Aus vs NZ - 1st Test Sydney 17Aug2013

[Scoey]

QC (Quade Cooper) was fine tonight. Fuck he's marked with a tough mark sheet but. Who else would you play? That guy on the Rebs bench that no one else wants? The Tahs 10 who could not hold onto the ball and was completely outplayed by QC (Quade Cooper)? Blood the Brumbies rookie in a Bledisloe? That would actually be the only other real choice.

 

[Ash]

First intercept was a set play that McKibbon read. Happened at the ground right in front of me, McKibbon saw Davies out of the corner of his eye and just moved enough to get in the road. Don't know whether it was unlucky for the Reds or a great read from McKibbon, probably a bit of both.

Would say that Cooper won the battle of the 10s in that game, but not a lot in it. Regarding errors, two intercepts (one can be forgiven off a set play, though) and a kick out on the full vs quite a few dropped balls and a charged down kick.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Who can be the 10 for the Wobs?

JO'C. Not likely. Can't even get a start for his club.
QC (Quade Cooper). Better defence tonight. Couple of mistakes. Some good play to set up opportunities.
Foley. Not good enough tonight. Still playing sevens mindset.
To'omua. Uncharacteristically bad tonight.
SNK. Yeah Right. Can't even get a start for his club.
Beale. Tries more 1% miracles than QC (Quade Cooper). Defence is soft.soon.
Barnes. No.
Lilo. Who plays 12 if Lilo moves in one.

After tonight's games you'd have to believe that QC (Quade Cooper) will be pulling a #10 YellowGold jumper back on very soon.

 

[Pusser]

Not sure QC (Quade Cooper) did enough to get a run on slot for Gold for this game. A few unforced errors which the Lords Of Darkness will be happy to see. His defence was by and large solid. SHould be enough to get in the squad if not the bench.

Don't know if he did enough but all the competition did enough to raise significant doubts about their entitlement for the run on spot.


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[Joe Blow]

QC (Quade Cooper) was over playing his hand a little last night and also in his last few games for Qld. Without Genia and Horwill there he may feel he needs to do more?
If he could get back to underplaying it a little and securing the ball in contact rather than going for the 20-80 pass when under pressure he will go very well for the Wobs.
Slipper had a great all round game tonight but had a bit of a mixed bag at scrum time. Robbo got under him a couple of times. He also had a very good game and surely will be our first choice LH.

Robinson
Moore
Slipper
Horwill
Pyle
Mowen
Hooper
Palu
Genia
Cooper
Honey Badger
Lilo
AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)
Folau
Mogg

TPN
Alexander (LH)
Kepu (TH)
MMM
Gill
White
Horne/Tapuai
Beale


Something like this might work. Is White fit?

 

[Starch]

Pyle looks to have alot of potential for the future. Why blood him against the All Blacks? I'd bring him in after the first two games

 

[I like to watch]

Huh?
The third game is still the AB's yeah?

 

[Starch]

Is it? I could easily be wrong. I thought the third game was south africa. Happy to be corrected

 

[RedsHappy]

...............QC (Quade Cooper) was over playing his hand a little last night and also in his last few games for Qld. Without Genia and Horwill there he may feel he needs to do more?
If he could get back to underplaying it a little and securing the ball in contact rather than going for the 20-80 pass when under pressure he will go very well for the Wobs...............

I've said this in multiple ways and places here throughout this S15 season: Generally, other than WG and QC (Quade Cooper), the Reds 2013 back line and coherence of attack has gone to pot (e.g., see Reds' ranking today for PF and PD in the S15 charts as but one evidentiary data point).

This is not the thread to detail the whys and wheres of the above fact, but the outcome is in part so clearly that the Reds 9 and 10 end up carrying far too much of the whole team's attacking burden and this is (a) increasing the risks that both players have to take and (b) putting far too much tactical 'make the gains' pressure on these two positions and players.

