and that's a bit hard to prove at the moment when I'm only training with four other injured guys.

"Hopefully I'll be given the chance."

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[kiap]

Mitchell is done? Lets hope not, he is just too good a player to see him disappear via chronic injury. (like Peter Hynes)

Shipperley could learn from both Mitchell and Turner. From Mitchell the ability to beat that first defender in ball carries and from Turner workrate without the ball (chasing kicks etc)

Yeah, with some luck and hard work, Schmoo can make it back. We need players of his calibre. Just hope he is not pushed forward too early before full strength is back in the leg, which is what happened in last year's RWC, IMO (giving the benefit of the doubt on this year's comeback as being more bad luck). Like Horwill, he might be better served sitting out the EOYT and returning via Super Rugby next year.

Jiggles, Shipperley does have very good speed off the mark. 40m times are similar to Rocket Rod's. Also skilled in the air - the guy was winning balls off restarts against kiwi sides. We need more of this stuff. I despair about wobs restarts under this current coaching setup.

 

[Jiggles]

Mitchell is done? Lets hope not, he is just too good a player to see him disappear via chronic injury. (like Peter Hynes)

Shipperley could learn from both Mitchell and Turner. From Mitchell the ability to beat that first defender in ball carries and from Turner workrate without the ball (chasing kicks etc)

I hope not too. But chronic injury in outside backs is something that scares me, alot. I was very critical of bringing him back to early this year into tests, and look what happened (I also got laughed at by some on this thread by voicing that concern, but what ever). I hope the ARU shows some sense and tells him to chill the fuck out and get ready for next years Super Rugby. He is still young with time on his side and this needs to be managed properly.

 

[Aussie D]

Unfortunately jiggles with the current injury crisis the likelihood of Drew (and Kev, Pocock, etc) being told to sit out the EOYT is highly unlikely. The only chance of these guys being given time off, IMHO, is if there is a coaching change as RD will want every fit available bod he can to shore up his position whereas a new coach can label the tour an opportunity to develop depth prior to the Lions tour.

 

[Jiggles]

If Deans has the attitude of a lame duck then he should just resign.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

I thought Beale did this well on Saturday. Had a fair few second touches, which seems to be a feature of his game at 10 that I haven't seen much from QC (Quade Cooper), Barnes and JOC (James O'Connor).
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Sounds good. Unfortunately I'm travelling at the moment and haven't seen any of last weekend's action.