Australian Schoolboys & National Championships 2017

[Shane Smeltz]

He actually is only 16 this year. Played Harold matts for manly and that competition is limited to players who do not turn 17. He also made the under 16s NSW origin team.

Yep. Like I said.
Also plays U16 Vikings for Manly Marlins. Think the Manly Marlins know what a birth certificate looks like.
Also know boys at his school too in his age group (2001 born).

However, my understand is that he signed to Manly (RL).
But why not let him do both for now, after all he is just a kid.
And a highly talented one too

 

[Backline_Move]

Who the heck is the fullback from combined states? That kid is going somewhere

Pavlakis should have been NSW 1 fullback with Woodcock at 10 in NSW 2.

When trying to pick the NZ schools- think who could actually beat them?

I like the teams listed above, but think Frost will be in AUS not the A team.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

What job? You've got your wires crossed there.

Mohi and Jordan chose rugby because they enjoy it and believe they have a future in the game. The promise of rep honours etc .. Mohi has already played U20s NSW.

The ambition of playing for NSW U20s and Australian U20s is motivation enough for some players. And maybe being picked up by a Super rugby team.
Short term goals aren't what motivates some players.

Some players get educational opportunities and take it while playing a game they enjoy with their mates. And hope future rep honours eventuate.

And of course there's always the line of thought that if a player establishes himself in rugby or shows promise, he will be offered good cash further down the track to play RL. That can be a long term consideration.

That's what he told a member of my family.
Educational opportunities do not float all boats.
Personally, I can never understand kids introduced to rugby who choose league, but the lure of money is a factor.
Playing u20s does not pay the bills: this is why we cannot compete with kids offered league or afl contracts.
It's all very well for you to assume that money isn't a factor but the demographics don't support that view: only 36% of 18 to 20 year olds are at uni. Presumably the rest are working or looking for work or living on family money.

 

[The Honey Badger]

Pavlakis should have been NSW 1 fullback with Woodcock at 10 in NSW 2.

When trying to pick the NZ schools- think who could actually beat them?

I like the teams listed above, but think Frost will be in AUS not the A team.

Relax, 4 Locks will be picked

 

[sidelineview]

That's what he told a member of my family.
Educational opportunities do not float all boats.
Personally, I can never understand kids introduced to rugby who choose league, but the lure of money is a factor.
Playing u20s does not pay the bills: this is why we cannot compete with kids offered league or afl contracts.
It's all very well for you to assume that money isn't a factor but the demographics don't support that view: only 36% of 18 to 20 year olds are at uni. Presumably the rest are working or looking for work or living on family money.

You're a bit cynical mate. You're not only barking up the wrong tree, you're peddling gossip. I used those two people as examples of players who chose rugby over RL. It wasn't because they were offered a new TV and a trip to Tasmania.

Educational opportunities dont do it for all, but it does for some.

A lot of kids in the Eastern and Southern suburbs play RL as well as rugby and then choose which one to continue with after school. It's not always about money but it is for some. Some love RL and some love playing rugby. I think the unique nature of 1st XV schoolboy rugby can sway some players to stick with rugby and not 'return'to league. A bit of success with schoolboy Rep footy helps as well.

Not all RL players get offered contracts. They aspire to play U20s and Grade and set their sights on that with the hope of obvious rewards if their hard work pays off.

The same as rugby Colts do.
Do you think any young rugby player would turn his nose up at playing for NSW U20s because it doesn't pay the bills and then would wish he went to RL instead? That would surely earn a young bloke some serious cred and might impress a few girls as well.

Some figure they have a better chance of success in either one code or the other.

A lot of players from the Nationals will go onto play Colts and get into something like the Gen Blue system and they'll enjoy it with their mates. If they're living at home, have a full time or casual job to earn some money, not paying board or cooking for themselves or washing their own clothes then that is a dream. Enjoy it while it lasts.

Rugby needs to be proactive in recruiting with anything they've got.

 

[Rich_E]

It's a bit annoying that CS players arent listed with numbers in the program.

One of the CS coaches kindly provided me with the CS number/name combinations from yesterday's match. Here it is...

