New Zealand vs Australia - Bledisloe 2, 24th August 2013

[ACT Crusader]

I think intimidated is overstating it a bit but I do think that when the ABs get to this point in their cycle of world domination there is a tendency by the refs to go soft on them.
From the refs point of view if every incident talked about on this thread had been penalised the way the posters from both sides think it should have been there wouldnt have been much of a game: that tells me there's a lot of room for discretion and for disagreement.

I can't comment on your first sentance IS, as I believe that is more a perception thing than anything else. I'm not an avid reader of stats or don't religiously review each whistle (and non-whistle) and don't compile a list of the 'controversial' calls. I admit that in the early 2000s I thought George Smith "always" played with his knee's on the ground but yet would miraculously wind up with the ball with ref's waving play on.

Whilst that was the cause of great frustration and threats to do damage to the TV, I must admit I do like the human element that remains in rugby officiating that provides for that discretion of the ref which will result in disagreement for sure.

I remember back in 2005 I attended the OZ v NZ schoolboys match at Viking Park in Tuggeranong. Was surrounded by Aussie supporters with Eddie Jones sitting right in front of me. It was the close minutes of the game, OZ hot on attack with Beale and Cooper and Turner playing really well for OZ, but NZ was up on the scoreboard. A tackle happens, one of the NZ loosies, Michael Coman comes swooping in and plays for the steal, the crowd around me goes up in a collective "come on ref", I yell back "he's on his feet" and immediately after I yell the ref blows his whistle and awards the penalty to NZ because OZ player was holding on. Eddie Jones turns around and gives me a wry smile as if to say, well done.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

I can't comment on your first sentance IS, as I believe that is more a perception thing than anything else. I'm not an avid reader of stats or don't religiously review each whistle (and non-whistle) and don't compile a list of the 'controversial' calls. I admit that in the early 2000s I thought George Smith "always" played with his knee's on the ground but yet would miraculously wind up with the ball with ref's waving play on.

Whilst that was the cause of great frustration and threats to do damage to the TV, I must admit I do like the human element that remains in rugby officiating that provides for that discretion of the ref which will result in disagreement for sure.

I remember back in 2005 I attended the OZ v NZ schoolboys match at Viking Park in Tuggeranong. Was surrounded by Aussie supporters with Eddie Jones sitting right in front of me. It was the close minutes of the game, OZ hot on attack with Beale and Cooper and Turner playing really well for OZ, but NZ was up on the scoreboard. A tackle happens, one of the NZ loosies, Michael Coman comes swooping in and plays for the steal, the crowd around me goes up in a collective "come on ref", I yell back "he's on his feet" and immediately after I yell the ref blows his whistle and awards the penalty to NZ because OZ player was holding on. Eddie Jones turns around and gives me a wry smile as if to say, well done.

Its all perception and I'm biased - but, as Tony Soprano would say, "what're you gonna do?"

 

[badabing59]

I think the key word is "towards", which was @Groucho's point

Fair enough. I sincerely hope that you can move upwards in the rankings, as it rankles me (and probably most of the sthn. hemisphere) that the poms have moved into third place by default. Just keep your eyes off #1 spot

 

[cyclopath]

Fair enough. I sincerely hope that you can move upwards in the rankings, as it rankles me (and probably most of the sthn. hemisphere) that the poms have moved into third place by default. Just keep your eyes off #1 spot

#1 is over the horizon for now, so the only Aussies seeing it work at Pine Gap.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

#1 is over the horizon for now, so the only Aussies seeing it work at Pine Gap.

Can someone help me with this: are we any chance of rising in the rankings given that we have to play the 1 and 2 best teams in the world in a round robin competition on a yearly basis?
England haven't played a game for months and yet we dropped below them - how come we don't get to go up the ranking by not playing?

 

[cyclopath]

Can someone help me with this: are we any chance of rising in the rankings given that we have to play the 1 and 2 best teams in the world in a round robin competition on a yearly basis?
England haven't played a game for months and yet we dropped below them - how come we don't get to go up the ranking by not playing?

England must look better not playing than we do. Unless they don't play in purple, when they look like Tellytubbies.

 

[Scrubber2050]

You mean like if the All Blacks had had a likely try disallowed for a dubious forward pass, or if the Wallabies had infringed every time the All Blacks got into the attacking zone, or if the Wallabies had given away 16 penalties, many of them cynical with no yellow cards or even a warning and Hooper had spent most of the game offside?

Yeah, the thread would have been heaps different.

you must have watched a different game - shit, from the sound of it the wallabies should have all been rubbed and the penalty count 100 to none in favour of the Blacks - at least acknowledge the Ref was poor.......

 

[Inside Shoulder]

England must look better not playing than we do. Unless they don't play in purple, when they look like Tellytubbies.

Maybe we should first work on how well we dont play: that might be easier

 

[Nathan's]

Apologies that it has to come to this, but it's becoming ridiculous. These laws are straight from the IRB:

Law 15.5 g) If a player is tackled near the goal line, that player can immediately reach out and ground the ball on or over the goal line to score a try or make a touch down.

Therefore, Stephen Moore scored. Double Movement does not exist in Rugby Union.


Law 10.2 a) A player must not intentionally infringe any Law of the Game, or play unfairly. The player who intentionally offends must be either admonished, or cautioned that a send off will result if the offence or a similar offence is committed, or sent off.

A penalty try must be awarded if the offence prevents a try that would probably otherwise have been scored. A player who prevents a try being scored through foul play must either be cautioned and temporarily suspended or sent off.

