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Wallabies 2019 Thread

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KOB1987

Rod McCall (65)
Thanks for this, these are some interesting notes.

Why do you think Jones is soft? I am mainly commenting on his super form, and I thought he was much more consistent than Dempsey, and obviously has a much larger volume of work than Valentini. He is also better than both in the lineout, and from what I can see in maul defence. Happy to hear your thoughts on this - but I am steadfast in my opinion that Lukhan must go and now. Now that Bernard is cooked (thankyou Chek) Lukhan is my next major issue.

Liam Wright at 6 is something that I have proposed quite a bit with the emergence of McReight/Kibble coming through. I think he could make a tremendous 6 in the Dusatoir mould, and note that he played 6 for Easts on the weekend. I certainly think he COULD be a shot, but think its too early. To be clear though, I would much prefer him there rather than Lukhan.

Think you might be getting a bit carried away there. As has been discussed elsewhere comparing Foley's performance at altitude against the Saffas (which was an OK performance BTW) and behind a pack going nowhere, is not really comparable to a game against the Argies at Suncorp behind a dominant pack, and was a credible performance but hardly outstanding. I don't mind conceding that perhaps Lilo has his nose in front but we all know you're a serial Bernard basher and if you think you've seen the last of him in gold you are going to be severely disappointed.
 

Jimmy_Crouch

Ken Catchpole (46)
Thanks for this, these are some interesting notes.

Why do you think Jones is soft? I am mainly commenting on his super form, and I thought he was much more consistent than Dempsey, and obviously has a much larger volume of work than Valentini. He is also better than both in the lineout, and from what I can see in maul defence. Happy to hear your thoughts on this - but I am steadfast in my opinion that Lukhan must go and now. Now that Bernard is cooked (thankyou Chek) Lukhan is my next major issue.

Liam Wright at 6 is something that I have proposed quite a bit with the emergence of McReight/Kibble coming through. I think he could make a tremendous 6 in the Dusatoir mould, and note that he played 6 for Easts on the weekend. I certainly think he COULD be a shot, but think its too early. To be clear though, I would much prefer him there rather than Lukhan.


It is purely that Jones' contact zone involvements are so passive. He gets belted running the ball and he completely ineffective in performing a decent ruck cleanout. He is however a much better lineout operator than any of the other options.

Dempsey and Valentini both had stop-start seasons with injury only playing nine and ten super games each so I can see the hesitation. Both have far greater potential than Jones and being that he hasn't exactly bashed down the selectors door in the extra few super games (he played 14) or in the test I'd look elsewhere.

I'd prefer to see Wright develop as an openside. In Australia we are just use to having shorter players in that position (from the professional era Hooper, Pocock, Gill, Smith, Waugh, Hodgson, Croft, Wilson, McMahon, Hardwick and Robinson all who are 185cm or less) I would like to see him develop along the lines of Burger or McCaw where he can play six but seven is his preferred spot.

I am a proponent of best player first, balance later (I believe Chekia is too). Although playing Hooper and Pocock has its limitations they are so far ahead of our blindside options I cant genuinely see the selectors picking anyone else. This means we need the locks to lift and provide more than they have over the past few years.
 

KOB1987

Rod McCall (65)
Foley sucks, like is genuinely awful. Everyone knows it (even you), and we have been all waiting for someone to take it from him.

Very glad that his Wallaby career is now over.

Lets all move forward united, and win some games.

All hail Lilo.

Haha, well I'm just glad Lilo has stepped up as another option because To'omua and Beale certainly weren't going to do us any favours playing there. Certainly after the weekend any thoughts of To'omua covering at 10 should be relegated to plan C injury cover only. I'm amazed he even got a run there after last year's showings. I think Johnson and O'Connor might be in your camp ;)
 

Derpus

George Gregan (70)
Foley sucks, like is genuinely awful. Everyone knows it (even you), and we have been all waiting for someone to take it from him.

Very glad that his Wallaby career is now over.

Lets all move forward united, and win some games.