If and once Link redesigns the Wallaby backs and, most importantly, hires a top-grade backs/attack coach (the Wallabies were woefully backs-coached by Deans himself for 6 years aided by repressed juniors only) and this process starts to build a solid Wallaby backs capability and playing style, you will see QC (Quade Cooper) and WG play way better and IMO with less risks and errors. We could plainly see that as the BIL Tests wore on, Genia was becoming more and more fatigued and troubled by having to try and play a '9 plus 50% of 10' role for the Wallabies, it ultimately (and unsurprisingly) detrimented his own play and I suspect mentally really tired him as well.

All of this ultimately comes from years of instability, poor skill development, lack of properly developed attacking set plays, and the resulting wayward execution within the Wallaby backs, being as it is a natural consequence of recklessly volatile selection policy and inadequate and inconsistent technical coaching.

 

[Scoey]

I just watched the Force v Brumbies game replay. I'm surprised that QC (Quade Cooper) is copping criticism for his game yet no one has mentioned To'omua not grounding the ball off that final penalty before throwing is out to the 22. It blew their last chance to win possession and the game. I like To'omua and think he is a good long term prospect at 10 for the Wallabies but had QC (Quade Cooper) made an error like that there would be people howling about it on here. The double standard with which QC (Quade Cooper) is judged compared to all other 10's is hard to handle at times.

 

[I like to watch]

Anyone that named To'omua criticised his game.
I think you will find much of the criticism regarding QC (Quade Cooper) is as much aimed at his supporters comments as it is at him.

 

[Athilnaur]

If To'omua keeps making mistakes like that he will rival Cooper for criticism received soon enough.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

I just watched the Force v Brumbies game replay. I'm surprised that QC (Quade Cooper) is copping criticism for his game yet no one has mentioned To'omua not grounding the ball off that final penalty before throwing is out to the 22. It blew their last chance to win possession and the game. I like To'omua and think he is a good long term prospect at 10 for the Wallabies but had QC (Quade Cooper) made an error like that there would be people howling about it on here. The double standard with which QC (Quade Cooper) is judged compared to all other 10's is hard to handle at times.

Plenty of people were critical of To'omua for his overall game, and particularly that forward pass.

Under 12's type error that could/would cost the Bledisloe cup if repeated against The Darkness.

QC (Quade Cooper) will still need to step up against the Darkness, but he is currently probably the best we have. I can not imagine the meltdown on the threads if he has a shocker on 17 August.

Having Sanchez inside him will probably help things.

 

[Athilnaur]

I can not imagine the meltdown on the threads if he has a shocker on 17 August.

Imagine the meltdown if he accidentally tripped onto Richie's head with his foot.

Maybe someone should warn our embassy in Wellington. We could prep them with lines like 'well he did get most of his education in NZ, you have only yourselves to blame' or 'C'mon Mate, he never saw Richie, we all know Richie is invisible in a breakdown.'

 

[Bessa]

QC (Quade Cooper) was over playing his hand a little last night and also in his last few games for Qld. Without Genia and Horwill there he may feel he needs to do more?
If he could get back to underplaying it a little and securing the ball in contact rather than going for the 20-80 pass when under pressure he will go very well for the Wobs.
Slipper had a great all round game tonight but had a bit of a mixed bag at scrum time. Robbo got under him a couple of times. He also had a very good game and surely will be our first choice LH.

Robinson
Moore
Slipper
Horwill
Pyle
Mowen
Hooper
Palu
Genia
Cooper
Honey Badger
Lilo
AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)
Folau
Mogg

TPN
Alexander (LH)
Palu (TH)
MMM
Gill
White
Horne/Tapuai
Beale


Something like this might work. Is White fit?

Whoa whoa whoa..... back it up.
Palu as starting No8 and tight head reserve? That's just 'Robbie Deans' enough to work.

 

[Joe Blow]

Yep....read Kepu for Palu on the bench.

 

[barbarian]

I like To'omua and think he is a good long term prospect at 10 for the Wallabies but had QC (Quade Cooper) made an error like that there would be people howling about it on here. The double standard with which QC (Quade Cooper) is judged compared to all other 10's is hard to handle at times.

