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Ireland v Australia

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Inside Shoulder

Nathan Sharpe (72)
@cardiffblue, Be thankful that no one has whinged about referee bias/incompetence as the reason why we lost.

We certainly benefited from what appeared to be an incorrect call over the final pass from Phipps for Foley's try.

The tone of jackson's multiple inquiries suggests that he thought it was forward and felt had missed the "no" from the TMO.
Maybe thew Irish TV director helped us out by not finding a conclusive angle.
Agree with Cyclo that there was nothing to slash wrists over but I think we need to have a long hard look at trying to hide blokes in the back 3 (which must have been 4 at times) who are knee high to a grass hopper and will not win the aerial contest.
 

Brumby Runner

David Wilson (68)
Honestly some posters provincial bias' have become so dominant they cannot really be taken seriously. Not just you BR, but others who blamed Foley for the loss due to place kicking amongst other rubbish.

Really since the politics and rubbish surrounding the resignation of Link and the farcical nature of the whole Beale saga, ending in the woeful decision to select the bloke (who in 50 something tests has performed in under a handful ) Australian fandom has become even more insular and parochial. The management of the ARU really are inept, the game was already on its last legs and we throw in the whole complex process of "investigating" the Beale saga just to give the few fans left confidence. We enter the end game now. I wonder what the comparative viewer rating are in comparison with the same tour last year and before/after the re-inclusion of Beale. The figures that I have seen are not good.

Gnostic, I don't think you are saying that I suggested Foley lost us the game, but I can't be real sure. I haven't in fact mentioned any missed kicks at goal, nor have I apportioned any blame (maybe by implication at Cheika) for the loss. I am just saying that Foley has a number of deficiencies in his defensive game and is not as good an all round No 10 as Cooper or maybe To'omua.

As for bias, in my suggested team for next week, I think there are 4 Tahs, 4 Brumbies and 4 Reds with 2 Force and one Rebel. I think so far as regional bias is concerned, that is about as balanced as any team is likely to be. But I hasten to add that regional balance did not enter into any of my suggested selections. It's just the way it turned out.
 

Micheal

Nicholas Shehadie (39)
Jesus you really all are a bunch of miserable pricks.

I thought we didn't play too bad at all - aside from stupid handling errors in the Irish 22 - we did pretty well and the signs are promising.

I disagree that our attack looks better with Quade on the field. He, for me, is the Australian attacking psyche manifest, and I don't think that is a good thing. Too often he'll go for the miracle long ball (the wrong option when we have an overlap) or look to offloads / flick passes. These are the spices of a good attack, not the main course.

I still have too many memories of the World Cup and other times he's let us down. He's not bad. He's actually pretty good. On his day, he's amazing. But he's not the messiah everyone thinks he is. I would say he's still distinctly 2nd in the pecking order for the flyhalf, and for a good reason, but that is all very susceptible to change.

Foley, I thought, did pretty well. He had a hand in a lot of our better attacking moments, and can you all please stop whinging about his defence? It's not that bad. I would go as far as saying it's markedly better than any other first choice 10 we have (this doesn't include Lealifano or To'omua, as they are chosen as centres). His kicking wasn't amazing, but as others have pointed out, its a team sport and thus he can not bear the blame for the loss. Everyone has a bad day with the boot every now and then, and if several other plays missed tackles to let in tries, knocked balls on at crucial times, gave away penalties. Apportioning blame in that regard is not constructive.

To'omua played well and showed some good physicality, and was extremely reliable in clearing the ball.

Tevita Kuridrani - holy moly what a revelation he's been. This time last year I was a huge sceptic. I thought he had concrete slabs for hands but he's really proved me wrong. The only quarrel I have with his game is that he's not the best lateral defender. That being said, he smokes people when they run it straight at him and he's the penetrating runner the Australian back line revolves around. Hope he's fine for next week.

Phipps continues to show why he'll be the 1st choice 9 going into the WC. Who would have thought? Speight also looked promising, and showed a bit of the class that we've all come to expect of him.

AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) didn't look amazing, but the experience and level headedness he brings to the team is something we probably all under appreciate. If i'm not mistaken, he has more caps then the rest of the starting back line combined?

Izzy was Izzy. I'm more and more confused as to my opinion of him. He's a penetrative runner, but I'm starting to think he's more suited to wing then fullback. His decision making is subpar, his defence positioning is likewise, and he's certainly not the best kicker in the team. I wouldn't mind seeing AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) / Cooper / Beale start there, with Izzy on the wing.

Now to the important stuff, the forwards:

Kepu and Slipper are the best props we have, followed by daylight. A good performance from both of them, and the front row is looking dependable even with Fainga'a (our 63rd choice hooker) starting. He's really impressed me, as I haven't always been a fan.

Rob Simmons and Sam Carter are slowly winning me over. Emphasis on slowly, and thats probably only because the other options are a bunch of numptys. I would take Etzebeth / Retallick / O'Connel / Lawes / Douglas / anyone over these guys, but they're improving, and that can only be seen as a positive.

Jones had me cringing at the start of the game with his honker of a pass and two turnovers through poor body height. Thought he was destined for a shocker, but I didn't notice him a huge amount for the remainder of the rest of the game, and given his known work rate, that only bodes well for him. McCalman was huge, and is starting to chip away at my Palu / Higgers man love. Hooper, as always, was an energiser bunny. How was he not nominated for IRB World Rugby player of the year?

As for replacements: Quade had a decent impact. That offload had be salivating, but I feel like he's still a work in progress as he returns from injury. Genia was a bit meh. The replacement props were reliable, as were Shatz and Skelton, who had some good moments with the ball.

Beale, on the other hand, was quite average. Fielded two good bombs, but too lateral in attack. He needs to play a lot wider to be effective, at about 3rd or 4th receiver, where he can look to put himself into space. He runs extremely good support lines, but he's susceptible to trying to do too much.

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In summary, not a terrible performance. We were beaten by the Paddy's, who are on the up and up and playing with a confidence and belief they haven't had for a while. Combined with that, they have some terrific players (Sexton, O'Connell, their hooker was particularly good tonight, as were their 15 and 13).

Contrastingly, we're 4 games into a new coaches tenure, with a squad he didn't pick, after an exceptionally tumultuous period, learning new patterns and playing philosophies, with a handful of injuries.

I personally thought tonight was a terrific game to watch, and the outlook really isn't that bad. You lot need to find a bit of positivity and drop the petty provincialism. It's really getting out of hand. I literally can't take half of you seriously, and it's making me tired of coming back to this site (a place I was first attracted to because of how informed everyone was).

Let's hope the boys get fired up for next week, as it should be another cracker of a game. Carn Australia.
 

Brumby Runner

David Wilson (68)
Jones worked hard after getting caught out early. As ever, should be taken with the usual handful of salt, but through 52 minutes his rough statline looks something like: 10 tackles, none missed, 7 runs for 21m, 7 rucks hit, 2 lineout wins and 3 penalties conceded.

By comparison Schatz in his 20 minutes made 3 tackles with 1 miss, 1 run for 5m, 1 ruck hit, no lineout takes or penalties conceded.

Hooper and McCalman put up comparable numbers, but they had an extra half hour to do so. Not saying it was a great performance or anything, but he put in a decent shift in tight. Worth another shot.

I thought Jones was better than most posters here are saying. But on Schatz - didn't he take the lineout that followed the aborted lineout Skelton "jumped" for?
 

Micheal

Nicholas Shehadie (39)
For the record, the team I would choose next week is:

1. Slipper
2. Fainga'a
3. Kepu
4. Carter
5. Simmons
6. Jones
7. Hooper
8. McCalman
9. Phipps
10. Foley
11. Speight
12. To'omua
13. Kuridrani (AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) if he's not fit)
14. Folau
15. Cooper (his tactical kicking from the back will be extremely helpful).

16. Faulkner
17. Hanson
18. Robinson
19. Horwill / Skelton
20. McMahon
21. Genia
22. AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) (Horne if Kuridrani is out)
23. Beale
 

tragic

John Solomon (38)
They got quick ball even when wheeled, so the wheel was ineffective/inconsequential.

Might not have got the outcome we were looking for but a dominant wheel is still a wheel - and it's an indication of a stronger scrum.
The NH scrums do seem to be better at getting quick channel ball when they are back peddling without popping or collapsing. Something we should take note of.
 