All hail Lilo.
Cheika will inevitably revert at some point. You are setting yourself up for heartbreak.

Anyway. Can't we just do LSL (Lukhan Salakaia-Loto) bench lock and Jones starting 6 for a match with Samu on the bench to cover 6, 7, 8? sounds perfect to me.

Simmons, Dempsey and Valetini in the wider squad to cover injuries.
 
B

Bobby Sands

Guest
It is purely that Jones' contact zone involvements are so passive. He gets belted running the ball and he completely ineffective in performing a decent ruck cleanout. He is however a much better lineout operator than any of the other options.

Dempsey and Valentini both had stop-start seasons with injury only playing nine and ten super games each so I can see the hesitation. Both have far greater potential than Jones and being that he hasn't exactly bashed down the selectors door in the extra few super games (he played 14) or in the test I'd look elsewhere.

I'd prefer to see Wright develop as an openside. In Australia we are just use to having shorter players in that position (from the professional era Hooper, Pocock, Gill, Smith, Waugh, Hodgson, Croft, Wilson, McMahon, Hardwick and Robinson all who are 185cm or less) I would like to see him develop along the lines of Burger or McCaw where he can play six but seven is his preferred spot.

I am a proponent of best player first, balance later (I believe Chekia is too). Although playing Hooper and Pocock has its limitations they are so far ahead of our blindside options I cant genuinely see the selectors picking anyone else. This means we need the locks to lift and provide more than they have over the past few years.

Great post, glad to be involved in it.

Agree with most, other than Hooper/David combo. This is silly it does not work.

David was in my year at school, have known him a long time and due to bias or other would much rather see him play 7. That aside I am happy with either, but only either (at one time).

I will also be looking at Jones contact work, as it is not something I have noticed being an issue.

I have always liked Dempsey, especially pre-injury, but I would really like to see him get back to whacking blokes on both sides of the ball. If he gets back to that I would pick him in a heart beat. If not I would prefer a taller 6, who can shore up our set-piece, maul defence and general in-tight accountability.
 
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Bobby Sands

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Cheika will inevitably revert at some point. You are setting yourself up for heartbreak.

Anyway. Can't we just do LSL (Lukhan Salakaia-Loto) bench lock and Jones starting 6 for a match with Samu on the bench to cover 6, 7, 8? sounds perfect to me.

Simmons, Dempsey and Valetini in the wider squad to cover injuries.

Its mainly in retort to your view and others that "he is the best option, so we should not consider anyone else. It won't ever make a difference. Ever" argument.

As far as the bolded part of your note, I could not agree more. It only becomes an issue if David is back fit and firing, but at present (assuming Pete is fit) it is our best option.

It will not be heartbreak if Foley returns, but I do genuinely think Lilo is the man to lead us to the cup.

I do not mean to be disrespectful, but I am very glad he can go back and work on his game with Mick Byrne and come back a better player.
 

Up the Guts

Steve Williams (59)
Its mainly in retort to your view and others that "he is the best option, so we should not consider anyone else. It won't ever make a difference. Ever" argument.

As far as the bolded part of your note, I could not agree more. It only becomes an issue if David is back fit and firing, but at present (assuming Pete is fit) it is our best option.

It will not be heartbreak if Foley returns, but I do genuinely think Lilo is the man to lead us to the cup.

I do not mean to be disrespectful, but I am very glad he can go back and work on his game with Mick Byrne and come back a better player.
I think most people are happy to see Lilo start now. Last year there was certainly no one better than Foley. Agree with all your other points from your longish post a page ago.
 

Silverado

Dick Tooth (41)
Essentially the game was a trial, and the squad's final option for 5/8 needed to be seen.
Yes. After last game To'omua is out of contention for so out of Lilo and Foley. I liked the idea from an earlier post to give them a start in each of the Bledisloe's to see how they perform against the same opposition at low altitude then make a final decision
 

formerflanker

Ken Catchpole (46)
From Adam Lucius in sportingnews.com re Pocock playing club rugby this weekend.
With so much on the line, coaches are not exactly enthused at the prospect of lining up against Pocock.
"Imagine having your season cruelled because David Pocock suddenly suits up for the club you're playing," one coach told Sporting News.
"Or he might help out another team that you need to lose to help get you a spot in the finals or finish top two."
 

