The Israel Folau saga

[Braveheart81]

The other thing I wonder about, doesn't the bible say it hard for a rich man to enter heaven? So perhaps he will give away his money?

Thankfully the church invented the solution of giving money to the church. Works a treat.

 

[Dctarget]

and use his wife's account for these posts in the future

Is it implied that his wife is large influence for a lot of his extremism?

 

[Slim 293]

It's great to see rugby getting good billing in the media........

Both Fairfax/Nine and Murdoch calling for Folau to be sacked:


https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/s...t/news-story/539acfd6ad54d1ef04940ac066a18886

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Imposing a fine on Folau will not win back the trust.​

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Suspending him will not win back the trust.​

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Either of those scenarios would only lead to rugby authorities nervously sitting back bracing for Folau to fire up his thumbs again.​

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And all the while, sporting patrons and the wider public will shake their heads at the lack of action, the failure to stand up to society’s standards, and walk away from rugby.​

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No. It’s time for rugby to walk away from Folau.​

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https://www.smh.com.au/sport/rugby-union/until-israel-folau-repents-rugby-australia-has-no-choice-but-to-let-him-go-20190410-p51d0o.html​

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Rugby Australia simply has no choice. They cannot go through one more time the agony of last year when Folau’s social media comments trumpeting that gays would go to hell, saw rugby lose sponsors, fans, and support.

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That could be the last time we see those newspapers in agreement for a while with the upcoming election.........

 

[Slim 293]

Qantas now waiting to see how RA respond before considering whether or not to pull their sponsorship, as they threatened to do last year if there were any more incidents..........

 

[fatprop]

Is it implied that his wife is large influence for a lot of his extremism?

extremism? I think we have a different understanding of what extremism is

 

[Dctarget]

extremism? I think we have a different understanding of what extremism is

extreme religious views*

 

[Derpus]

Tell you what though folks, glad we are talking about izzy going all god squad again, rather than him necking 40 cans, pissing in his own mouth, domestic/sexually abusing women etc.

Small mercies

 

[barbarian]

Man I reckon he's a fucking simpleton who posts bad happy clapper memes without reasoning through the consequences.
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If they were just 'happy clapper' memes then we wouldn't have a problem. Everyone is fine with general 'Jesus is great' chat.

This is well past happy clapper, it's old testament fire and brimstone 'repent or else' garbage. Which is the problem.
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[Set piece magic]

Folau should be fined but it is disgraceful and outrageous that QANTAS threatens to pull sponsorship over this

People will say yeah its their right to do so and fair enough it is, but it doesn't make it right

Qantas should also be careful what it wishes for

Companies that have engaged in social activism in the United States have met grissly ends

If I was the Federal Government and QANTAS pulled sponsorship, I'd immediately respond by opening up the trans-atlantic route to whichever airline wanted to do it.

I'd also immediately open the possibility of de-monopolising all air routes in Australia

Worth noting analogous situations like this have happened - in Georgia USA lawmakers torpedoed a 40 million dollar tax break for an airline after a situation

Our National Football team deserves better than to be held hostage by QANTAS because of extemporaneous comments made by a player. Leave the discipline to us, Alan Joyce

 

[dru]

Folau should be fined but it is disgraceful and outrageous that QANTAS threatens to pull sponsorship over this

People will say yeah its their right to do so and fair enough it is, but it doesn't make it right

Qantas should also be careful what it wishes for

Companies that have engaged in social activism in the United States have met grissly ends

If I was the Federal Government and QANTAS pulled sponsorship, I'd immediately respond by opening up the trans-atlantic route to whichever airline wanted to do it.

I'd also immediately open the possibility of de-monopolising all air routes in Australia

Worth noting analogous situations like this have happened - in Georgia USA lawmakers torpedoed a 40 million dollar tax break for an airline after a situation

Our National Football team deserves better than to be held hostage by QANTAS because of extemporaneous comments made by a player. Leave the discipline to us, Alan Joyce

Over-reaching here, spikhaza

 

[Set piece magic]

Companies should have an obligation to their shareholders and no more

Corporate activism can die in a hole

 

[dru]

Companies should have an obligation to their shareholders and no more

Corporate activism can die in a hole

See there is something that I completely agree with. Hence, I think you are over-reaching.