Both Aaron Smith and Kieran Reid committed foul play, intentionally denying us a try. One (or both) should have AT LEAST been warned. We got neither. Peyper didn't even follow his own laws.

Would have been a whole different ball game if the All-Blacks were 14-0 down and with 14 men.

There are other points but 2 is enough.

http://www.irblaws.com/downloads/IRB_Laws_2013_EN.pdf

 

[badabing59]

Can someone help me with this: are we any chance of rising in the rankings given that we have to play the 1 and 2 best teams in the world in a round robin competition on a yearly basis?
England haven't played a game for months and yet we dropped below them - how come we don't get to go up the ranking by not playing?

Not sure there is an easy answer to this as we appear to play a lot more matches than our nthn hemispehere colleagues. Reasonably speaking, we SANZAR countries should always be in the top three because of this.

Have you looked at how the rankings are calculated? I just had an aneurysm trying to make head nor tail of it. What happened to three points for a win, two for a draw, one for a loss, or something like that

 

[cyclopath]

Not sure there is an easy answer to this as we appear to play a lot more matches than our nthn hemispehere colleagues. Reasonably speaking, we SANZAR countries should always be in the top three because of this.

Have you looked at how the rankings are calculated? I just had an aneurysm trying to make head nor tail of it. What happened to three points for a win, two for a draw, one for a loss, or something like that

Problem when you let accountants into anything.
Waits for accountants to fire up.........
5,4,3,2,1.........

 

[Dam0]

you must have watched a different game - shit, from the sound of it the wallabies should have all been rubbed and the penalty count 100 to none in favour of the Blacks - at least acknowledge the Ref was poor...

I acknowledge the ref was poor.

I don't accept the prevailing view around here that the Wallabies were any less cynical than the All Blacks. I saw an awful lot of offside play, infringing on the ground, not rolling aways etc etc from the Wallabies, some of which was picked up, much of which was not. Frankly, it looked like much of it was a deliberate ploy. Last week there were calls for the All Blacks to be YC'ed for persistent infringement after 11 PK's, this week the Wallabies gave away 16. Does that not give you at least a moment of pause?

As I said once before, people are very quick to see the offences of the opposition but slow to see their own. I stand by that statement.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Not sure there is an easy answer to this as we appear to play a lot more matches than our nthn hemispehere colleagues. Reasonably speaking, we SANZAR countries should always be in the top three because of this.

Have you looked at how the rankings are calculated? I just had an aneurysm trying to make head nor tail of it. What happened to three points for a win, two for a draw, one for a loss, or something like that

I've looked at it and, like you it seems, my brain hurt afterwards so I just wait for the guys around here who know what's going on to explain it.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

I don't accept the prevailing view around here that the Wallabies were any less cynical than the All Blacks. I saw an awful lot of offside play, infringing on the ground, not rolling aways etc etc from the Wallabies, some of which was picked up, much of which was not.

Are you saying we don't even cheat as well or as much as you?

 

[Dam0]

Are you saying we don't even cheat as well or as much as you?

Actually IS, given that I believe we scored 3 tries under PK advantage last week, and 1 this week, you lot need to improve your cheating significantly. Even when you lot cheat we still sometimes score.

I'm not one to make videos these days, but perhaps if you take a look at the first try the All Blacks scored (the one not scored under advantage), starting at the ruck at 26:20. I count 3 offences before we eventually score 1 phase later:

#Look at Genia immediately after the first tackle is made, he deliberately loiters and obstructs the oncoming players
#Hooper is offside at the first ruck (marginal perhaps, but I don't think he is ever onside, even before the hands go on)
#At the next tackle, one of the tacklers, Gold 3(I think?) loiters and deliberately gets in the way of the halfback in order to slow us down.

Despite all this we manage to score in the corner anyway. None of these are major offences, and I am not in the least bit upset that Peyper didn't call advantage for them, but are these not exactly the sort of stuff that you lot always accuse the All Blacks of doing? I reckon I could go through the whole tape and find examples of this stuff over and over all game if I really wanted to.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Dam0 I'm trying to avoid trading videos and I'm somewhat hampered by having forgotten my foxsport password and it taking 3 hours - and counting - to get it reset.
In Bled 1 there was a classic when Franks was standing stock still for many seconds between Genia and To'omua. We eventually got a penalty for some other infringement but it is burnt in my minds eye. It was scandalous and not a word was said.

 

[Dam0]

I'll take your word for it.

Anyways I am out. See you next week for the Boks.

 

[Blue]

Wow, You found an unnoticed infringement in a rugby match. Amazing. Who would have thought?

Every time the Wobs end up on the wrong side of a ref is a little bit of payback for Lawrence-gate.

Karma. She's a real biatch.

You're welcome.

 

[Dan54]

you must have watched a different game - shit, from the sound of it the wallabies should have all been rubbed and the penalty count 100 to none in favour of the Blacks - at least acknowledge the Ref was poor...

Actually Scrubber,I thought I was on wrong thread. I just got home from Wellington, and reading a little the thread I thought I had watched different game, perhaps I missed a lot, but I had feeling ref was reasonable, Wallabies were pretty well beaten, and look like they are playing rugby that is out of date by a couple of years!! But anyway I tired an will look a bit better tomorrow!!

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Wow, You found an unnoticed infringement in a rugby match. Amazing. Who would have thought?

Every time the Wobs end up on the wrong side of a ref is a little bit of payback for Lawrence-gate.

Karma. She's a real biatch.

You're welcome.

Unnoticed? Do you think Joubert and Franks were chatting?
You deserve this: