Northern Hemisphere Rugby Season 14/15

[boyo]

Playing for Northampton? - Tell him he's dreaming.

 

[caymantim]

Fingers crossed Keatley will step up now having won this particular battle. Waiting for the bullshit out of English and Welsh supporters about how this is the brave new world.

I'd suggest part of the move is because Keatley had already won that battle... the last few weeks exposure simply not enough. I know Munster were aware (concerned) they had not given him enough exposure, and that had limited his development... so this will not be entirely surprising, but surely extremely disappointing. JJ is a great kid, and I am sure will be back to his roots at some point and overall it could work out for Irish rugby. Big loss though.

 

[the plastic paddy]

I'd suggest part of the move is because Keatley had already won that battle. the last few weeks exposure simply not enough. I know Munster were aware (concerned) they had not given him enough exposure, and that had limited his development. so this will not be entirely surprising, but surely extremely disappointing. JJ is a great kid, and I am sure will be back to his roots at some point and overall it could work out for Irish rugby. Big loss though.

I agree it is a big loss but the branch couldn't do more than offer him a three year contract. Lots of spin now, probably from JJ's agent Fintan Drury, that the reason for the move could be the Saints coaching ticket. Anyway, best of luck to JJ, I think he will need it just to stay fit but I hope I am wrong.

 

[caymantim]

Yeah agreed, they seem to have pulled out all the stops - and maybe he (or his mgr) not appreciating the benefits of the great comp against Keatley (plus they seem to get on well too, learning from each other). Biggest concern in my mind is it does add to their depth concerns! Centre depth an issue and now 10... although with Tyler Bleyendaal coming (hopefully...)

 

[mxyzptlk]

Waiting for the bullshit out of English and Welsh supporters about how this is the brave new world.

Did that brave new world emerge when Geordan Murphy or Leo Cullen went to Leicester?

Have to wonder if this move would have even been a question had Hanrahan been getting some more regular time at 12. Foley and MOC have that in common -- leaving a talented back on the bench and/or out of position to the detriment of both the player and the team.

In Foley's case, Hanrahan offered an attacking option that the team could use, but his lack of playing time meant the team could never settle in with him on the pitch. End result: Hanrahan goes someplace where he'll get more play.

In MOC's case, Madigan was benched or started at 12 while Noel Reid rode the pine, which meant Madigan never got the optimum time necessary to settle in at 10 (and Madigan's a more obvious 10 option than Hanrahan at this point, especially at the national level). End result: Madigan's been good lately at 10, but mainly out of his own talent, and is still working on the thing he was criticized before -- game management.

If Gopperth ends up coming off the bench for Goode at Wasps, MOC should take that into account when considering his starting 15; he chose limited certainty over development, and that didn't do much for either player.

 

[the plastic paddy]

JJ sees himself as a 10 rather than a 12, (I happen to agree with him on that). I think JJ 10 Keatley 12 worked well last year but this season Hurley has grabbed hold of the 12 jersey. JJ has done nothing to suggest he should be starting ahead of Keatley at 10. He thinks he should be. He thinks he will see more rugby at the Stains, I think he will be disappointed.

 

[mxyzptlk]

JJ sees himself as a 10 rather than a 12, (I happen to agree with him on that).

So does Madigan, but when Hanrahan isn't getting on the pitch like he wants to, he has to consider whether he'd rather play or pout -- so did Madigan.

Hanrahan can play 10, 12 and 15, no? I don't begrudge him leaving for Northampton, but like you, I doubt he'll see more time at 10 than he did at Munster. And he's not going to develop if he's not getting game time, and he's not even third on the national pecking order of 10's. That's why I think if he wanted to improve as a rugby player, he'd be better off playing in a position that gets him game time, and then as he improved overall he could make his push for 10. He certainly showed he could offer something there.

 

[Lee Grant]

He thinks he will see more rugby at the Stains,

It took me a while to realise how funny that was.

One of your best P. Paddy.

And are Nigels really Englis?
.

 

[JSRF10]

Foley seemed bemused as to why he left doesn't look well on his man management skills. He'll be a loss for Munster but given the coin on offer it wasn't a surprise that he look the queens shilling. It will be interesting to see if he turns out to be Jeremy Staunton or return home in a couple of years as the new ROG

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[mxyzptlk]

Foley seemed bemused as to why he left doesn't look well on his man management skills. He'll be a loss for Munster but given the coin on offer it wasn't a surprise that he look the queens shilling. It will be interesting to see if he turns out to be Jeremy Staunton or return home in a couple of years as the new ROG

Heard Gerry Thornley on Off the Ball saying when Munster counter-offered the Saints contract, they came close to matching Saints offer salary and added an extra year (3 vs 2 years at Saints). If so, that makes it even more gutting, because it suggests JJ sees better things in store at Northampton than at Munster (and it can't just be Alan Moore). Either that, or Hanrahan thinks he has a better chance at pushing Myler for the 10 jersey than he does Keatley.

As an Irish Yank, I'd would have loved to have seen Hanrahan playing behind Samu Manoa in the pack, but even that's out the window.

As for man management, I keep hearing how Foley can be a bit chummy with some of the more established players he's known for a long time. I wonder if Hanrahan's loss is a reflection of that. I hope not.

Any word on Rob Horne? Saw some noise that Munster were trying to bring him in.

 

[the plastic paddy]

The best place JJ could have gone, if he wanted guaranteed game time at 10 was Connacht. Mallinder, the Stains coach, is already talking about JJ's ability to play 12. I just don't think this will end well. However, I thought it was a three year deal but if it is only two that is not so bad. Solid BP wins for Munster and Leinster today including Keith Earls off the bench against the Zebras. Time to get psyched up for the Ultimate Nigels next weekend.

The Nigels is a rather polite euphemism for the women's areas who run club rugby in England and now, sadly, Europe.

 

[mxyzptlk]

Solid BP wins for Munster and Leinster today including Keith Earls off the bench against the Zebras.

I only caught the first half of the Leinster game, but it sure looks like they may have uncovered a new class of back rowers. In their last two games Leinster just look a bit more insistent and urgent, but not rushing as much, so they're making fewer mistakes. Maybe those are rose-colored glasses because they've won two in a row and are playing better, but that back row is definitely promising.

 

[the plastic paddy]

Conan is very good, between him and Jack O'Donoghue at Munster, the future of Irish number eights looks very bright.

 

[the plastic paddy]

Saracens lock George Kruis has been cited for a tip tackle. Would help Munster's cause if he is banned. Munster team I am hoping for, injuries permitting is:

1 Cronin. 2 Casey. 3 Botha. 4 Foley. 5 POC. 6. POM 7. TOD 8. Stander 9. Murray 10. Keatley 11. Zebo 12. Hurley 13. Howard. 14. Conway 15. Jones.

16. Guinazu 17. Ryan 18. Archer 19. Holland 20. Dave O'Callaghan. 21. Williams 22. JJ Hanrahan 23. Earls.

If Copeland is fit he will probably be on the bench ahead of DOC II. Praying Casey is fit.

 

[the plastic paddy]

Doubts about Murray with a neck problem. Hopefully it is kidology from Axel to lull Saracens into a false sense of security. Saracens seem to be so obsessed with keeping the "red plague" as they call Munster supporters out of their stadium that they are going to leave empty seats rather than let Munster supporters buy return tickets.

 

[the plastic paddy]

Hopefully, Murray is OK, it is rumoured.

 

[JSRF10]

Pray for that Ulster pack they are going to get eaten alive regardless of whether Toulon have a flu throughout their team or not.

Murrays injury pretty much kills Munsters chances. If they won nothing would come close to the epicness of that victory.

Leinster looks like a decent selection. The end is nigh for Dorce and Ross great servants both but as John Hayes showed once you slip its tough to come back

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[the plastic paddy]

Pray for that Ulster pack they are going to get eaten alive regardless of whether Toulon have a flu throughout their team or not.

Murrays injury pretty much kills Munsters chances. If they won nothing would come close to the epicness of that victory.

Leinster looks like a decent selection. The end is nigh for Dorce and Ross great servants both but as John Hayes showed once you slip its tough to come back

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Duncan Williams has played very well this year. We have a near first choice pack and a strong bench albeit no scrum half cover which will not be good for the nerves. Saracens are favourites but Munster are not forlorn.

 

[Bardon]

Poor results today for both Ulster and Munster. Leisnter had a good result albeit against a struggling Castre. At most there will only be one Irish province in the QF of the European Rugby Cup and I can't say I've change my opion of the quality of the Irish sides this year which I have expressed earlier in the thread.

To me it seems that this year the Irish sides have sunk to the level of the Scottish and Welsh sides. Normally I'd expect the Irish teams to rise above the level of the Pro12 and deliver in the Heineken Cup/ERC but this year they've performed to the standard of the Welsh and Scottish teams.

Neither Munster nor Ulster were a real threat in their group and Leinster's best performance has come against a team that everyone has been beating this season. I haven't seen anything from Leinster that would put them down as potential winners but what they've done differently to Ulster and Munster is that they've gotten results when the odds were against them. They're still in with a chance but it's a slim one.

As for the other 2 provinces. Ulster did suffer very badly with injuries this season. They uses 3 scrum halves and 3 out halves in today's game. But even when they've had a full side they've seemed to lack the mental edge that champions have. Maybe next season they'll have a better run but they need to shake the bottlers label they have presently. They remind me of Leinster before Cheika arrived.

Munster are clearly in a transition season after Penny's experiment of trying to play Super Rugby up north fell flat on it's face. There are some good signs from what Foley has done with the squad but they are still far too inconsistent to say it's job done. I'd expect them to be far more competitive next year, especially in the pack, but it may be another season again before they get their backs sorted and can be genuine contenders.

I still stick by what I said before that Schmidt faces the unusual problem of restoring the confidence of players who are under performing for their provinces when he has them in the green jersey.

 

[BabyBlueElephant]

Leinster look to be coming into very good form. You can say they beat an average Castres side but European form is different to domestic form. Look at Munster down the years, or Dortmund in the champions league this season, topping their group yet 17th in a relegation battle in the Bundesliga. Leinster should've walloped a poor Quins side before Christmas, beating a team no matter how poor still requires execution and guile and they had that in abundance like the Leinster of old. This is precisely where they want their form to be heating up, lets see how Wasps next we goes first though.

Munster had a poor game and Sarries feed on that. Munster were a level below this tournament, Sarries at Thomond aside they were poor every game. Next season I'm sure it'll be different with the coaching more bedded in. Shame JJ has left, a player like that is a light of hope in a dark season as you can look to them to raise the team. Munster have let their X Factor and 2012 Junior RWC player of the year runner up leave.

Ulster have been awful too, shipping 60 points theres no way to disguise how awful Ulster are currently. An Irish team on a bad day should be shipping no more than 30 no matter who they're playing. Ulster admittedly had a weakened side, no motivation etc but hell they're a proud province that will hurt them.

Its not all doom and gloom things just didn't go the way of Ulster and Munster this year, if they manage to qualify for next years tournament, I'm sure it'll be a different story altogether. But on a final note, how much more tempting is it to buy an import for a team? I can't see an Irish or English team doing this yet as of their management, but the urge to buy a player to is ever stronger due to the higher competition. Things might get a bit crazy the next few years I fear.