OK I have to say something about this. It is such a tired argument, this supposed 'double standard' regarding Quade.

Because the argument involves two things- willful blindness regarding the criticism of others (they somehow fail to register that To'omua/JOC (James O'Connor)/whoever), and an amplification of the criticism of Quade.

This week is a prime example. Quade played a pretty average game. A few nice touches, a few bad errors, but generally the Reds didn't click and QC (Quade Cooper) should take a bit of responsibility for that. It honestly reminded me of JOC (James O'Connor)'s performance for the Wallabies.

There was some criticism, but none of it 'howling'. All seemed pretty reasonable to me. In fact on my match report there were far more people commenting positively on QC (Quade Cooper) than negatively.

To'omua was pretty ordinary in his game too. Not as many people watched it, but there was still criticism- even Slim put the boot into him! The comms were howling when he made his mistake, it's not like they pretend it didn't happen.

But under this farcical 'double standard' notion two things happen. The criticism of Quade (who WAS average) becomes unreasonable 'howling', rabid raving of people who take joy in seeing Quade fail. And they fail to acknowledge any of the criticism leveled at other 10s, such to the point they think that all of To'omua/JOC (James O'Connor)/Foley's mistakes were ignored by the anti-QC (Quade Cooper) public.

So ANY time JOC (James O'Connor)/To'omua/Foley make a mistake, the line comes- 'well if QC (Quade Cooper) did that people would be SCREAMING'. It's just patently false. Sure there are very small minority of idiots who would be screaming, but like anything in life the reasonable majority are far more....... reasonable.

Deans isn't coaching any more. Quade is playing OK. Despite what you think the majority (dare I say VAST majority) of Aussie rugby fans like Quade. So drop the 'they are all out to get us' rubbish, please.
.

 

[A mutterer]

Quade is playing OK.

I think this is a pretty fair assessment. He and the other two amigos have at best played ok for long parts of the season.

I'm sure he will get a crack but I think the up and comers have probably presented a better overall season.

 

[Braveheart81]

I think a big part of the level of criticism is where the player currently sits in terms of potential Wallabies selection.

I absolutely am going to gloss over Bernard Foley's mistakes and shortfalls in his game as a 10 because I'm not about to select him as the Wallabies 10. I don't think he's ready yet.

As To'omua gets closer to a Wallabies berth then I will be more critical of his play. I think it's only fair. We're starting to see that much more as he's becoming a likely test player.

Quade Cooper gets critiqued very closely because the debate over whether he should be the Wallabies 10 is very robust. People are always going to pick apart his game closely whilst he's a Wallaby or close to.

I think the criticism and analysis JOC (James O'Connor) was subjected to during the Lions series was on par with anything directed at Cooper in the past.

 

[Scoey]

Deans isn't coaching any more. Quade is playing OK. Despite what you think the majority (dare I say VAST majority) of Aussie rugby fans like Quade. So drop the 'they are all out to get us' rubbish, please.

There is no 'they are all out to get us rubbish'. I do not think anyone is out to get us, whoever 'us' is. I never claimed anything of the sort. I am aware that the majority of AUS rugby fans like Quade, or are at least starting to warm to him.

But this has nothing to do with what I posted about at all. My post, was very simply about a double standard that applies to QC (Quade Cooper) and the rest of the AUS 10's my claim of its existence is not patently false.

Give me one mention in this thread other than mine of To'omua's brain explosion. You cant because there isn't any.
While you're searching for one though, count the mentions of QC (Quade Cooper)'s intercept.
Then have a think about the two errors.
One cost a try and is a risk vs reward thing. Had it not been intercepted, rocket may well have scored for QLD.
The other cost the Brumbies the chance to win the game and is inexcusable as it simply should not happen. Period.
Plenty of players are intercepted each week. By far you will only read about Quade's. Plenty of charge downs occur each week, but for some reason Quade's are more worthy of discussion. This is what is known as a double standard.