School sporting scholarships/recruitment

[Quick Hands]

It's a Fitz article so there's a fair bit of hyperbole. There may be an element of truth to it, but in reality he wasn't willing to commit to the training that was required for 1st AND 2nd XV. He had the same attitude in year 11 when he was wanted for the 1sts . He wasn't the only one. Numerous boys, including my own son (who would've only made 2nds in any case) chose to concentrate on the HSC and only train two days a week. That left the only rugby option as 3rds or below.

That was the context of the discussion at the time on this thread IIRC.

 

[The Honey Badger]

Pretty talented year with Maddocks, Crichton, McCauley etc. Almost too talented it would seem.

A 1 in 100 year cohort.

You get that now and again.



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[RuggerFan1]

You blokes have no idea. Brett Wellington is on an Indigenous Scholarship, exactly like Kurtley Beale. When Scots does it its importing but when Joeys does its "giving them a wonderful opportunity".

 

[RuggerFan1]

hahaha that fitzsimmons article is utter bs. maddocks clearly states the reasons here https://www.playersvoice.com.au/jack-maddocks-third-xv-to-spring-tour/

 

[Joker]

You blokes have no idea. Brett Wellington is on an Indigenous Scholarship, exactly like Kurtley Beale. When Scots does it its importing but when Joeys does its "giving them a wonderful opportunity".

I am sick of tthe old....look at Kutley.

Fact- I know hwo the Joeys system works. I was part of setting up the AIEF. The Australian Indigenous Education Foundation (AIEF) was established in 2007 to scale the work of the St Joseph’s College Indigenous Fund (SJCIF), which was established by AIEF Executive Director Andrew Penfold AM in 2004. Kurtley had started at Joeys in year 7 (2001) under the SJCIF.

Fact- Joeys brings in indigenous kids in Year 7 and 8 ONLY. In the past 15 years very, very few who come in under the scheme have made the 1st XV. There are 40 boys under the SJCIF scheme right now. There has been approximately now 230+ lads come through. Name just one student from Joeys who was brought in to the College in year 10/11 under the the guise of the SJCIF and went straight into the top teams. You can't because it has enever happened.

Where as at Scots College.....

Fact- Brett Wellington did not start in year 7 at Scots in the indigenous program. It was year 10. Scots College says in their own literature it takes them in years 7 and 8 only. Why is he there????

Fact- Brett was spotted playing footy in Kiama, approached by a Scots teacher Mr Robert Heritage (a south coast scout who lives locally and 3rd XV coach), who invited him to Sydney to play. He was not approached by the Scots indigenous program. Want proof? See below

https://www.facebook.com/southcoastregister/videos/1489397817781945/

Tell me this is not importing students!

 

[RuggerFan1]

hahahahah calling Rob Heritage a "south coast scout" hes simply just a Design and Tech teacher who coaches rugby. Secondly there are many other aboriginal students at Scots who aren't great at rugby. Under their program they bring in one intake of indigenous kids in year 7 and one in year 10.

 

[RuggerFan1]

I have no doubt that Scots has imported in the past, like many other GPS schools but why does it cop it the most? No one ever says anything about the importing down at Kings.

 

[Joker]

I have no doubt that Scots has imported in the past, like many other GPS schools but why does it cop it the most? No one ever says anything about the importing down at Kings.

You will find it has been discussed my friend. The senior 1st Xv coach used the Kings Fathers Association to fund his empire in the early 2000's

 

[Joker]

hahahahah calling Rob Heritage a "south coast scout" hes simply just a Design and Tech teacher who coaches rugby. Secondly there are many other aboriginal students at Scots who aren't great at rugby. Under their program they bring in one intake of indigenous kids in year 7 and one in year 10.

As a personal friend of Bob and someone who has known him since 1999 I know him well and know the role he plays on the side.

 

[Joker]

Under their program they bring in one intake of indigenous kids in year 7 and one in year 10.

The literature and practice in the past does not seem to match up. Is there a special dispensation given to talented indigenous kids in year 10 when the literature says otherwise, I quote....We do not look for either outstanding academics or sportsmen

 

[RuggerFan1]

Well mate take a look its still happening now. I think its unfair the way target scots. They give scholarships out just as much as the next School. All it is, is classic tall poppy syndrome.

 

[RuggerFan1]

what is this "role played on the side"

 

[Joker]

Well mate take a look its still happening now. I think its unfair the way target scots. They give scholarships out just as much as the next School. All it is, is classic tall poppy syndrome.

