2017 Under-20 Competitions including Oceania & World U20s

[Highlander35]

There's simply a problem with opportunities as well.

JP Sauni was the 2nd string hooker for the Rebels U20s behind Uelese for two years I think, then left to play in Auckland, and is now in the NZ U20s.

Did no one else think he was worthy of a go (nepotism?), or was there just more development opportunities in NZ

 

[The sage]

There's simply a problem with opportunities as well.

JP Sauni was the 2nd string hooker for the Rebels U20s behind Uelese for two years I think, then left to play in Auckland, and is now in the NZ U20s.

Did no one else think he was worthy of a go (nepotism?), or was there just more development opportunities in NZ

Think highlander it's a combination of both of those things; and there is a third factor that includes the quality of the coaching and mentoring.


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[Quick Hands]

Think highlander it's a combination of both of those things; and there is a third factor that includes the quality of the coaching and mentoring.


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I suspect that the 3rd factor is the biggest.

 

[amirite]

There's simply a problem with opportunities as well.

JP Sauni was the 2nd string hooker for the Rebels U20s behind Uelese for two years I think, then left to play in Auckland, and is now in the NZ U20s.

Did no one else think he was worthy of a go (nepotism?), or was there just more development opportunities in NZ

JP was comfortably worse than Jordan and was, frankly, overweight and unfit. He probably still is worse than Jordan.

He got his shit together in between the end of season 2015 and start of season 2016 and by end of season 2016 was in NZ. Rebels 20s coaches were telling him he was a real chance at Aus 20s next year before he left.

Luckily for him the NZ U20s provincial season runs late in the year, whereas ours runs early.

 

[Highlander35]

JP was comfortably worse than Jordan and was, frankly, overweight and unfit. He probably still is worse than Jordan.

He got his shit together in between the end of season 2015 and start of season 2016 and by end of season 2016 was in NZ. Rebels 20s coaches were telling him he was a real chance at Aus 20s next year before he left.

Luckily for him the NZ U20s provincial season runs late in the year, whereas ours runs early.

Wasn't suggesting he was close to Uelese. As good as he was in the '16 tournament, Jordan outperformed him at every opportunity.

Just somewhat surprised/disappointed that someone as talented as that (and to play U20s for NZ, you need to be pretty bloody talented) would go overseas and nothing but a few comments by Vic supporters (of which I think you were the news breaker?) in last years Rebels thread would result.

While it's not the thread for it, it again shows the ridiculousness of the Super situation we're in. Two players in the same position are playing for (the junior sides of) the two of the best teams in the world, both from the same state, who's team, both the pro and development aspects of it might be cut in 4 weeks time? Silly stuff.

 

[Brumby Runner]

Uelese went off injured against Samoa, and it didn't look good. Anyone have news?

What impact will it have on the team makeup if he's not available? Assume then Maafu will start and Malolo will cover hooker from the bench. Who then would be the bench LHP? I noted that Johnson-Holmes moved to LHP when Vui came on v Samoa, and put in a big effort there as he always seems to do. If he moves to the loose head side, who covers THP from the bench? Remembering that all three front row spots must be covered on the bench.

I just do not see a net positive in playing Hockings. May be the best lineout operator since sliced bread, but the rest of his game can only be described as weak. Note the number of missed or broken tackles from him by the Samoans. He has no presence at all around the field during a game. Swinton was very good in both games, and he also stole two or three Samoan lineout throws, so not much loss if any at the lineout, and a hell of a lot better and more aggressive player in the open and in the tight stuff.

Otherwise, like the side that The Sage put together.

 

[Happy to Chat]

Spot on Sage with the team up to 20. Obviously Goddard at 21, then it gets interesting. I think Riley has played himself in at 22 and Jooste played himself out. The only thing that might save Jooste is his versatility by being able to fill in 10,12 and 15 but he's really off his game. Tupou impressed v Samoa. Don't know much about him, is he usually a winger? Also is Jayden Ngamanu still about?



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Yeah Jayden is about, IMO he is a better player than given credit for in the 20s. He should be in above Tupou, Semisi is still young and green and it shows on the field in position and defense. He still has another 2 years at u20's.


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[The sage]

Uelese went off injured against Samoa, and it didn't look good. Anyone have news?

What impact will it have on the team makeup if he's not available? Assume then Maafu will start and Malolo will cover hooker from the bench. Who then would be the bench LHP? I noted that Johnson-Holmes moved to LHP when Vui came on v Samoa, and put in a big effort there as he always seems to do. If he moves to the loose head side, who covers THP from the bench? Remembering that all three front row spots must be covered on the bench.

