wamberal
Phil Kearns (64)
Burgess totally dominated Holmes a few years ago, when the former was playing for Eastern Suburbs, and the latter was still with Eastwood.
Holmes' body might be bigger, but not his heart.
The Wallaby 12 Conundrum
- Thread starter Aussie D
- Start date
- Status
Burgess totally dominated Holmes a few years ago, when the former was playing for Eastern Suburbs, and the latter was still with Eastwood.
Holmes' body might be bigger, but not his heart.
wamberal
Phil Kearns (64)
He was pretty good as a junior, in fact up until that game against Burgess he looked like the next big thing at half-back.
Burgess really killed him.
Grandmaster Flash
Johnnie Wallace (23)
If my memory serves me correctly Holmes has played a bit at 12 for the Rats. Maybe we should add him to the poll?
chasmac
Dave Cowper (27)
Brumby Runner
David Wilson (68)
Lots of 'harbour bridge' passes. Not a bullet pass certainly.
BarneySF
Bob Loudon (25)
Mortal Wombat
Allen Oxlade (6)
At the risk of putting a few noses out of joint, I think selecting either Tomua or Godwin is a very conservative pick, more like what the Poms or Africans would do rather than the traditionally more ambitious Wallabies.
This state of affairs really only came about through the back door to cover defensive inadequacies on the part of the blokes playing 10, namely Cooper and Beale.
What are the outstanding characteristics of Tomua? A strong defense. An ok runner and kicker, but he's not going to frighten anyone in the top international teams doing either.
I think we need more out of the Wallaby 12, either a bash and barge merchant, or a proper creative player. Someone with genuinely threatening offensive capabilities, like Kuridrani or Lealifano.
This state of affairs really only came about through the back door to cover defensive inadequacies on the part of the blokes playing 10, namely Cooper and Beale.
What are the outstanding characteristics of Tomua? A strong defense. An ok runner and kicker, but he's not going to frighten anyone in the top international teams doing either.
I think we need more out of the Wallaby 12, either a bash and barge merchant, or a proper creative player. Someone with genuinely threatening offensive capabilities, like Kuridrani or Lealifano.
Highlander35
Andrew Slack (58)
Inman...
T
Train Without a Station
Guest
You cannot say that To'omua is a conservative option and then say Leali'ifano is a much better attacking option. To'omua replaced Leali'ifano at 12 because he was offering more in attack in his performances off the bench.
To'omua provides that role that Anthony Fainga'a successfully did at the reds during their best years, but just does it better.
To'omua provides that role that Anthony Fainga'a successfully did at the reds during their best years, but just does it better.
Mortal Wombat
Allen Oxlade (6)
Which is a respectable all round game and a good defense. We need more than that, especially if we're picking mere mortals at 10 instead of Quade.
Lealifano ran that backline pretty well before he had his big injury and loss of form.
Regardless, please don't take the players I used as examples to discount the underlying logic. There are other options who best go un named at this stage.
Realistically though if you look at the potential 12 options, To'omua is probably the second most playmaker option we have.
Beale was the biggest playmaker in the position in Super Rugby this year but his defence was a huge problem at test level and he's gone anyway.
Leali'ifano was a great playmaker in 2012 but he hasn't produced that since. As it looks like he is going to start this weekend, hopefully he does well. His playmaking ability compared to To'omua is pretty similar though and really just a question of form. To'omua's form has been down in recent weeks but Leali'ifano's has been non-existant this year.
Godwin is less of a playmaker at this stage but probably the best ball runner of the lot.
Inman is more of a bosher but improved the subtlety of his game in 2014.
Tapuai was largely played at 13 in 2014 but it's been a fair while since he's shown any sort of form that would have him selected for the Wallabies.
You criticise To'omua's playmaking but then seemingly point to a non-existant playmaking 12 as the solution.
Beale was the biggest playmaker in the position in Super Rugby this year but his defence was a huge problem at test level and he's gone anyway.
Leali'ifano was a great playmaker in 2012 but he hasn't produced that since. As it looks like he is going to start this weekend, hopefully he does well. His playmaking ability compared to To'omua is pretty similar though and really just a question of form. To'omua's form has been down in recent weeks but Leali'ifano's has been non-existant this year.
Godwin is less of a playmaker at this stage but probably the best ball runner of the lot.
Inman is more of a bosher but improved the subtlety of his game in 2014.
Tapuai was largely played at 13 in 2014 but it's been a fair while since he's shown any sort of form that would have him selected for the Wallabies.
You criticise To'omua's playmaking but then seemingly point to a non-existant playmaking 12 as the solution.
T
Train Without a Station
Guest
Well don't say them then.
You stated Leali'ifano was a better attacking option than Matt To'omua. I simply responded that when both had been played in the same team in the same position, To'omua had been a better attacking player, which is why he replaced Leali'ifano. In addition he offered a better version of the Anthony Fainga'a influence also.
Mortal Wombat
Allen Oxlade (6)
Train Without a Station said:
The better is a matter of opinion, and I believe the change was made due to injury, if my memory serves correct.
In their best form, Lealifano offers more in attack, IMO.
We're literally 2 and a half years from when that last happened.
Maybe if he starts offering some of that spark again he'll challenge To'omua when they're both healthy. At this stage I'd suggest To'omua is well and truly the preferred option and for good reason.
T
Train Without a Station
Guest
In my opinion, based on To'omua actually doing it at test level, he offers more. In addition, he offers more in defense, our biggest concern. In fact we've fallen apart when he's been off the field.
T
Train Without a Station
Guest
maxdacat
Nicholas Shehadie (39)
wow....how did you work that out so quickly?
T
Train Without a Station
Guest
It was a blatant guess. Could be spot on. Prior to the 2009 we saw Giteau/Mortlock, Larkham/Mortlock, Giteau/Tuqiri, Staniforth/Mortlock, Mortlock/Cross, Tahu/Mortlock, Tahu/Cross alone I think Probably Barnes/Mortlock too.
- Status