14 Charlie Baker, Scot’s College

DNP Stewart Brown, Central Coast Grammar, 11 Stirling Doyle, Daramalan College played instead

19 Harrison Cannon, St Joseph’s College, Nudgee

21 Cooper Chambers, Trinity Grammar School

10 Isaac Crone, Brisbane State High School

3 Brady Dawson, Knox Grammar School

20 Joel Ellis, Waverley College

1 Dougal Hicks, The King’s School

2 Ben Joseph, The Scot’s College

4 Emmit Keepa, Ipswich Grammar School

23 Jeremy Kempston, Ipswich Grammar School

9 William Kirk, St Joseph’s College, Gregory Terrace

8 Willie Manu, St Augustine’s College

18 Will McCormick, Waverley College

15 Michael Pavlakis, Knox Grammar School

13 Tristan Reilly, St Joseph’s College, Hunters Hill

DNP James Sidery, St Augustine’s College, 12 Ben Duckworth, The King's School played instead

6 Davida Stowers, Ipswich Grammar School

5 Bruce Tevaga, Padua College

17 Emosi Tuqirie, Marist College, Ashgrove

7 Harry Turner, Epping Boys High School

22 Jack Walsh, St Augustine’s College

16 Jack Winchester, Bishop Druitt college

.

 

[Running_rugby_1954]

Campbell Parata will likely be in the schoolboys starting team for his kicking game alone. But agree the NSW 10 has to be there as well. Likely he could slot in at 15. Watching the games from yesterday. The NSW 1, 6 and 10 were very good. The 15 was weak and let them down with his kicking game- they should have someone else kick. The 2 also had a very poor throw, considering he is the starting hooker, that should have been the first thing he was selected for.! Surely!!!

QLD were very good though with 3, 4, 5, 10, 12, 13 and 14 standouts in a losing team. I think the whole backrow was a bit disappointing from what they have done this year.! I have seen them play a bit of rugby in GPS trials and they are better than they showed yesterday!!!

QLD 2 were very disappointing in general. None of them deserve selection after that rabble they showed.

NSW 2 had some quality players as well- I think the 1, 6, 9 and 12 were potential schoolboys/Aus A's players.

ACT 2 is a fantastic rugby player, could he captain the team? Does he captain his school team?

WA will find it hard to get many in and VIc looked out of their depth!

CS was ok, but I think we're up against a poorly prepared team and therefore we're a bit lucky with the win.

Sorry about the lack of names, I did not purchase a program.

Is anyone heading to the school tomorrow? I have been a long time rugby supporter, but having just retired I have more time to get out and watch the games. I played in the schoolboys team many years ago.

 

[Rich_E]

The injured player was from the Combined States team I heard this yesterday from a reliable source, however I did not catch the name of the player or the replacement. The injured player came back for the team photo taken before the game. I'll try to find out the names for you and come back to you shortly


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

From the original CS team list...,

Stewart Brown (Central Coast Grammar) was replaced yesterday by 11 Stirling Doyle (Daramalan College) and...,

James Sidery (St Augustine’s College) was replaced yesterday by 12 Ben Duckworth (The King's School).

I have no idea whether these are replacements for rest of tournament.

.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

You're a bit cynical mate. You're not only barking up the wrong tree, you're peddling gossip. I used those two people as examples of players who chose rugby over RL. It wasn't because they were offered a new TV and a trip to Tasmania.

Educational opportunities dont do it for all, but it does for some.

A lot of kids in the Eastern and Southern suburbs play RL as well as rugby and then choose which one to continue with after school. It's not always about money but it is for some. Some love RL and some love playing rugby. I think the unique nature of 1st XV schoolboy rugby can sway some players to stick with rugby and not 'return'to league. A bit of success with schoolboy Rep footy helps as well.

Not all RL players get offered contracts. They aspire to play U20s and Grade and set their sights on that with the hope of obvious rewards if their hard work pays off.

The same as rugby Colts do.
Do you think any young rugby player would turn his nose up at playing for NSW U20s because it doesn't pay the bills and then would wish he went to RL instead? That would surely earn a young bloke some serious cred and might impress a few girls as well.

Some figure they have a better chance of success in either one code or the other.

A lot of players from the Nationals will go onto play Colts and get into something like the Gen Blue system and they'll enjoy it with their mates. If they're living at home, have a full time or casual job to earn some money, not paying board or cooking for themselves or washing their own clothes then that is a dream. Enjoy it while it lasts.

Rugby needs to be proactive in recruiting with anything they've got.

Buddy - you completely miss the point: you can only pal around in gen blue (if you get picked and get to play and they don't change the structure midway through) if you have some other means of support. Its 4 games after 6 months of training specifically for it.
You train 5 or 6 days a week. You have to get to Moore park in the case of gen blue. if you're at uni someone needs to foot the bill. if you're working the cost of playing comes out of your pocket - and then you pay the rego to your club and the aru.
This is a significant barrier for some 18-20 year olds.
and after all that the frigging clubs do the heavy lifting of getting guys into courses etc. etc.
We agree that recruiting is vital but its not to be forgotten that the 2 blokes you mention came out of the private school system - what about all the talent in the public schools we never see?

