Wallabies no 7 for the world cup

[Searsy]

Does Pocock need a rest in the World Cup? He missed (from memory) at least 8 games this Super Season and wasn't burdened with any finals games. I can't see why he wouldn't play all games in this WC unless RD wants to cotton wool him. I think with his stop and start season he will benefit from playing a few weeks straight.

 

[Joe Blow]

Mate what you on about, there's no way Rocky and Higgers are better 7s than McCalman. Especially Higgers. Both are seagulls, McCalman is very on the ball.

I just think they are faster. McCalman plays on the ball because that is pretty much all he can do.
Pococks value is that he is always on the ball...literally. He is so fast that he is the first or second Wallaby at most rucks. None of our other loosies can do that.
I think if Higgers was instructed to just play on the ball he would go pretty well.
France play without a recognised fetcher, as do SA and Eng at times. McAWE plays less in the fetcher roll and more like another 6 these days, so maybe there is something to it.

It is a breakaway(no pun intended) from how we have always played the game and from how Deans has picked his Wallaby sides. I thought that the bench in the last couple of tests were selected that way so he could get a look at how our 8s were travelling.
But it now looks like Deans and co had already decided to go away from the 2 fetchers in the 22 model.

 

[aussie1st]

Saia basically plays as a fetcher so he would be one option if he happened before/after the game.

 

[Sandpit Fan]

I just think they are faster. McCalman plays on the ball because that is pretty much all he can do.
Pococks value is that he is always on the ball...literally. He is so fast that he is the first or second Wallaby at most rucks. None of our other loosies can do that.
I think if Higgers was instructed to just play on the ball he would go pretty well.

This is what I don't get with a lot of the comments about various players seagulling. Seems pretty obvious to me that players will be doing what the coach told them.

Does anyone really think McKenzie would have kept Higginbotham in the starting Reds team if he was bludging out in the backline on his own bat?

 

[maxdacat]

A blindside (6) breakaway and a traditional (australian) openside breakaway (7) perform very different roles and require very different physical attributes. An openside is required to secure position and disrupt the opposition's position. Often mobility, workrate, low centre of gravity for strength on the ball are key attributes, whilst a 6 is more likely to be similar to an 8. McCalman could be quite good, but Beau Robinson would be better as a fetcher. Although the way things are heading there is not as much need for a fetcher.

cheers - very helpful analysis.

 

[darkhorse]

I've always thought that a 6 has to play like a shorter, faster lock.

I'd agree. I think it depends on the Coach and Country, but it's the one position I find hard to define it's role.

My point was it's alot harder to switch from 6 to 7, than to Super Rugby or 8.

 

[qwerty51]

This is what I don't get with a lot of the comments about various players seagulling. Seems pretty obvious to me that players will be doing what the coach told them.

Does anyone really think McKenzie would have kept Higginbotham in the starting Reds team if he was bludging out in the backline on his own bat?

He got away with it because the Reds front row are all workhorses.

 

[DPK]

He got away with it because the Reds front row are all workhorses.

And the current Wallaby front row have been doing the same, so it works out for us too.

I actually thought that Higgers has been playing a lot tighter for the Wobs than for the Reds.

 

[Swarley]

The #6 usually covers these roles:
- To guard the blindside off scrums/rucks
- Act as a ball runner off rucks/mauls
- Coming behind the backline in attack and providing support to the #10

As well, of course, clearing out and making tackles.

 

[tranquility]

Rocky will play 7 if David is injured in my opinion.

I actually think it is pretty smart, and a decision I would not have thought of. Hodgson has been decidedly average at test level when given his opportunities.
Although I am dissapointed that Beau never got a chance to push for selection, I hope he is rushed over if need have an injury as all other positions are adequately covered.

 

[DPK]

I'd agree. I think it depends on the Coach and Country, but it's the one position I find hard to define it's role.

Well yeah, in SA of course

I think a 6 is more important in attack, and a 7 is more important in defense. 6 secures ball and 7 steals.

That's why I don't mind the French tactic of using a Left and Right flanker instead of a Openside or Blindside. They can afford to have players that have both skill sets.

 

[Skippy]

3 points -

1. I think Deans is going to pick his strongest team for all games... bar perhaps resting a few against Russia. USA wont be a second string team but full strength perhaps because it's the last pool game before the quarters so Deans will want his best team starting and finding form/combinations. With Italy and Ireland first up.. again, he will pick his full strength starting lineup to ensure victory. The bench will be used to keep blokes fresh after 50-60 minutes.

2. THe game has changed or is changing. The breakdown laws, the 'must release tackled player before playing at the ball' interpretation has the potential to lose teams the game due to a controversial penalty. If you look at the games to date this year, Pocock has not produced as many classic pilfers as seasons past, this is due to the new laws and their interpretiation. WC are won on defence. Pococks game is slowly changing if you ask me. He is now looking to be more of a ball runner and defensive rock and is moving towards how McCaw has started to play. The days of the scavenger are not over in terms of workrate but in terms of opportunities to pilfer.

I think Deans is looking to focus more on a solid defensive unit across the park and doesn't see the need for a reserve opensider. This is good news for Rocky as I think it virtually guarantees Higgers and McCalman will be on the bench... as backrow cover. If Pocock, heavens forbid gets a niggle and needs to be replaced, Deans will throw on McCalman or Higgers and given he doesn't see much value in playing a scavenger. If Pocock was ruled out then a replacement 7 would be called up.

The bottom line is Deans doesn't see any point taking a spare 7 when he thinks McCalman/Higgers can fill the breach off the bench for the last 10 if needed and he intends on playing Pocock in all games except perhaps Russia.

3. Although I rate Hodgson higher than Robinson at 7... I feel Robinson could have been a decent option in the squad as he can handle 6 against Italy/Russia or USA if required.

 

[Blue]

Well yeah, in SA of course

I think a 6 is more important in attack, and a 7 is more important in defense. 6 secures ball and 7 steals.

That's why I don't mind the French tactic of using a Left and Right flanker instead of a Openside or Blindside. They can afford to have players that have both skill sets.

Not quite true. Ireland game case in point. Dusatoir is pratically playing like an openside now. Maybe their coach has wisened up?

Maybe it has something to do with the French losing lots? We struggled last year without an openside. Lesson in there somewhere or am I overstating it?

 

[Blue]

3 points -

1. I think Deans is going to pick his strongest team for all games... bar perhaps resting a few against Russia. USA wont be a second string team but full strength perhaps because it's the last pool game before the quarters so Deans will want his best team starting and finding form/combinations. With Italy and Ireland first up.. again, he will pick his full strength starting lineup to ensure victory. The bench will be used to keep blokes fresh after 50-60 minutes.

2. THe game has changed or is changing. The breakdown laws, the 'must release tackled player before playing at the ball' interpretation has the potential to lose teams the game due to a controversial penalty. If you look at the games to date this year, Pocock has not produced as many classic pilfers as seasons past, this is due to the new laws and their interpretiation. WC are won on defence. Pococks game is slowly changing if you ask me. He is now looking to be more of a ball runner and defensive rock and is moving towards how McCaw has started to play. The days of the scavenger are not over in terms of workrate but in terms of opportunities to pilfer.

I think Deans is looking to focus more on a solid defensive unit across the park and doesn't see the need for a reserve opensider. This is good news for Rocky as I think it virtually guarantees Higgers and McCalman will be on the bench... as backrow cover. If Pocock, heavens forbid gets a niggle and needs to be replaced, Deans will throw on McCalman or Higgers and given he doesn't see much value in playing a scavenger. If Pocock was ruled out then a replacement 7 would be called up.

The bottom line is Deans doesn't see any point taking a spare 7 when he thinks McCalman/Higgers can fill the breach off the bench for the last 10 if needed and he intends on playing Pocock in all games except perhaps Russia.

3. Although I rate Hodgson higher than Robinson at 7... I feel Robinson could have been a decent option in the squad as he can handle 6 against Italy/Russia or USA if required.

Yes but the only real risk remains if Pocock pulls up in the warm up in one of the big games. The openside is not suddenly null and void. Someone needs to slow the ball down. Ask Richie

 

[Groucho]

I also think that McCalman is the most likely emergency back up, but wouldn't be surprised if we see the following loosies in big matches:

6 Elsom
7 Pocock
8 Samo

Bench: Higginbotham, Palu

If Pocock goes down during the game, then Higgers or Rocky go to 7. I love the idea of having some big loose forwards being able to work their arses off for 50-60, knowing that we have a couple of guys just as bigger (or bigger) sitting on the bench.

It is hard to imagine Samo, for all his qualities, being picked ahead of the far superior Palu.

 

[Groucho]

This is what I don't get with a lot of the comments about various players seagulling. Seems pretty obvious to me that players will be doing what the coach told them.

Does anyone really think McKenzie would have kept Higginbotham in the starting Reds team if he was bludging out in the backline on his own bat?

Why not? Substitute "playing very loose" for the overly-emotive "bludging out in the backline" and it then becomes a simple matter of Link making the most of Higginbotham's capabilities.

 

[Richo]

Why not? Substitute "playing very loose" for the overly-emotive "bludging out in the backline" and it then becomes a simple matter of Link making the most of Higginbotham's capabilities.

Right. I seem to recall Link being on record saying as much.

 

[Athilnaur]

I agree with Skippy. And of course this is precisely what we have seen from Pocock - a huge amount of tackling and breakdown work. Turnovers happen and we all want them, but the real value Pocock brings under current rule interpretation is in defense by tackling and slowing the attack.

His work rate vs the Boks was staggering - 50 1st three to breakdown, 32 of those on attack. Add his tackles and tackle assists and the man is an engine. I confess to not really appreciating it fully until I re played the game later.

For those interested, theres a quick cut out on my blog about the team's stats. For me it highlighted the importance of our defense that day by Pocock and McCabe, and gave pause for thought about the idea of running McCabe /Fainga'a as an 'offensive' defense as tabled by a number of peeps here. That said AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) wasn't the slouch some might have thought on defense. Fair to say we can be pretty happy with our defensie stakes at Centre moving into the RWC, esp adding Horne into the mix as an option.

Looking forward to Scotts analysis of the workrates if he has had time to do them, particularly the dominant tackle stuff.

Back to the 7 issue - McCalman might not have set the world alight on attack, but his defense was very solid. If the worst happened, you could do worse than having him on hand and calling on Beau.

 

[Skippy]

Yes but the only real risk remains if Pocock pulls up in the warm up in one of the big games. The openside is not suddenly null and void. Someone needs to slow the ball down. Ask Richie

Agree completely. I will find it very interesting if a back up 7 is selected for the NZ game in Brisbane... given one isn't going to the WC!?!

I think we will see Pocock replaced by McCalman agsinst Italy and Ireland to give McCalman time to play 7 and the team to adjust to not having a poacher/scavenger. Then McCalman will get 80 minutes v Russia before Pococks comes back for the USA game.

The real danger as you say is if Pocock pulls up in the warm up...

So does Deans have a plan b for no pocock? I doubt it. He will use McCalman and call up Hodgson but we all know if Pocock is out.... like Cooper... we haven't got a chance of winning the Cup so the plan b doesn't really matter!

 

[tranquility]

I love Po, but he is not as irreplaceable as say a Genia or Quade, and we can still win it if he goes down god forbid.

I would say that Horwill is our most important forward, followed by a fit TPN and Po-diddy.