I understand. The free rein they had in days past when other were in charge of sport are now over. There is still some messing with the books in basketball but not to the level on 2012/2013 when it was just rampant. Newington still give them, Kings has a couple of dodgy ones, but Scots WERE the gold medal class of rorting the system as the GPS heads knew of when they confronted Scots in 2013 with actual documents showing they did. This was unheard of but Scots have changed and now focus on "building" players with the occasional lad parachuting in. I am aware there are still some approaches made to families at the NSWPSSA level. But they then start in year 7 and it doesn't always work out. Hard to know if they will be champions still by year 11/12.

 

[Joker]

what is this "role played on the side"

Something a number of staff from senior to prep were asked to identify talent in their area of locality or expertise. South Coast is rich for football talent.

 

[RuggerFan1]

I'd say there was only 2-1 scholarships in the Scots first XV this year kings had about 3-5. I do not deny the fact Scots has players on scholarships I just think we should stop singling them out.

 

[Quick Hands]

I am sick of tthe old..look at Kutley.

Fact- I know hwo the Joeys system works. I was part of setting up the AIEF. The Australian Indigenous Education Foundation (AIEF) was established in 2007 to scale the work of the St Joseph’s College Indigenous Fund (SJCIF), which was established by AIEF Executive Director Andrew Penfold AM in 2004. Kurtley had started at Joeys in year 7 (2001) under the SJCIF.

Fact- Joeys brings in indigenous kids in Year 7 and 8 ONLY. In the past 15 years very, very few who come in under the scheme have made the 1st XV. There are 40 boys under the SJCIF scheme right now. There has been approximately now 230+ lads come through. Name just one student from Joeys who was brought in to the College in year 10/11 under the the guise of the SJCIF and went straight into the top teams. You can't because it has enever happened.

Wasn't there a boy with a hypehated name who started on the indigenous programme at SJC in either Year 10 or Year 11?

A couple of years back.

Had represented NSW and Qld at junior rugby league.

(I know the name but don't want to highlight it as it's not fair on the kid)

 

[Quick Hands]

I understand. The free rein they had in days past when other were in charge of sport are now over. There is still some messing with the books in basketball but not to the level on 2012/2013 when it was just rampant. Newington still give them, Kings has a couple of dodgy ones, but Scots WERE the gold medal class of rorting the system as the GPS heads knew of when they confronted Scots in 2013 with actual documents showing they did. This was unheard of but Scots have changed and now focus on "building" players with the occasional lad parachuting in. I am aware there are still some approaches made to families at the NSWPSSA level. But they then start in year 7 and it doesn't always work out. Hard to know if they will be champions still by year 11/12.

I think that we all understand that in the past both Scots and Newington pushed the envelope and were called out on this thread by me and others for a number of years.

I don't believe in either case that this is still happening.

It's interesting that when I've also highlighted the arrival of talent at either Joeys or Riverview, we get a familiar set of excuses offered. These excuses may or may not be correct, but I find it a little inconsistent that those who happily either offer or support these excuses, are quick to point the finger at others.

I'll go back through the thread and find them if anyone doubts what I'm saying. (Post 6350 highlights one issue)

As an example, I was told (by a Joeys parent) that about 7 of the SJC 15As started at the school this year. Now I'm sure that there's a perfectly reasonable explanation for these, but I wonder if we had replaced SJC with another school what the reaction would have been.

It's acknowledged that Joeys bring kids in on bursaries for social justice reasons, and it's a great programme. Just be aware that other schools also provide means-tested bursaries for social justice reasons.

 

[Joker]

As an example, I was told (by a Joeys parent) that about 7 of the SJC 15As started at the school this year.

From the mouth of a lad in the 15B's, "nope...there was just one". My son had three new ones in his team.

BTW...Joeys is unusual as it brings kids in every year. My eldest started with 140 in the cohort. When he finished year 12 there were 220. A number of parents who send them in later are from the land and can only afford three or four years of full boarding tuition. Not everyone can stump up $40000+ for full boarding fees each year, especially as many boys from the bush have brothers. One family sent 9 sons there for only years 11 and 12. The final one was given a full scholarship in recognition of the country support. He played with me in the mighty 5ths!

 

[Up the Guts]

Starting the Indigenous boys in only year 7 and 8 is a tough task. It's a huge adjustment for them to come into a GPS School and it can be tough for them to stick through those early years (Kurtley has remarked he often wanted to leave Joeys in his early years at the school). I've often thought it might be easier if they started in their later high school years and, personally, I'm not too fussed if there are one or two Indigenous students who are on scholarships and also suspiciously good rugby players.

 

[Rich_E]

Wasn't there a boy with a hypehated name who started on the indigenous programme at SJC in either Year 10 or Year 11?

A couple of years back.

Had represented NSW and Qld at junior rugby league.

(I know the name but don't want to highlight it as it's not fair on the kid)

And even more recently a very talented outside back with mainly rugby league background, who arrived at Joeys, presumably on the indigenous program, in 2016 in year 11.
.