 

[Running_rugby_1954]

Just some history:

I believe this is Brother Bob Wallace's last year at Australian schools rugby. The man has single handedly done so much to support schoolboy rugby For many generations. If you see him, ensure you have a chat and learn some history about the years that have gone before.

 

[WLF]

You're a bit cynical mate. You're not only barking up the wrong tree, you're peddling gossip. I used those two people as examples of players who chose rugby over RL. It wasn't because they were offered a new TV and a trip to Tasmania.

Educational opportunities dont do it for all, but it does for some.

A lot of kids in the Eastern and Southern suburbs play RL as well as rugby and then choose which one to continue with after school. It's not always about money but it is for some. Some love RL and some love playing rugby. I think the unique nature of 1st XV schoolboy rugby can sway some players to stick with rugby and not 'return'to league. A bit of success with schoolboy Rep footy helps as well.

Not all RL players get offered contracts. They aspire to play U20s and Grade and set their sights on that with the hope of obvious rewards if their hard work pays off.

The same as rugby Colts do.
Do you think any young rugby player would turn his nose up at playing for NSW U20s because it doesn't pay the bills and then would wish he went to RL instead? That would surely earn a young bloke some serious cred and might impress a few girls as well.

Some figure they have a better chance of success in either one code or the other.

A lot of players from the Nationals will go onto play Colts and get into something like the Gen Blue system and they'll enjoy it with their mates. If they're living at home, have a full time or casual job to earn some money, not paying board or cooking for themselves or washing their own clothes then that is a dream. Enjoy it while it lasts.

Rugby needs to be proactive in recruiting with anything they've got.

Sideline and IS,

Here is my point of view on your discussion re RL v RU.

I actually really like both and I think the skill level in RL is far better.
If there was a hybrid game of the Wallabies v the Kangaroos, the Kangaroos would win by 50+, and I have come through the RU system, probably as you well know.

There are transferable skills between both, and I think some/most boys who have played both are better RU players.

Addressing your discussing, I believe that a boy in a private RU school, with all the coach/parent/peer/younger school boy support would rather stick with RU than RL, for ALL the powerful/life long team feelings that will always be with you.

A bit like going to Uni, when at school you are known and are someone, whereas at Uni you are no.123.

The issue, I believe, is that Union, beit the ARU or whoever, DOES NOT, capitalise on the strong position they hold with these boys at school boy level, not through their own endeavours, but through the school level.

Probably money reasons BUT that is unions fault/their job, its called business, they have the front running, but can't convert.

IMO, and I mean well, as I have 2 boys currently immersed in OUR game.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

I actually really like both and I think the skill level in RL is far better.

I never played league.

My theory is that currently in league everyone needs a few core skills, and to be tough.
But most of the higher skilled work is only ever done by the "spine" as the leagueies call it.
Only the 9, 7 or 1 are allowed to throw long passes or kick.
Everyone else must die with the ball unless they are a designated offloader.
The proof of this was the way NSW dominated without Gallen fouling up the works in the 1st SOO.

 

[Rich_E]

Update on GAGR match reviews.

I have writers locked in for all games tomorrow and Thursday.

I am still looking for volunteers to write match reviews for the finals on Saturday.

I am also looking for someone to send me photos for publishing for all of the remaining games (ie Wed, Thurs and Sat).

Photos need to be landscape 3:2 aspect ratio with max file size 200kb.

Anyone that could help with writing or pics, please send me a private convo message.

Rich

.

 

[WLF]

I never played league.

My theory is that currently in league everyone needs a few core skills, and to be tough.
But most of the higher skilled work is only ever done by the "spine" as the leagueies call it.
Only the 9, 7 or 1 are allowed to throw long passes or kick.
Everyone else must die with the ball unless they are a designated offloader.
The proof of this was the way NSW dominated without Gallen fouling up the works in the 1st SOO.

You know what IS, i think you have outlined a good point, maybe it's a bit different than you meant but, Yes, in league the spine is critical, same can be said for the forwards in union. There are key positions in every game.

My point was the attracted talent in league is so far ahead of union, imo, it's a joke. for example look at the Wallaby back line v the Kangaroos back line, no comparison.

So in Australia we have unbelievable talent, and if all combined, ie Union/League/AFL, we would flog the All blacks and anyone else.
But when it comes to league v union, league is way ahead.

I can't help but see how good Angus Criten is going!

