Thomond78
Colin Windon (37)
Confirmed by Andy Marinos - all JO'N's fault.
http://www.rugby365.com/tournaments/super14/news/1524521.htm
http://www.rugby365.com/tournaments/super14/news/1524521.htm
South African S14 Teams are going?
- Thread starter Scotty
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Scotty
David Codey (61)
Blue,
It certainly won't make things more financially viable for ANZACs in the short term, but there is a chance that in Oz rugby would grow as a result of having more matches in prime time viewing. You have to remember that in Oz rugby has to compete with League and AFL which both run seasons about twice as long as the S14 and show games all in times when people can watch them. Fringe rugby supporters in this country aren't ones to stay up until 1:00 am in the morning to see our teams play in SA - I don't even do that most of the time!
This theory could all fall in a big heap, but my gut feeling is that if we can compete more directly with league in this country, then rugby would grow. Partially due to the international competition rugby gives, the wallabies brand name and also due to the amount of issues that league experiences with players misbehaving. In fact, I think it is the only way to significantly grow rugby in Australia, as we don't have the resources for a third team comp ala the CC.
Fringe rugby supporters are generally ones also watching league. This means they indentify with Australian and NZ teams more than SA ones.
mark_s
Chilla Wilson (44)
I don't think rugby will beat league in Aus by becoming more like it by not having the SA's in S14. Rugby would do much better by having S14 on free to air TV, even if it was only a game a week or a highlights show. There is literary nothing at the moment and this makes it almost impossible to bring in new fans.
I like having the SA's in the S14 and hope they stay. However, if they really want out, then I think we could end up with a decent comp by replacing these teams with say 5 teams based in Japan and the PIs (possibly even Hong Kong).
The travel to/from the republic is only really an issue at finals time and this is where teams 1 and 2 potentially have a massive advantage by having home semis. The draw is usually set so that teams play their last few games as close to home as possible to minimise the chance of criss crossing the indian ocean on consecutive weekends.
It does raise the question though as to whether the finals should be changed. Maybe the focus of the S14 competition should be on the premiership winner (i.e. team 1 after the reg season). The top 8 teams could then go into a knockout cup competition starting a week or two later lasting 3 weeks with match ups and home ground advantage based on the final S14 rankings (e.g. 1 plays 8 at 1's home ground, 2 plays 7 at 2's home ground and so on) The travel could potentially be horrendous for one of the bottom 4 teams but this is arguably fair given they didn't perform as well over the reg season. It's probably a silly idea but just thinking outside the square.
I like having the SA's in the S14 and hope they stay. However, if they really want out, then I think we could end up with a decent comp by replacing these teams with say 5 teams based in Japan and the PIs (possibly even Hong Kong).
The travel to/from the republic is only really an issue at finals time and this is where teams 1 and 2 potentially have a massive advantage by having home semis. The draw is usually set so that teams play their last few games as close to home as possible to minimise the chance of criss crossing the indian ocean on consecutive weekends.
It does raise the question though as to whether the finals should be changed. Maybe the focus of the S14 competition should be on the premiership winner (i.e. team 1 after the reg season). The top 8 teams could then go into a knockout cup competition starting a week or two later lasting 3 weeks with match ups and home ground advantage based on the final S14 rankings (e.g. 1 plays 8 at 1's home ground, 2 plays 7 at 2's home ground and so on) The travel could potentially be horrendous for one of the bottom 4 teams but this is arguably fair given they didn't perform as well over the reg season. It's probably a silly idea but just thinking outside the square.
Blue
Andrew Slack (58)
mark_s said:
It's an issue in the regular season as well but its worse in the finals because an SA team arrives here and plays four days later. Not enough time to acclimatise. It's a known fact that travelling East causes worse jetlag.
In the regular season they play four or five games away from home, visiting four or five cities. The first week is a disaster.
The fact is that SA does make too much of an issue about it, but by the same token ppl here in Aus and NZ trivialise it too much. The SA teams travel more. That's not hard to understand. It will always be a contentious issue.
South Africa have emphasised their commitment to Sanzar amid speculation the rugby republic could abandon New Zealand and Australia and take their game to Europe.
With SANZAR in the midst of putting together a new proposal to take to their broadcasting partner News Ltd in June, the prospect of South Africa joining the time-friendly European scene was raised in an article in The Australian newspaper.
The report suggested that the South African Super 14 franchises could be tempted to move north and join the Magners League involving clubs from Wales, Scotland and Ireland.
That has prompted the South African union to deny any such move and reaffirm their commitment to their southern hemisphere partners.
"There is not a jot of truth in this speculation and we wouldn't normally even bother responding to such a story," said Andy Marinos, the South African Rugby Union's acting managing director, in a statement.
"But as it has now grown via the internet from speculation from one source in Australasia to a real possibility in websites across Europe we thought rugby supporters would like the record put straight.
