Where to for Twiggy Rugby?

[cyclopath]

Yeesh, wingers are criminally over-valued by both leagues, and that's coming from a winger. You'd think 7's would be paid more as well.

Doesn't matter whether the pigs get all the field position, or the inside backs make the magic, good finishers will always be of high value to pro teams, converting more of the half chances than not. The better ones anyway. Not saying they should be near the top of the list necessarily though.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Well Fiji Drua's performance and crowd support for home games proving Fiji worthy of having a professional team in twiggyball and indeed would be a drawcard for the comp.

So that is two of the teams guaranteed to have reasonable support (re: Force and Fiji) - just a matter of who would be the other 4 sides. HK and Singapore could maybe do ok if set up well. Samoa - not so sure - but then again I think many would not have predicted Fiji Drua to do so well (and that is with side only with amateurs in its team).

Sri Lanka also interestingly and previously unknown to me could be another wildcard as did not realise such a big rugby playing country,.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Indeed RN.

Interestingly whenever I've suggested including PI nations in any tournament the usual suspects have come out and said it couldn't work.

Well I think with Fiji Drua's performance so far on and off the field (re: including home ground support) it is quickly proving that is incorrect that it could not work. If anything they are showing how far the skill levels of our overpaid oz rugby professional players have fallen. Watching the Fiji Drua have been the highlight of many rugby persons watching NRC this season. I do hope that Twiggy still plans to offer some decent cash for grassroots investments which for my mind definitely is in needed in coaching and also academies as I am just not enjoying the skill levels demonstrated at Super Rugby and NRC level and sadly finding it rather painful viewing.

 

[Quick Hands]

Well I think with Fiji Drua's performance so far on and off the field (re: including home ground support) it is quickly proving that is incorrect that it could not work. If anything they are showing how far the skill levels of our overpaid oz rugby professional players have fallen. Watching the Fiji Drua have been the highlight of many rugby persons watching NRC this season. I do hope that Twiggy still plans to offer some decent cash for grassroots investments which for my mind definitely is in needed in coaching and also academies as I am just not enjoying the skill levels demonstrated at Super Rugby and NRC level and sadly finding it rather painful viewing.

Super Rugby lost me about a quarter of the way through this season and I doubt I'll be back.

I was really looking forward to the NRC this year - especially with Norths, Warringah and Manly all in the semis and Warringah playing Norths in the grand finals. Great season coming up for the Rays I thought. But when it starts I find that Warringah, Norths and Manly players are scattered throughout the three NSW teams - tribalism and local passion out the window. So, so frustrating.

 

[barbarian]

I worry about Singapore as an option - their Sunwolves games have been played in front of dismal crowds. Maybe with a team of their own it would change, but I'm skeptical.
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[p.Tah]

Ask a Singaporean what their national sport is and they'll say shopping.
Lots of expats and an amazing stadium but the expats seem to be different to those of HK.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

I worry about Singapore as an option - their Sunwolves games have been played in front of dismal crowds. Maybe with a team of their own it would change, but I'm skeptical.
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Pity the sunwolves are in super rugby as Japanese team would be commercially good option. Maybe when they are kicked out of super rugby they could join twiggyball.


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[TOCC]

The evolution of Twiggy League and Super Rugby will meet half way in the long run, they can't compete with each other.


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[Quick Hands]

Ideally, Super Rugby would continue with the NZ, SA and Argentinian teams and the 5 Aussie teams would play with teams from Japan, Pacific Islands and possible other franchises from Asia in the Twiggy backed competition.

 

[barbarian]

Ideally, Super Rugby would continue with the NZ, SA and Argentinian teams and the 5 Aussie teams would play with teams from Japan, Pacific Islands and possible other franchises from Asia in the Twiggy backed competition.

Really? I think the ideal outcome is a 12-13 team comp featuring 5 Aussie sides, 5 Kiwi sides, a team from Japan and a PI team or two.

But I agree with TOCC that Twiggyball is a bridging solution until we can reassess in 2020.
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[Quick Hands]

Really? I think the ideal outcome is a 12-13 team comp featuring 5 Aussie sides, 5 Kiwi sides, a team from Japan and a PI team or two.

But I agree with TOCC that Twiggyball is a bridging solution until we can reassess in 2020.
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NZRU want to play SA teams, SA teams want to play NZ teams. Long standing policy position of both unions. Discussion on trans-Tasman option is pointless until that dynamic changes.

And to be perfectly honest, I think that we would be better off in many ways in and Indo-Pacific competition without the Kiwis. PI teams bring World Rugby subsidies with them and all three have significant expat populations in Australia to attend games played here.

I'm pretty much over the Steve Tew/NZRU thing. We need to stand on our own two feet.

 

[Braveheart81]

NZRU want to play SA teams, SA teams want to play NZ teams. Long standing policy position of both unions. Discussion on trans-Tasman option is pointless until that dynamic changes.

And to be perfectly honest, I think that we would be better off in many ways in and Indo-Pacific competition without the Kiwis. PI teams bring World Rugby subsidies with them and all three have significant expat populations in Australia to attend games played here.

NZ involvement brings international interest and TV broadcasting revenue.

I think the NZ position on SA is changing rapidly. They won't keep playing South African teams if it no longer makes financial sense.