LearningCurve

Bill Watson (15)
Can you articulate what it is that you would expect TK to do to "show enough" to stay in the XV? When you have an inside centre that is getting across the advantage line all night, the best thing you can do in attack is support him. They mightn't operating together that well at the moment, but let's not overstate Kerevi's ballplaying ability: he bombed a try opportunity in the first test because he didn't know what to do in space with a player either side. Also, it's not like Kerevi is known for moving the ball at speed to give the guys outside of him some space. By the time TK has a shot, he's amongst more traffic than the M2 after a truck accident.

The guy has to stay in his lane so the defence doesn't completely fall to shit if there's a turnover, so he is naturally limited in what he can do. Kerevi has had 46 touches in the last fortnights, whilst TK has had 12. He would have to be basically superhuman to standout in those circumstances.

Also, uh, defence?

Fair point, TK is strong in defence, not disputing that, but what you are saying is that the Kerevi/TK combination is not working because Kerevi is hogging the ball. So either the communication is not happening or Kerevi is ignoring him, or it is the game plan. I expect the 13 to be strong in the attack and TK can certainly do that and we saw that in the later part of the Brumbies season. So far in 2 tests we haven't seen that though I think it is fair to say. I think Kerevi is a strong ball runner but limited because he tends not to set up those outside him, that's where the coach should be instructing him on what he wants so maybe it is Cheika's plan. So do you keep a combination that isn't seeming to gel, in my view because they are too similar, or do you try someone else in the combination?
 

cyclopath

George Smith (75)
Staff member
I think To'omua actually ran really well and made some good tackles too, he's a good 12. Why not just play him where he belongs.
If he’s a pure 12, and he might well be, why have him on the bench? I mean Kerevi is going to play big minutes, so it would seem an odd use of a bench spot. You’re more likely to cover 12 with someone who might cover several spots (like Beale, O’Connor or at a pinch Hodge).
 

Derpus

George Gregan (70)
If he’s a pure 12, and he might well be, why have him on the bench? I mean Kerevi is going to play big minutes, so it would seem an odd use of a bench spot. You’re more likely to cover 12 with someone who might cover several spots (like Beale, O’Connor or at a pinch Hodge).
I agree. I don't think To'omua makes the 23. But if he was to, it ought be at 12. It was always a bit odd to have both O'Connor and To'omua on the bench.
 

TSR

Mark Ella (57)
We’re lacking that bench option that can adequately cover both 10 & 12. I’m not sure Foley or Lealiifano covering 12 is going to be any better than To'omua or Beale were at covering 10.

Hopefully JOC (James O'Connor) can make a good fist of it.
 

Rugbynutter39

Michael Lynagh (62)
So time for the remaining players in the mix to be given time.

To'omua experiment over so let’s see how JOC (James O'Connor) goes and also AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper). Later despite public opinion otherwise deserves a shot to see what he can offer as proven experience at test level so let’s give him a game to find out.

Also need to give Coleman a run to see where he is in the mix.

Samu should also be given a go as reserve forward to remind us what we have been missing.

I also wonder if hunt should also be given a game prior to final selections.

Also need to let Luke Jones have more game time to see if he is worth taking as not been given enough game time and would prefer him starting at 6 over LSL (Lukhan Salakaia-Loto) to see what he can offer.

Anyone else we need to give some more game time that we need to look more closely at prior to the selection of RWC squad?
 

KOB1987

Rod McCall (65)
For the Bledisloes they will put out what they think the strongest team is. The only positions now which are still unclear are 6, 14 and to a lesser extent 10, so there might be shuffling of personnel here between games, and of course the makeup of the bench. Any real experimentation, and only for wider squad spots, will be saved for the Samoa game you'd think (that worked well for Dingo remember!).
 
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