I just do not see a net positive in playing Hockings. May be the best lineout operator since sliced bread, but the rest of his game can only be described as weak. Note the number of missed or broken tackles from him by the Samoans. He has no presence at all around the field during a game. Swinton was very good in both games, and he also stole two or three Samoan lineout throws, so not much loss if any at the lineout, and a hell of a lot better and more aggressive player in the open and in the tight stuff.

Otherwise, like the side that The Sage put together.

Uelese's not looking great (from sources), they will give him till the twelfth hour and then some. Yes that is the conundrum at the moment; a lack of front-rowers and probably one too many hookers!!

Yeah understand you may not like hocking, but my limited viewing of the English forwards, they are not as big (in attack) as the Samoan's forwards are. He is a good athlete, good at kick off receipts and in order to try and dominate the line-out in the first half he's the man. He can always be replaced if the English physicality is too much or plan a (line-out dominance) fails.


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[thebreakdown]

IMO, Stewart is only great if the pack are dominant, I don't think he's cool under pressure, I rated him however, previous games back home showed how good qld pack was and I think now it's done a 180 on him. I hope I'm wrong but that's my spill on him. Whats going on with Jayden Ngamanu? Why is he not running? He has great footwork and surely deserves a crack ahead of Semisi? I'm with you HTC !


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[The sage]

Uelese's not looking great (from sources), they will give him till the twelfth hour and then some. Yes that is the conundrum at the moment; a lack of front-rowers and probably one too many hookers!!

Yeah understand you may not like hocking, but my limited viewing of the English forwards, they are not as big (in attack) as the Samoan's forwards are. He is a good athlete, good at kick off receipts and in order to try and dominate the line-out in the first half he's the man. He can always be replaced if the English physicality is too much or plan a (line-out dominance) fails.


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Uelese most likely won't make it for Friday. Therefore qld hooker will probably start with Gavin Luka (prop) starting on the bench.


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[The sage]

Thank god I was wrong above. A strong team has been put on paper. Good luck boys today we'll we watching and cheering you home. 100% behind you all to do your best!

http://www.rugby.com.au/match-centre/216/2017/6772


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[Brumby Runner]

Johnson-Holmes on the bench to cover LHP. Just shows his versatility. Guarantee he could play hooker of ever required.

Only improvement I would offer would be to start Swinton in place of Hockings.

 

[amirite]

Johnson-Holmes on the bench to cover LHP. Just shows his versatility. Guarantee he could play hooker of ever required.

Only improvement I would offer would be to start Swinton in place of Hockings.

He's the best prop I've seen ride the pine for Australia at an U20 tournament.

In a really negative time for Australian rugby, it's worth highlighting the little things. We had a solid 10 years when our scrum was the worst in the world, and now we're got depth of good scrummagers in U20s and the Wallabies.

It's always good to highlight the good news stories.

 

[wamberal]

I suspect that the 3rd factor is the biggest.

There is a fourth possibility. That it was actually the right option at the time. Sometimes, even you would admit, we might get something right?


Just because things have gone in a direction that we would not prefer, does not mean that we made a mistake. It might just mean that circumstances have changed.

 

[kiap]

Lads are playing well.

 

[I like to watch]

England lucky to be only 6 behind.
We are dominating breakdown, good to see an English team struggling at set piece.

It's like they are playing at altitude, both sides kicking the ball miles.

 

[Nusadan]

Close but no cigar, Johnson HOlmes sin binned w 5 mins to go to give England the penno to win match 20 to 19.

Aussies made over 20 phases after winning the restart to no avail, but they should be proud of themselves.

 

[sidelineview]

An unfortunate mistake by the front rower but a miss kick by the half from a scrum not long before that was just as significant.
I thought they would take the drop goal as the last play. They had set it up well. Bad luck. They played well.

 

[Dave Beat]

There's simply a problem with opportunities as well.

JP Sauni was the 2nd string hooker for the Rebels U20s behind Uelese for two years I think, then left to play in Auckland, and is now in the NZ U20s.

Did no one else think he was worthy of a go (nepotism?), or was there just more development opportunities in NZ

That is the sort of dumb arse things NSW would do.

 

[Quick Hands]

There is a fourth possibility. That it was actually the right option at the time. Sometimes, even you would admit, we might get something right?


Just because things have gone in a direction that we would not prefer, does not mean that we made a mistake. It might just mean that circumstances have changed.

Everyone gets something right sometimes.