They're in a substantially stronger financial position than us due to the All Blacks being a more lucrative brand than the Wallabies but the arse has also fallen out of their Super Rugby crowds.

Everyone relies on the TV dollars that come from the big markets in Europe.

 

[dru]

I don’t think the NZ position on RSA is changing. There is however acknowledgement that SARU are creating their own destiny.

Like Half, I’m over Tew/NZRU dictating our rugby. Pull back to a domestic comp, add in Pacific/Japan etc if the case can be made.

The broadcast $ outside of Australia in the current set up is because the system presents very poorly to the domestic fan and income is poor. Resolve that with a home game each fortnight and chase some proper marketing.

It doesn’t need to compete for domination in the Australian market, just compete for a percentage that works commercially.

I’d be happy to see after the new domestic comp, a SANZAAR champions league, though here I’d look to rep teams and only three of them. Qld, NSW and “South” for want of better name.

It is well time to cut the NZ umbilical cord - this only achieves things AFTER satisfying the mighty All Blacks.

Time to look after ourselves.

 

[barbarian]

I understand the NZ issues, and acknowledge the points raised. I'm speaking hypothetically, because I know they won't walk away from SA easily.

I just think the NZ involvement really sets us apart from League and AFL, and the Crusaders, Chiefs et al still have strong recognition and appeal in Aussie markets.

I'd be worried they would just shit all over us, but at least we'd see some high quality rugby.

I'm not opposed to cutting them off, I just think we are probably better off with them in the long run.
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[dru]

I understand the NZ issues, and acknowledge the points raised. I'm speaking hypothetically, because I know they won't walk away from SA easily.

I just think the NZ involvement really sets us apart from League and AFL, and the Crusaders, Chiefs et al still have strong recognition and appeal in Aussie markets.

I'd be worried they would just shit all over us, but at least we'd see some high quality rugby.

I'm not opposed to cutting them off, I just think we are probably better off with them in the long run.
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B, the response is relatively easy, as far as these things go anyway. So no, we don’t “cut off our nose to spite our face”. We plan a system that works for us. Keep avenues for the Kiwis. If they are interested in our terms, good.

And they won’t be.

BUT we don’t walk away that quick either, what are they proposing as an alternate? Does it work for Australia? All good if so.

BUT my suggestion is that they won’t be interested in anything that isn’t biased to the All Blacks. What just must must must happen then is “Love you guys, but NO THANKS”.

We have to get our heads into a space where we start working for ourselves.

 

[dru]

The moment I hit “post” I realised I have more to add.

It has been claimed now and then that SH Super Rugby is the best quality club rugby in the world. This is something I no longer give a damn about. The only, ONLY thing I care about is whether the things we are involved in are making Australian rugby stronger.

We have been making SANZAAR stronger since it’s inception. From now on, with an absolutely determined implementation, it needs to be about whether SANZAAR is making us stronger.

 

[barbarian]

So what about this Dru for a proposal. Would you accept this as being in the best interests of Aussie rugby?

12 teams, 2 pools of 6. Pool A = 5 Aussie Super teams, Sunwolves. Bool B = 5 Kiwi teams, Fiji Drua.

You play your own pool twice, and the other pool once. 15 games each with a six team finals.

It's not perfect, but I think it might be the best case scenario.
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[WorkingClassRugger]

So what about this Dru for a proposal. Would you accept this as being in the best interests of Aussie rugby?

12 teams, 2 pools of 6. Pool A = 5 Aussie Super teams, Sunwolves. Bool B = 5 Kiwi teams, Fiji Drua.

You play your own pool twice, and the other pool once. 15 games each with a six team finals.

It's not perfect, but I think it might be the best case scenario.
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The Sunwolves can be in NZ's conference. We'll take the Drua. But yeah, that would work.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Really? I think the ideal outcome is a 12-13 team comp featuring 5 Aussie sides, 5 Kiwi sides, a team from Japan and a PI team or two.

But I agree with TOCC that Twiggyball is a bridging solution until we can reassess in 2020.
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Long term i do see a china team if investment planned in Chinese rugby comes to fruition but by 2020 pigs arse.

At least for twiggyball fiji proving worthy inclusions so who is to say another team could not be surprise packets with some initial financial backing (read imports)... harder to see but maybe we are not visionary enough and would be good to see if could be a few other or even one other success to grow the game in our region.


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[Rugbynutter39]

I understand the NZ issues, and acknowledge the points raised. I'm speaking hypothetically, because I know they won't walk away from SA easily.

I just think the NZ involvement really sets us apart from League and AFL, and the Crusaders, Chiefs et al still have strong recognition and appeal in Aussie markets.

I'd be worried they would just shit all over us, but at least we'd see some high quality rugby.

I'm not opposed to cutting them off, I just think we are probably better off with them in the long run.
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If nz want to play ball I think we would welcome them but pacific island countries and Japan could equally make for a good domestic league with Possibly another Asian wildcard import. We can't let nz dictate our future so taking new opportunities presented by twiggyball is a step in the right direction as let's face it nz have only naturally been looking after their all blacks brand then giving a toss about whether oz rugby is strong and fair enough too so time we looked after our own interests in Asia. Exit stage right twiggy!


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