Where to for Twiggy Rugby?

[half]

Aurelins

I think you miss my point, Australian like to watch Australian teams.

The A-League is on the verge of a major expansion.

The AFL is also considering expanding in both their women's game and possibly a new team in their male competition.

League is starting to invest a lot in Oceania.

The last thing we need is another competition top heavy with non Australian based teams.

Just because I dislike the ARU & State Unions that does not mean I don't understand their importance moving forward. Nor that I will give blind support to anyone opposing the ARU.

I actually have a reasonable amount of Knowledge about rugby in China and it will become a major sport but over time and not in the short term.

We actually need short term plans to stop the bleeding as well as well crafted plans to move forward. None of what TF has done so far inspires me with confidence he is not moving to mirror image of the Super Rugby competition.

I will hold off until I see the detail, and I hope its not top heavy with overseas sides.

 

[wamberal]

Rugby in China, eh?


My money against yours. Ditto my knowledge of sport in China.


They will not have a professional league, let alone a competitive national side, this century.

 

[Aurelius]

I suppose the gamble they'd be making is that interest in Asia will be sufficient to make up for any shortfall in Australia. Otherwise, you really would be looking at a rebel competition with "World Series" sides from WA, NSW, Queensland, Victoria, Canberra ...

Fun as it would be watching Super Rugby have to compete with such a competition backed by Twiggy's $200m, it doesn't sound like that's what's on the table.

 

[kiap]

Rugby in China, eh?


My money against yours. Ditto my knowledge of sport in China.


They will not have a professional league, let alone a competitive national side, this century.

This century has fair old while to run. My money is on you not seeing half of it, and half not seeing any of your money.

 

[Highlander35]

Tahs Brumbies reds and rebels should leave super rugby and join the TF comp.

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I reckon they'll stick for now, what with contract obligations and all that, but they'd be fools (ARU, state bodies, Super Chairmen/CEO et al) for not making serious movements and/or commitments towards that being the primary Australian league post Super 2020.

 

[half]

This century has fair old while to run. My money is on you not seeing half of it, and half not seeing any of your money.

The two are not necessarily related. My knowledge for what its worth is in the army Union is played to toughen up the troops. They have some many grounds and so many play. It will be a slow but steady build.

 

[dru]

Aurelins

I think you miss my point, Australian like to watch Australian teams.

The A-League is on the verge of a major expansion.

The AFL is also considering expanding in both their women's game and possibly a new team in their male competition.

League is starting to invest a lot in Oceania.

The last thing we need is another competition top heavy with non Australian based teams.

Just because I dislike the ARU & State Unions that does not mean I don't understand their importance moving forward. Nor that I will give blind support to anyone opposing the ARU.

I actually have a reasonable amount of Knowledge about rugby in China and it will become a major sport but over time and not in the short term.

We actually need short term plans to stop the bleeding as well as well crafted plans to move forward. None of what TF has done so far inspires me with confidence he is not moving to mirror image of the Super Rugby competition.

I will hold off until I see the detail, and I hope its not top heavy with overseas sides.

Half, I share your dream of domestic pro comp in Aus. Like you (I think) to a trans tasman I say "why?". One thing a Domestic comp really needs is a team in WA. The ARU great shrink was utter disaster for that. But perhaps Twiggy can keep the Force rolling so they are available when the domestic comp turns up 2020. If it turns up. Had Twiggy decided on a domestic comp it would have been declared rogue and failed before kick off by lack of endorsement from the ARU. I'm hoping he has room for a Sydney team, but you just dont know how ARU reacts to these things. Twiggy Rugby is NOT the mesiah. But it's more than a naughty boy. I have no faith at all in the ARU (add NSWRU/QRU) so I cant accept that they will head toward a future that we both agree on. Not without challenge. To this extent, so far Twiggy is a good thing. DO I have blind faith in the Twig? No. But my faith in the ARU is simply non existent, and my faith in SANZAAR lower. It does mean that Twiggy Forrest, from me, gets a benefit of the doubt that the others do not. I'm not blind though, and you are right. Twiggy ball is not the comp we are looking for.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

I think initially the six teams will have to include at least one other Australian team to maintain support over east, which is why the apparent interest from the Sydney Stars is so intriguing. And Fiji would certainly have to be involved, based on the excitement they're bringing to the NRC. For the initial six teams Force, Sydney, Fiji, Hong Kong, Singapore and Japan (maybe the Top League champion side) sounds pretty good to me, or even better a Brisbane/Queensland side instead of Japan, who have pro rugby pretty well covered anyway. Got the "heartland" covered, the national footprint gets maintained, and we get to grow the game throughout the region all within a three-hour timezone with a tight, easy-to-follow competition.