"So let me put it quite plainly: we have had no informal or formal discussions with the Magners League - or any European-based leagues for that matter - about deserting our Sanzar partners and playing in a northern hemisphere-based tournament.
"And nor do we have any plans to hold such discussions," he said.
"We remain committed to Sanzar and are taking a full part in discussions looking at the possible expansion of the tournament - a desire we share with our Australian and New Zealand partners. Sanzar's tournaments are vibrant, hugely popular with our supporters of the very highest rugby quality and remain central to our forward planning."
Marinos said that logistically the move would be impossible as the northern and southern hemisphere seasons don't overlap. He also believed it would be a drop in the standard of rugby.
SANZAR's current broadcasting agreement ends in 2010 and they are looking at expansion options within their own boundaries and in Asia and the Americas fro Super rugby while there is pressure to bring Argentina into the Tri Nations.
Speculation about South Africa looking elsewhere is nothing new. It has dogged the SANZAR setup for years with South Africa burdened by travel and tempted to move into a time zone that sees their rugby fall into the same sort of kickoffs as those operating in the UK and France.
http://www.rugbyheaven.com.au/news/...ing-with-sanzar/2009/02/18/1234632857424.html
With SANZAR in the midst of putting together a new proposal to take to their broadcasting partner News Ltd in June, the prospect of South Africa joining the time-friendly European scene was raised in an article in The Australian newspaper.
The report suggested that the South African Super 14 franchises could be tempted to move north and join the Magners League involving clubs from Wales, Scotland and Ireland.
That has prompted the South African union to deny any such move and reaffirm their commitment to their southern hemisphere partners.
"There is not a jot of truth in this speculation and we wouldn't normally even bother responding to such a story," said Andy Marinos, the South African Rugby Union's acting managing director, in a statement.
"But as it has now grown via the internet from speculation from one source in Australasia to a real possibility in websites across Europe we thought rugby supporters would like the record put straight.
"So let me put it quite plainly: we have had no informal or formal discussions with the Magners League - or any European-based leagues for that matter - about deserting our Sanzar partners and playing in a northern hemisphere-based tournament.
"And nor do we have any plans to hold such discussions," he said.
"We remain committed to Sanzar and are taking a full part in discussions looking at the possible expansion of the tournament - a desire we share with our Australian and New Zealand partners. Sanzar's tournaments are vibrant, hugely popular with our supporters of the very highest rugby quality and remain central to our forward planning."
Marinos said that logistically the move would be impossible as the northern and southern hemisphere seasons don't overlap. He also believed it would be a drop in the standard of rugby.
SANZAR's current broadcasting agreement ends in 2010 and they are looking at expansion options within their own boundaries and in Asia and the Americas fro Super rugby while there is pressure to bring Argentina into the Tri Nations.
Speculation about South Africa looking elsewhere is nothing new. It has dogged the SANZAR setup for years with South Africa burdened by travel and tempted to move into a time zone that sees their rugby fall into the same sort of kickoffs as those operating in the UK and France.
http://www.rugbyheaven.com.au/news/...ing-with-sanzar/2009/02/18/1234632857424.html
Scotty
David Codey (61)
I agree you need to work at schoolboy level, but you are pushing sh*t up hill if you don't have high level rugby and big stars playing front of those school boys week in week out, as they will choose to follow other sports instead.
It needs to be a down up and up down approach at the same time.
It needs to be a down up and up down approach at the same time.
T
Turban
Guest
formeropenside said:
Where will we find the 40million rugby mad viewers to replace the South African's to keep the sponsers and broadcasters happy>
R
rugbywhisperer
Guest
Throw in Japan and they will come but not 40million, plenty millionTurban said:
disco
Chilla Wilson (44)
Yeah that's simple in SA & NZ as nearly every school plays Rugby. We played rugby for one term out of a possible 8 terms at my high school & that was it other than that it was league, soccer, aussie rules & basketball for my senior years.
Apart from the private schools Rugby isn't really an option.
PaarlBok
Rod McCall (65)
Excuse me for not understanding the Aus situation and be a dummy here. Think most of you agree with me regarding the schoolboy rugby one, so my question is: Do the ARU do something about it? Cant expect to get something from the public lotte, they have to drive this one.
Myself dont know the way the Kiwis do their thing but in SA rugby aint the biggest sport. Poofball is but if you look at all the problems our lot have, by try to satisfy the politicians by bringing the under past previledge lot through and to work through our structures, not a easy one. OK they got a sound schoolboy base but a lot of work needs to be done to grow the game at voetsool level.
If you dont have a base, you have to go and buy one. Why buy one if you have one. Build one.
Myself dont know the way the Kiwis do their thing but in SA rugby aint the biggest sport. Poofball is but if you look at all the problems our lot have, by try to satisfy the politicians by bringing the under past previledge lot through and to work through our structures, not a easy one. OK they got a sound schoolboy base but a lot of work needs to be done to grow the game at voetsool level.
If you dont have a base, you have to go and buy one. Why buy one if you have one. Build one.
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