School sporting scholarships/recruitment

[WLF]

Looked at another way, one should choose the school to produce well-rounded people. The Christian Brothers established schools to teach the poor (you could argue that Brisbane never got the memo) and that is largely the reason why the fees are low and the social justice component high. The idea is to make it as accessible to as many as possible and to give them opportunities. In that regard it's the odd person out in the CAS (Jesuits have always been a bit more mercenary in that regard) Hence it will happily produce tradies as readily as teachers, doctors or lawyers. My son thoroughly enjoyed his time at Waverley and is doing Arts/Law at Sydney Uni so I'm pretty happy with its academic output, its egalitarian nature (oh, and its rugby program too). So for a third of the cost I think I got a very well-rounded, academically successful and socially aware graduate who wonders why parents pay such high fees for their kids to go to the schools he used to play against.

That's the problem when you generalise - you paint a picture that can be very misleading.

BJ,

A story not widely known.

One of the major reasons as to why Waverley is cheaper than most other private schools is very simple.
For many many decades Waverley had a large contingent of Christian Bros whose teaching wages was next to nil, so the cost of running the business was much lower than schools who have to pay attractive salaries to lay teachers.

Some other schools with Jesuits etc may not have chosen to do the same, or there maybe other reasons why their fee structure is high. I think Waverley's fees will probably rise disproportionally over the upcoming years.

I don't believe other schools who charge 2 times more than Waverley deliver that, but it's up to each family and as long as you are happy with your chosen school, who cares.

Remember, all these boys are very lucky.

 

[Show and go]

Another attraction is that Waverley is running a very good rugby program with quality coaching, so parents can be assured their sons will be given every chance to develop as players and which will also enhance their chances of making CAS and State teams.
If parents are happy with the standard of education at the school, then the rugby benefits are a bonus, on top of the cheaper fees.

Good to see some outstanding rugby players from out west have seen the light and moved to Waverley since the new headmaster has arrived . I’m sure at least 4-5 of these new boys will be play Cas Reps in U16s or Opens , very talented and Waverley will be tough to beat in those age groups.
As u stated previously Waverley don’t offer schlorships so these boys must really be taken in by the rugby programme ?

 

[sidelineview]

And as has been noted a few pages back, Marcellin Randwick outperforms Waverley in the HSC for 1/2 the cost.

And as was also pointed out, you're clutching at straws to win arguments. The comparative difference in the rankings between the two schools was bugger all (145th place vs 159th)
Silly arguments really, such as ones based on semantics: infer vs imply.

Anyway, as mentioned there can be many varied reasons as to why a parent would choose a particular school for their rugby playing son. ''Well rounded'' was a good term used. Parents can be attracted to a school that can provide a well rounded education for their son.
As well as offering a quality rugby program for their rugby mad son.

This was in relation to the so-called ''recruitment'' of new players.

Fees are a factor for working class families and Waverley is reasonable, costing about $14K a year.
Marcellin College charge around $6K, but they dont play rugby; it's a league school.

The academic standing of a school can be put into perspective alongside other considerations.

It's interesting to note that selective public high schools, such as James Ruse High, North Sydney Boys High, Baulkum Hills High which in theory are free ( I think the selective schools charge parents an annual fee of less than $1K) ranked higher in HSC results than Knox College with annual fees of about $31K.
Penrith High School, Sydney Technical College & Caringbah High ranked higher than Trinity College with fees as high as Knox.

As an aside, NSW Rugby has announced a joint venture with NSW Sports High Schools to provide pathway support for public schools. It's a small step in the right direction.

 

[sidelineview]

Good to see some outstanding rugby players from out west have seen the light and moved to Waverley since the new headmaster has arrived . I’m sure at least 4-5 of these new boys will be play Cas Reps in U16s or Opens , very talented and Waverley will be tough to beat in those age groups.
As u stated previously Waverley don’t offer schlorships so these boys must really be taken in by the rugby programme ?

I had previously stated that which was true to the best of my knowledge Your Honour.

Scholarships are mentioned on Waverley's website but I had never known of a rugby playing student whose parents were receiving financial assistance. I had also previously stated that Waverley were fortunate enough to have had a very talented group of Opens players in the last couple of years. From memory only one of those players was new to the school in Year 11, so they all came through the age groups from Year 7. There was nothing fishy about that.
It's a cyclic thing and it also coincided with an improvement in the rugby program and standard of coaching, and that will continue this year.
The College has a good reputation now as a rugby school, and thats the result of a lot of hard work and planning, but there's been some lean times in the past; some ups and downs.

As also mentioned above the fees are reasonable.

I dont know if scholarships are being offered now; if they are then good luck to any parents who receive the benefits and good luck to the students who'll no doubt enjoy their time at the College.

But as mentioned, there can be many reasons as to why a parent chooses to enroll their sons in a school. It cant be assumed it's because they have been offered a scholarship.

 

[Quick Hands]

Can we please get over the cost of fees as to why people, in this case,rugby players, go to Waverley or anywhere else.

With the greatest respect, it was a number of Waverley posters who introduced the cost of fees issue into the discussion, so it's only natural that others would respond.

BJ,



One of the major reasons as to why Waverley is cheaper than most other private schools is very simple.
For many many decades Waverley had a large contingent of Christian Bros whose teaching wages was next to nil, so the cost of running the business was much lower than schools who have to pay attractive salaries to lay teachers.

Some other schools with Jesuits etc may not have chosen to do the same, or there maybe other reasons why their fee structure is high. I think Waverley's fees will probably rise disproportionally over the upcoming years.

I don't believe other schools who charge 2 times more than Waverley deliver that, but it's up to each family and as long as you are happy with your chosen school, who cares.

Remember, all these boys are very lucky.

Including you it seems?

 

[Quick Hands]

And as was also pointed out, you're clutching at straws to win arguments.

No, because if you go back over the past couple of pages, you will see that it was a number of Waverley posters who introduced the issue of fees into the discussion. If people are going to rely on the cost of fees as part of a discussion, it's perfectly valid for others to comment on fees.

Silly arguments really, such as ones based on semantics: infer vs imply..

I have never made such a comment

 

[Quick Hands]

Fees are a factor for working class families and Waverley is reasonable, costing about $14K a year.
Marcellin College charge around $6K, but they dont play rugby; it's a league school.

.

If you don't want to talk about fees, why do you keep bringing it up?

 

[Up the Guts]

Very sad.
It’s part of the problem: the kids derive their sense of worth from a game that can be cruel. The schools that use the talent for marketing opportunity have a very heavy obligation to equip them with a bit more than a 1st Xv jersey.

I remember a couple of years back at Scots hearing that those on Rugby Scholarships doing pathways would just sit around in the library for most of the day without any work to do. Problem for the superstars who were brought into play is that their whole life became focussed on rugby before they turned professional.

 

[WLF]

With the greatest respect, it was a number of Waverley posters who introduced the cost of fees issue into the discussion, so it's only natural that others would respond.
Including you it seems?

QH,

I agree, I was referring at anyone who brings up fees, I don't think it's really necessary.

Not sure what you mean by "including you it seems", if you mean I was lucky to go there then yes you are correct.
All boys who go to these schools have a good start to life.

 

[sidelineview]

QH: No, because if you go back over the past couple of pages, you will see that it was a number of Waverley posters who introduced the issue of fees into the discussion. If people are going to rely on the cost of fees as part of a discussion, it's perfectly valid for others to comment on fees


The "Clutching at straws" comment was not in relation to your mention of fees specifically.
It was in response to your
And as has been noted a few pages back, Marcellin Randwick outperforms Waverley in the HSC for 1/2 the cost.
Marcellin ranked 145th vs Waverley 159th = bugger all


As i pointed out quite a few selective public schools outperformed private schools such as Knox, Barker & Trinity in HSC rankings, for a fraction of the cost.

Dont throw a blanket over all ''Waverley posters'' to try to win the arguments. We're not all joined at the brain.
Fees are a relevant part of the equation in parents choosing a school for their sons, for obvious reasons, and amoungst other important considerations.

As sensibly pointed out earlier, there can be many and varied reasons why a parent chooses a particular school for their son, particularly a rugby playing son.
This was regarding new Waverley players, who haven't necessarily received scholarships or have been actively ''recruited'' by the school.

 

[Spieber]

Is the bigger problem players from a wide geographical area being recruited by junior clubs rather than being recruited by people associated with a school?

 

[sidelineview]

Is the bigger problem players from a wide geographical area being recruited by junior clubs rather than being recruited by people associated with a school?

Not all schools play rugby but in a perfect world they would and a local Club would be associated with the school/s to form a good working relationship which is mutually beneficial. A consideration of post school rugby would be part of the deal.
NSW Rugby has announced an alliance with the Sports High Schools Assoc to provide pathway support for public schools.
Thats not nearly enough and its an effort to reclaim lost ground but its a start.

 

[Doctorscrum]

Is the bigger problem players from a wide geographical area being recruited by junior clubs rather than being recruited by people associated with a school?

I've been told that Waverley have had an association with the local Leagues clubs for some years now, whereby the Leagues clubs provide financial assistance towards the players school fees.

So, I guess what we have here is a number of new rugby players have transferred schools to Waverley. Presumably, some may he beneficiary of that program?​

If that was the case, its surprising, as Waverley supporters on G&G have been so anti-scholarship for years.

 

[The Honey Badger]

GPS schools are approached quire often with my knowledge that View, Kings and Joeys abstaining from the practice.

I would presume Shore as well.

Sent from my MHA-L09 using Tapatalk

 

[CatchnPass]

Looked at another way, one should choose the school to produce well-rounded people. The Christian Brothers established schools to teach the poor (you could argue that Brisbane never got the memo) and that is largely the reason why the fees are low and the social justice component high. The idea is to make it as accessible to as many as possible and to give them opportunities. In that regard it's the odd person out in the CAS (Jesuits have always been a bit more mercenary in that regard) Hence it will happily produce tradies as readily as teachers, doctors or lawyers. My son thoroughly enjoyed his time at Waverley and is doing Arts/Law at Sydney Uni so I'm pretty happy with its academic output, its egalitarian nature (oh, and its rugby program too). So for a third of the cost I think I got a very well-rounded, academically successful and socially aware graduate who wonders why parents pay such high fees for their kids to go to the schools he used to play against.

That's the problem when you generalise - you paint a picture that can be very misleading.

I’m pleased your lad managed to do so well in all areas. That said, I’d argue it’s more misleading to extrapolate from the exception to the rule. It’s inarguable that, on average, a boy sitting the HSC from say Cranbrook or Knox is likely to do considerably better than one from Waverley. That’s worth more $ to me, not necessarily to others.

 

[Joker]

I would presume Shore as well.

Sent from my MHA-L09 using Tapatalk

Apologies. That is correct. A senior teacher did recount that they were approached a while ago but made it it very clear they will not participate in any such nonsense. Her opinion was such introduction of players only weakens school spirit among the students who develop a cynical view of the team. Newington was a case in point a few seasons ago when the student body knew they had a team of players who couldn't care less about the school, just what came after.

 

[sidelineview]

I've been told that Waverley have had an association with the local Leagues clubs for some years now, whereby the Leagues clubs provide financial assistance towards the players school fees.
So, I guess what we have here is a number of new rugby players have transferred schools to Waverley. Presumably, some may he beneficiary of that program?
If that was the case, its surprising, as Waverley supporters on G&G have been so anti-scholarship for years.

FFS .... "I've been told ...... presumably ... if that's the case ..... "
You might as well be gossiping over the fence with your old lady next door neighbour.

 

[Gary Owen III]

Not just Waverley.
Scots and Newington have both gladly accepted league players who are parked there by clubs as they cannot pay them while in school.
Fees are paid by the clubs in return for the student playing for the club when schooling is over.
GPS schools are approached quire often with my knowledge that View, Kings and Joeys abstaining from the practice.

I wouldn't be so quick to discount TKS from this practice... has and is happening

 

[sidelineview]

Not just Waverley.
Scots and Newington have both gladly accepted league players who are parked there by clubs as they cannot pay them while in school.
Fees are paid by the clubs in return for the student playing for the club when schooling is over.
GPS schools are approached quire often with my knowledge that View, Kings and Joeys abstaining from the practice.

You've just continued the Chinese Whispers ...
Waverley is smack bang in the middle of Roosters RL territory and quite a few of the Waverley boys over the years have played rugby for their schools and Club league on Sunday.
That includes playing for the Roosters U16s Matthew Shield team and the U18s SG Ball side.

Even though students are expected to prioritise playing for their school teams, I think you'll find the Waverley Sportsmasters and Rugby Convener and Coaches over the years have developed an amicable attitude towards this issue, and a cooperative relationship with the Roosters.
It's a fact of life for Waverley.

You shouldn't assume anything about who's paying for what and why.
You shouldn't assume that Roosters league players attending Waverley will play RL post school as part of some deal done.
I can recall at least 6 players from the last 2 years who had been Junior Roosters and went on to play Club rugby post school.

They could have continued to play league but enjoyed their school rugby experience and made higher Rep honours for State teams as well as Aussie Schoolboys.
If it was a competition between league and rugby securing players post school, rugby won.
The good work done by the school as well as the quality coaching played a big hand in that.
The strong relationship between Randwick Juniors and Waverley didnt do this ''competition'' any harm either.

 

[sidelineview]

I’m pleased your lad managed to do so well in all areas. That said, I’d argue it’s more misleading to extrapolate from the exception to the rule. It’s inarguable that, on average, a boy sitting the HSC from say Cranbrook or Knox is likely to do considerably better than one from Waverley. That’s worth more $ to me, not necessarily to others.

It's also inarguable that on average, a boy sitting the HSC for James Ruse High is likely to do considerably better than one from Knox, Cranbrook, Barker, Trinity and Knox.
James Ruse High topped the HSC state rankings, but parents will probably consider other factors other than academic as influencing their decision as to which school they chose for their sons.