You make a lot of sense on this - as another oz side would/could potentially be included as would attract more oz fan support/interest and also given TF 'apparently' stumping up big cash and his interests in WA rugby and wider oz rugby (as not completely uncorrelated) I would imagine both TF consortium and ARU would prefer this (noting expectation ARU and TF will be more working together as allies then enemies). Always talked about second Sydney side so yes a Sydney side in the competition would also make sense. Given looking at running outside of Super Rugby window this could be doable.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

I reckon they'll stick for now, what with contract obligations and all that, but they'd be fools (ARU, state bodies, Super Chairmen/CEO et al) for not making serious movements and/or commitments towards that being the primary Australian league post Super 2020.

Other oz Super Rugby sides (and indeed ARU) will see how Twiggyball comp unfolds and will assess whether something they want to commit to post 2020. Increasingly more I think about it I would not be surprised if another oz Sydney based side was one of the 6 included (with assumption this would happen only with ARU blessing). It may make sense yet that we have oz sides in two comps like SA with their pro 14 move, re: a revised Super Rugby competition and TF Twiggyball comp

 

[TOCC]

ARU and TF met, new comp likely to run in the NRC window, with a hybrid version of the NRC to be the base, including extra teams from Asia-Pacific.. interim solution until next broadcast negotiations..

Opportunity for greater change will be in 2019 with Super Rugby finishing earlier in June..

 

[dru]

ARU and TF met, new comp likely to run in the NRC window, with a hybrid version of the NRC to be the base, including extra teams from Asia-Pacific.. interim solution until next broadcast negotiations..

Opportunity for greater change will be in 2019 with Super Rugby finishing earlier in June..

TOCC where have you picked that up?

It's good and not. Perth would still miss out on a proper pro full season comp. Definite step toward that B Plan though for a domestic scene going forward.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

ARU and TF met, new comp likely to run in the NRC window, with a hybrid version of the NRC to be the base, including extra teams from Asia-Pacific.. interim solution until next broadcast negotiations..

Opportunity for greater change will be in 2019 with Super Rugby finishing earlier in June..

So bigger investment of TF's money in oz rugby teams playing in a competition, and that is better outcome than investing in a 6 team comp that has only 1 oz side. What it sounds like is TF and ARU as allies and to be frank that can only be good for the game. Doubt it would happen but gees if we could get TF on the ARU board and lock in the relationship at a more formal level that would be good. BTW TOCC what is your source for this?

 

[ForceFan]

ARU and TF met, new comp likely to run in the NRC window, with a hybrid version of the NRC to be the base, including extra teams from Asia-Pacific.. interim solution until next broadcast negotiations..

Opportunity for greater change will be in 2019 with Super Rugby finishing earlier in June..

I understand that there is little likelihood of the Indo-Pacific comp being an NRC hybrid as this doesn't enable Perth to maintain a professional rugby team. This is Forrest's main goal.

Expect more announcements from Forrest this week re a 6 Team International competition with Perth-based team as the ONLY Australian team.
Just not enough time nor interest to establish a 2nd Aussie team for 2018.

Forrest isn't trying to feed an Aussie market - that's the ARU's job.
He is planning to tap into the Indo-Pacific market that is economically booming.
The initial participants will have already established rugby programs and National teams albeit at lower world rankings.
The injection of more international players will improve the standard of play.
I reckon World Rugby/IRB will be keen to see/help that happen.

Will be interesting as this unfolds.

Expect more from Forrest this week.
ARU Board meeting on Friday.

 

[Strewthcobber]

I understand that there is little likelihood of the Indo-Pacific comp being an NRC hybrid as this doesn't enable Perth to maintain a professional rugby team. This is Forrest's main goal.

Expect more announcements from Forrest this week re a 6 Team International competition with Perth-based team as the ONLY Australian team.
Just not enough tie to establish a 2nd Aussie team for 2018.

Is there enough time to establish 5 international teams?

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[Rugbynutter39]

I understand that there is little likelihood of the Indo-Pacific comp being an NRC hybrid as this doesn't enable Perth to maintain a professional rugby team. This is Forrest's main goal.

Expect more announcements from Forrest this week re a 6 Team International competition with Perth-based team as the ONLY Australian team.
Just not enough tie to establish a 2nd Aussie team for 2018.

So Forefan I am wondering.... If ARU and TF are talking (fantastic if they are which probably moreso can happen now legal stuff out of the way). Would the ARU really want investment in another overseas competition with only 1 oz side or would it want that investment in the NRC hybrid version with strong oz representation. And we know how much investment / money would be required for TF to invest in a long form Indo pacific comp so could then a compromise have been reached that TF commits a bigger sum of money than previously committed to enable the Force to remain in Super Rugby competition (and cover potential SANZAAR legal costs of not cutting a team etc etc). Win win for all concerned. I would think this scenario would be possible and a fantastic outcome. I am just so pleased to see dialogue between TF and the ARU. Whether this is just pipe dream who knows but guess we will find out in due course what is planned in the next 48-72 hours!

 

[Rugbynutter39]

https://thewest.com.au/sport/rugby-...akaway-indo-pacific-competition-ng-b88595109z

Found the source

 

[ForceFan]

So Forefan I am wondering.. If ARU and TF are talking (fantastic if they are which probably moreso can happen now legal stuff out of the way). Would the ARU really want investment in another overseas competition with only 1 oz side or would it want that investment in the NRC hybrid version with strong oz representation. And we know how much investment / money would be required for TF to invest in a long form Indo pacific comp so could then a compromise have been reached that TF commits a bigger sum of money than previously committed to enable the Force to remain in Super Rugby competition (and cover potential SANZAAR legal costs of not cutting a team etc etc). Win win for all concerned. I would think this scenario would be possible and a fantastic outcome. I am just so pleased to see dialogue between TF and the ARU. Whether this is just pipe dream who knows but guess we will find out in due course what is planned in the next 48-72 hours!

If there hadn't been a test in Perth I doubt if there would have been much dialogue.
Remember Clyne forced Forrest to fly to Adelaide for their last meeting and then rejected his $50 million offered (for whatever reasons).

It seems that Forrest is moving on with the idea gaining momentum with interest and support.

 

[wamberal]

Blah, blah, blah.

Everything Twiggy has said and done is (a) totally selfless (b) absolutely in the best interests of the game (c) has been rejected out of hand by the idiots who actually are responsible for the health of the game as a whole for spurious reasons and (d) Twiggy is an absolutely credible source of truth about everything that has been said and done.

Haw, haw, haw.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

If there hadn't been a test in Perth I doubt if there would have been much dialogue.
Remember Clyne forced Forrest to fly to Adelaide for their last meeting and then rejected his $50 million offered (for whatever reasons).

It seems that Forrest is moving on with the idea gaining momentum with interest and support.

One key point of difference FF (Folau Fainga'a) - they were in a legal battle that made open discussions difficult. Legal situation out of the way...easier to have dialogue perhaps. Anyhow whilst this 7 week comp to replace the NRC sounds fantastic - this does not provide a long form competition for WA Rugby to participate in....I guess watch this space.

 

[ForceFan]

Everything Twiggy has said and done is (a) totally selfless (b) absolutely in the best interests of the game (c) has been rejected out of hand by the idiots who actually are responsible for the health of the game as a whole for spurious reasons and (d) Twiggy is an absolutely credible source of truth about everything that has been said and done.

I suggest you look up the meaning of the word "philanthropist".
This is the bloke who recently personally donated $400 Million to a wide range of charities.

One key point of difference FF (Folau Fainga'a) - they were in a legal battle that made open discussions difficult.

The ARU has made much of this but the CEO/CFO visited Perth on 10 April with the advice that axing the Force was a done deal. So much for collaboration/discussion.
The legal defence didn't start until the injunction was sought 1 week later.
Why didn't the ARU make the information available at that time?

Anyhow whilst this 7 week comp to replace the NRC sounds fantastic - this does not provide a long form competition for WA Rugby to participate in.

I understand that the Indo-Pacific comp is planned to fit in between Super Rugby and the Japan comp.
Each team plays each other twice - should make it more like 10-12 weeks including finals.
I would think Perth based players would be free to play elsewhere outside this period as is the current situation.

The Perth based NRC team could comprise local club players and the broader training squad from the Perth professional team. Much the same as most NRC teams.