Where to for Super Rugby?

[Braveheart81]

OK yep the Tahs are being gifted Moore Park, and WH will be allowed to use Concord. We could add the Force in Perth also gifted a training facility.

Proves and shows beyond doubt the skill, professionalism, astute management of the ARU & NSWRU.

I was wrong I now see the errors, of my judgement, and I acknowledge how the various governing bodies have smartly with elegant systems, have energetically and rapidly applied quick responses to issues at hand.

Further rugby's youth development structures, pathways and technical awareness has never been better managed.

I thank you for showing me the errors of judgement I made.

Thanks for the sanctimonious response.

I've never argued that NSWRU or the ARU have done these things well.

I'm arguing that it isn't a case of 0% versus 100% but somewhere in between.

 

[I like to watch]

It's pretty close to zero.
The Tahs being a tenant ar SFS is hardly pro active.
The ARU using funding that other codes used for high performance centres, for their corporate HQ hardly advances your point that they have have been pro active in any way.

 

[p.Tah]

The walk to the city is pretty significant but if you go the other way then it is less than 5 mins walk to Richmond station (one stop to Flinders Street) and 10 to the Precinct, Corner or Cricketers arms in Richmond.

Richmond station isn't great in my experience when the MCG empties. I usually just walk to the city.

 

[half]

Thanks for the sanctimonious response.

I've never argued that NSWRU or the ARU have done these things well.

I'm arguing that it isn't a case of 0% versus 100% but somewhere in between.

BH

Where to start, I accept what you meant to say, but feel you in some ways are looking to excuse the actions and management of our governing bodies while lessening the management of other governing bodies.

The two examples I choose where NSW Football and Valentine Park, and NSWRU Concord, I could add at this point and is far closer to the example is TGM. As you are no doubt aware the trust deed for TGM says if ever these fields are not used for rugby they are to be returned to the surviving heirs of the family. Papworth has proved that it can be sold as long as the funds are used for rugby.

I have spoken to my media client who is the rusted on hard core soccer tragic, I sometimes refer to and who I asked the history of the gift of the farm. So I asked him what he knew of it and the following is the way he told it.

You are correct Mr Valentine [actually his family] provided a farm in Parklea way back in the 50’s or early 60’s. The then NSW Football / Soccer then asked Mr Valentine and many other volunteers to help build them fields, office buildings etc.

Many people came over with trucks, tractors, picks and solves etc and essentially many volunteers along with Mr Valentine build their fields and other structures.

NSW Football believed the area was too small for their long term needs and purchased a farm, the current Valentine Park.

Over the passing of time Parklea developed. It was across the road from where the Parklea markets were built.. They got an offer took the money and then started to develop their current facility. Valentine also negotiated a grant from the Wran government of one million dollar [ a huge amount at the time to build their accommodation facilities].

This is what Football people write about this time,

Valentine Sports Park, the sporting and administrative headquarters of Football NSW, stands as a monument to Charles James Valentine’s vision, tenacity and brilliant financial management.

The NSW Soccer Federation (now Football NSW) will be forever indebted to Charles Valentine for his vision and financial acumen during his 16 years service as NSW Soccer Federation Treasurer.

During his term in office Charles kept a tight control of the Federation’s finances and built up the funds mainly through the gate money received by matches played in NSW by Manchester United, Everton, Liverpool and Celtic.

If I contrast this to how NSWRU managed rugby and what resources they had. I argued for many many many many many many many years and at times to the point of look not again that’s simple not going to work.

TGM should have been used by either the NSWRU or ARU probably both to develop what would have been at the time something unique to rugby in a rugby heartland. It required guarantees to Eastwood of rent free use forever and some kinda of annual indexed compensation to Eastwood.

Concord similar yes I understand a lease is different to out right ownership.

Instead the NSWRU went broke to my knowledge twice.

I will quote again whats said about this guy Valentine and remember for him to be in place he needed the broader support of those running NSW Soccer at the time.

will be forever indebted to Charles Valentine for his vision and financial acumen

Charles kept a tight control of the Federation’s finances and built up the funds

The soul classic “Cry Me a River” does spring to mind. In the grand scheme of things rugby would had had people of the talent and skills of Mr Valentine but we never put them in charge.

 

[wamberal]

Dear oh bloody dear. Have we ever done anything right?


Ever? Just one thing?



Incidentally, events in the past can be interpreted many ways. That is why we have historians, and historians can differ about just about everything. Maybe Valentine was a genius. Or maybe he was lucky. Who knows?


One thing I do know, Frank Lowy was always there, hovering in the near background, with a very large wallet in his generous back pocket. And lots of connections in the property world.

 

[TOCC]

Transport to and from the SFS/SCG will never be ideal even after the light rail, but it is not terrible.

The precinct is amazing for pre and post game food and beverage though. The range of quality pubs and restaurants within a short walk is brilliant.

I've only been to AAMI Park in Melbourne once but the walk from there back to the city or other locations for a drink isn't short. Even from the MCG it is a decent hike to get to good pubs.

But why walk when there's trams and trains? There's also pubs in the other direction towards Richmond to eat and drink at pre-game.
Not everyone is interested in going to a pub and drinking post footy, plenty of people, I'd say well over half including families are keen just to get home.

In my opinion Suncorp Stadium is one of the best positioned interns of surrounding pubs and restaurants, MCG/ALLIANZ is the best overall sporting precinct in Australia for facilities and pips Suncorp for accessibility. To be brutally honest Moore Park is a poorer version of both, what I do like about the Moore Park is the heritage value that the SFS has managed to retain. Adds a little to the experience..

Sydneys stadiums have been a large reason for poor crowds across the various codes IMO, compared to Brisbane and Melbourne crowds.

 

[TOCC]

The Waratahs have a pretty decent facility at Moore Park. The ARU is getting a new office building and facility there as well, predominantly funded by others (UTS, NSW Govt and SCG Trust).

If the Wests Tigers get approval and the relevant backing to upgrade the facility at Concord it will still be a City of Canada Bay property and West Harbour will presumably get to benefit from it as well.

ARU made a mistake by building at Moore Park IMO(see the ARDC thread for more on this) and haven't the Tahs said recently they are going to look at moving when the current lease expires in the next few years?

 

[half]

Dear oh bloody dear. Have we ever done anything right?


Ever? Just one thing?


.

Your call name one.

BTW I did not start the Valentine thing, I used the NSW Football facilities at Valentine Park to illustrate a point in the difference between two governing bodies.

You mentioned Frank Lowy, at the time all the above was happening the Frank Lowy group were in open warfare with the state body over who controlled the game.

The nit picking, back stabbing, and internal wars soccer had at the time made the QLDRU and NSWRU differences look like a tea party.

As a matter of interest did you ever look at the link I posted for Valentine Park, by fuck its impressive and I started this thing by saying I went to a corporate function.

Its a very impressive set up by any standard. Have a look, would appreciate your thoughts and watch the 2 minute youtube as well.

http://valentinesportspark.com.au

 

[James Pettifer]

Richmond station isn't great in my experience when the MCG empties. I usually just walk to the city.

That is true. It is pretty bad because the trains always seem to leave 15-20 minutes after people get to the station. I normally drive and park on the other side of the river.

 

[Quick Hands]

Ownership of facilities doesn't automatically equate to streams of revenue, QRU own Ballymore and whilst an awesome strategic asset it's maintenance costs are a financial drain on the QRU. QRU has been limited by zoning and legislative restrictions which prevent the QRU for developing external commercial interests like a Hotel.

I don't know the full back story for Concord, however like Ballymore, it seems to be from a past era. Concord wasn't even mentioned recently when the NSW government spoke of upgrading stadiums, and for good reason, accessibility is poor and geographically it doesn't serve a region which isn't served by the SFS, ANZ or upgraded Parra stadium.

However on the Tahs, I certainly think they should be better selling themselves to the wider Sydney and not limit themselves to the eastern suburbs, once the new Parra stadium is opened, they should make it an annual pilgrimage to play out there to cater to western Sydney rugby fans.

I'll sum Concord Oval up in two short statements:

It sent the NSWRU broke
The then Managing Director of the NSWRU went to prison

 

[p.Tah]

Incase anyone was wondering, I had lamb for lunch.

That has absolutely nothing to do with the future of Super Rugby, but neither does this thread anymore.

Now for dinner, I'll probably have something from the bbq at the kids rugby tonight.

Breakfast tomorrow will probably be a bacon and egg roll at the kids rugby before I shoot across town for the next kids game where I'll probably have another bacon and egg roll. Lunch - you guessed it at the next game of rugby followed by a burger at the Shute Shield.
I better go for a run on Sunday.

 

[cyclopath]

Incase anyone was wondering, I had lamb for lunch.

That has absolutely nothing to do with the future of Super Rugby, but neither does this thread anymore.

Now for dinner, I'll probably have something from the bbq at the kids rugby tonight.

Breakfast tomorrow will probably be a bacon and egg roll at the kids rugby before I shoot across town for the next kids game where I'll probably have another bacon and egg roll. Lunch - you guessed it at the next game of rugby followed by a burger at the Shute Shield.
I better go for a run on Sunday.

Try to avoid running near Bunnings - because sausages.

 

[oztimmay]

Incase anyone was wondering, I had lamb for lunch.

That has absolutely nothing to do with the future of Super Rugby, but neither does this thread anymore.

Now for dinner, I'll probably have something from the bbq at the kids rugby tonight.

Breakfast tomorrow will probably be a bacon and egg roll at the kids rugby before I shoot across town for the next kids game where I'll probably have another bacon and egg roll. Lunch - you guessed it at the next game of rugby followed by a burger at the Shute Shield.
I better go for a run on Sunday.

Props don't do cardio. So, go and get that Bunnings sausage.

(I assumed you were a Prop due to the amount of eating)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[p.Tah]

Props don't do cardio. So, go and get that Bunnings sausage.

(I assumed you were a Prop due to the amount of eating)

To my father's disappointment I was a back. Perhaps the BBQ is my way of channelling my inner prop to please my Dad

Funnily my daughters just texted me to pick them up from netball, but they said wait 10 minutes because they're getting a sausage sizzle. Must be in the genes.

 

[lou75]

To my father's disappointment I was a back. Perhaps the BBQ is my way of channelling my inner prop to please my Dad

Funnily my daughters just texted me to pick them up from netball, but they said wait 10 minutes because they're getting a sausage sizzle. Must be in the genes.

GD or GS?

 

[p.Tah]

GD or GS?

They alternate but GD this week

 

[Slim 293]

Richmond station isn't great in my experience when the MCG empties. I usually just walk to the city.

Same.........:.

The walk back into the city isn't that long (20 mins from AAMI Park to Fed Square, 5 mins less from the G), and is probably quicker and less hassle than maneuvering the crowds.

 

[James Pettifer]

Just a quick shout out to the 2 try scorers for the Wallabies from the Rebels who probably wouldn't have been playing for Australia if we only had 4 teams.

 

[BLR]

Just a quick shout out to the 2 try scorers for the Wallabies from the Rebels who probably wouldn't have been playing for Australia if we only had 4 teams.

That's questionable. It would be the case if we have 4 stacked teams on expansion but the Force were still pretty weak on expansion. I am sure the Force would have snapped them up if they were available.

 

[James Pettifer]

That's questionable. It would be the case if we have 4 stacked teams on expansion but the Force were still pretty weak on expansion. I am sure the Force would have snapped them up if they were available.

2016 - the Force signed up two senior players - Ben Tapuai from the Reds and Semisi Masirewa. I can't imagine putting Hodge above either of them. They also signed 2 local boys to the EPS. So no, I don't think the Force would have signed Hodge in 2016.

And this is ignoring the fact that Mike Harris, Mitch Inman, Tom English, Dom Shipperly and Cam Crawford would not have been at the Rebels and at least one (if not more) would have been at the Force.

If the Force didn't exist in 2016, it is very unlikely that Rebels would have signed Hodge either as there would be less risky players like Tapuai available.

Even if he had been signed, he probably wouldn't have played for either team for quite a while due to the other more experienced players in front of him

TBH, I'm pretty sure Sefa would have been signed up either way after his performance with the Rising.