Brumby Runner

David Wilson (68)
I commented after the French test that I was perplexed by the constant shuffling of the two wingers between right and left. It happened again against Ireland. As I believe this constant to-ing and fro-ing can only be detrimental to the defensive structures of the team as a whole, can anybody suggest just why Gray/Cheika would be doing this?
 
T

TOCC

Guest
I don't know what people are talking about when they mention parhocalism and club bias???

Meanwhile, here is my team for next week:

1. Holmes
2. Fainga'a
3. Slipper
4. Horwill
5. Simmons
6. Shatz
7. Gill
8. Browning
9. Genia
10. Cooper
11. JOC (James O'Connor)
12. Tapuai
13. Kerevi
14. Turner
15. K.Hunt

16. Kepu
17. Hanson
18. Robinson
19. McCalman
20. Burgess
21. Foley
22. CFS
23. JJT
 

BarneySF

Bob Loudon (25)
Would love confirmation from anyone who saw France/Wales games more than once or recalls- but I thought Tomane actually busted through the first or second tackles on several occasions? If he was able to take some angry pills and impose himself more he could make a bigger impact. Either way should take the other wing with AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) at 13.
 

USARugger

John Thornett (49)
If its not the Wobs, I'd be happy with that.
Gonna need a few more line breaks and attacking spark than last night to pull it off though. Midfield bombs will be returned with interest by the ABs.

They wouldn't play like that against the ABs - Schmidt is a horses-for-courses coach. He also does his research, and knows that just about everyone else on the Wallaby roster aside from Izzy ranges from questionable to terrible under the high ball.
 

Sully

Tim Horan (67)
Staff member
It's not hard guys. If you want to talk about this game post here. If you want to name a team or talk about net weeks game go to that match thread. It's not rocket surgery.
 

cyclopath

George Smith (75)
Staff member
I commented after the French test that I was perplexed by the constant shuffling of the two wingers between right and left. It happened again against Ireland. As I believe this constant to-ing and fro-ing can only be detrimental to the defensive structures of the team as a whole, can anybody suggest just why Gray/Cheika would be doing this?
You mean shuffling in all aspects of play or just defence? Speight moved a round a lot, but mainly played right wing, as he should. I suspect he has been given a roving commission a bit to get involved on attack, as wingers seem to these days. This can mean players need to realign quickly if there is fast turnover ball. In defence, I agree, too much movement is problematic, although the defence was good until the latter parts of the game - a few misses were well covered by the structures. If you have Speight and one of AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper), Tomane or Horne on the other wing I cannot see any reason to move them around much.
As I said somewhere else earlier, I would just get them all defending where they are, and that includes Cooper or Foley at 10.
 
T

Train Without a Station

Guest
For the record, the team I would choose next week is:

1. Slipper
2. Fainga'a
3. Kepu
4. Carter
5. Simmons
6. Jones
7. Hooper
8. McCalman
9. Phipps
10. Foley
11. Speight
12. To'omua
13. Kuridrani (AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) if he's not fit)
14. Folau
15. Cooper (his tactical kicking from the back will be extremely helpful).

16. Faulkner
17. Hanson
18. Robinson
19. Horwill / Skelton
20. McMahon
21. Genia
22. AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) (Horne if Kuridrani is out)
23. Beale

So you'd pick a guy who's played as much 15 as 10 and his strength has been mentioned as his running at 10 THEN put a guy who has always played 10 and is a better tactical kicker and better at picking holes with passes and unleashing outside men at 15.

Seems absolutely insane to me.
 

Viking

Mark Ella (57)
Does anyone else think that AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) has looked average at best on the wing this year?

He is a world class 13 but behind Kuridrani. I think Cheika needs to make a tough call and put him on the bench and start either Tomane/Horne and Speight who I think have looked much better.
 

Hugh Jarse

Rocky Elsom (76)
Staff member
He took one.
Did he? There you go then. Like I said, a handful of salt. Be interested to see what ForceFan has to say.
I thought Jones was better than most posters here are saying. But on Schatz - didn't he take the lineout that followed the aborted lineout Skelton "jumped" for?

The replay clearly shows Shatz taking the lineout, after the Skelton "almost take" was re-thrown. About 77 minutes.
 
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