 

[Braveheart81]

Companies should have an obligation to their shareholders and no more

Corporate activism can die in a hole

You don't think that is part of their obligation to their shareholders?

 

[Set piece magic]

You don't think that is part of their obligation to their shareholders?

Given activism and what's right is inherently political and subjective, absolutely not

Returning a profit to your shareholders does not mean engaging in social activism, which will only ever alienate certain segments of people. This whole thread is that case in point. It's not in QANTAS' interest to alienate customers, and I can guarantee terminating the sponsorship of Rugby AU will definitely alienate customers (I'd never fly with them again)

Profit means delivering goods and services to consumers and it's one of the greatest indictments of our age that many of our ASX200 listed companies have forgotten about this in the face of ridiculous PR industry invented fiction.

 

[dru]

See there is something that I completely agree with. Hence, I think you are over-reaching.

Actually now I’ve stretched things. A company should primarily be held accountable by their shareholders. They do also have obligations to their employees, contractors, customers and the public at large. Apologies on correcting myself

 

[Braveheart81]

QANTAS has clearly positioned their brand and been vocal on issues such as marriage equality because they think it is good for their brand and subsequently their shareholders.

Their brand and positioning in the market has an impact on them being able to deliver profits. It's crazy to suggest otherwise.

The social media/smartphone age means that companies are under far more scrutiny because negative stories get filmed and publicised and spread like wildfire.

Companies that are significantly public facing can't avoid that. They need to position themselves.

I agree with you that terminating their sponsorship with RA would alienate some customers. It would also make some customers happy. I probably would still fly with them because sometimes it is the best option. It's absolutely not a hill I would die on.

 

[Set piece magic]

I just cannot agree that supporting same sex marriage made people choose Qantas as an airline

I've never ever seen any friend that's gone on an overseas holiday ever choose an airline based off their social positions

In fact many of them fly with state owned airlines from countries that have abhorrent human rights records

The market evidence including focus groups suggest people fly with airlines almost entirely on price followed by service

It's worth noting if QANTAS really believes in all of this stuff as it alleges, why does it have such an astonishingly comprehensive partnership with Emirates, which is the state owned airline from a corrupt autocratic regime that is completely anti-democratic, where homosexuality is illegal and where women are treated as second class citizens.

The simple answer is QANTAS' position is morally and intellectually bankrupt

 

[Dctarget]

I just cannot agree that supporting same sex marriage made people choose Qantas as an airline

I've never ever seen any friend that's gone on an overseas holiday ever choose an airline based off their social positions

In fact many of them fly with state owned airlines from countries that have abhorrent human rights records

The market evidence including focus groups suggest people fly with airlines almost entirely on price followed by service

It's worth noting if QANTAS really believes in all of this stuff as it alleges, why does it have such an astonishingly comprehensive partnership with Emirates, which is the state owned airline from a corrupt autocratic regime that is completely anti-democratic, where homosexuality is illegal and where women are treated as second class citizens.

The simple answer is QANTAS' position is morally and intellectually bankrupt

Didn't you just say you'd never fly with them again if they stopped supporting the Wallabies? (because of a social position).

 

[Set piece magic]

Yes and I'm aware of the contradiction but I think it's a particularly egregious case. I'm more referring to activism in general and how much of a waste of time it is

 

[dru]

Didn't you just say you'd never fly with them again if they stopped supporting the Wallabies? (because of a social position).

Undoubtedly there are people who fly QANTAS solely because of this positioning. Nominal numbers unlikely to impact profitability but not zero. More important to QANTAS is their positioning with their staff and certainly these things impact.

I don’t like the gay agenda dumbing down to a challenge on religious freedom. People (many) will disagree, but it’s what I think happens here. And it doesn’t matter.

RA had a chance to support religious freedom, they took a half pregnant position which I doubt Folau feels he has transgressed. RA now have to act. Action needs to be contractually pusciant but they do need to act. With or without QANTAS.

My earlier comments on repercussions in the player group remain.