 

[Hoffman Try]

A few names that should be in the mix 2017

1 Edwards
2 Lonergan
3 Breen
4 Wilson
5 Frost
6 Cornish
7 Rourke
8

9 Vuta/Bell
10 Donaldson
11 Hopoate
12 Hardacre
13 Riley
14 Petalia
15


The CAS people rate Coghill who has played prop for 3 years would be in the mix for a front row spot

A few blanks if anyone cares to put forward some names,

 

[Hoffman Try]

Pavlakis should have been NSW 1 fullback with Woodcock at 10 in NSW 2.

When trying to pick the NZ schools- think who could actually beat them?

I like the teams listed above, but think Frost will be in AUS not the A team.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

You know what IS, i think you have outlined a good point, maybe it's a bit different than you meant but, Yes, in league the spine is critical, same can be said for the forwards in union. There are key positions in every game.

My point was the attracted talent in league is so far ahead of union, imo, it's a joke. for example look at the Wallaby back line v the Kangaroos back line, no comparison.

So in Australia we have unbelievable talent, and if all combined, ie Union/League/AFL, we would flog the All blacks and anyone else.
But when it comes to league v union, league is way ahead.

I can't help but see how good Angus Criten is going!

Crichton is a great example.
I posted here that he'd made the wrong choice.
with his talent I'd have taken my chances in union for a while at least - maybe had to jump or he would miss the development they put into him.
Anyway he's looking like he made the right choice for him- so in that regard I was wrong.

 

[Hoffman Try]

Campbell Parata will likely be in the schoolboys starting team for his kicking game alone. But agree the NSW 10 has to be there as well. Likely he could slot in at 15. Watching the games from yesterday. The NSW 1, 6 and 10 were very good. The 15 was weak and let them down with his kicking game- they should have someone else kick. The 2 also had a very poor throw, considering he is the starting hooker, that should have been the first thing he was selected for.! Surely!!!

QLD were very good though with 3, 4, 5, 10, 12, 13 and 14 standouts in a losing team. I think the whole backrow was a bit disappointing from what they have done this year.! I have seen them play a bit of rugby in GPS trials and they are better than they showed yesterday!!!

QLD 2 were very disappointing in general. None of them deserve selection after that rabble they showed.

NSW 2 had some quality players as well- I think the 1, 6, 9 and 12 were potential schoolboys/Aus A's players.

ACT 2 is a fantastic rugby player, could he captain the team? Does he captain his school team?

WA will find it hard to get many in and VIc looked out of their depth!

CS was ok, but I think we're up against a poorly prepared team and therefore we're a bit lucky with the win.

Sorry about the lack of names, I did not purchase a program.

Is anyone heading to the school tomorrow? I have been a long time rugby supporter, but having just retired I have more time to get out and watch the games. I played in the schoolboys team many years ago.

 

[sidelineview]

Buddy - you completely miss the point: you can only pal around in gen blue (if you get picked and get to play and they don't change the structure midway through) if you have some other means of support. Its 4 games after 6 months of training specifically for it.
You train 5 or 6 days a week. You have to get to Moore park in the case of gen blue. if you're at uni someone needs to foot the bill. if you're working the cost of playing comes out of your pocket - and then you pay the rego to your club and the aru.
This is a significant barrier for some 18-20 year olds.
and after all that the frigging clubs do the heavy lifting of getting guys into courses etc. etc.
We agree that recruiting is vital but its not to be forgotten that the 2 blokes you mention came out of the private school system - what about all the talent in the public schools we never see?

Yeah, what about it? and why site two private school kids as good examples of school leavers who chose rugby over league when all the talent in the public schools has disappeared? It's no point mentioning a positive and recognise the contribution private schools make to Australian rugby when there are so many negatives to focus on.

Gen Blue should be canned for sure, because it just aint worth it what with all the bother it causes. And if a player does get picked to play, they'll probably change the structure mid stream to spoil it and he'll probably get injured anyway, and where will that leave him? He should have stayed in bed and he couldn't afford it in the first place.
Only a few will get selected but many will try but only those who try will be selected, but its no point even dreaming about it because its a friggin waste of time.

 

[sidelineview]

I never played league.

My theory is that currently in league everyone needs a few core skills, and to be tough.
But most of the higher skilled work is only ever done by the "spine" as the leagueies call it.
Only the 9, 7 or 1 are allowed to throw long passes or kick.
Everyone else must die with the ball unless they are a designated offloader.
The proof of this was the way NSW dominated without Gallen fouling up the works in the 1st SOO.

You'll find that all league players are usually very skillful if they've been coached properly.
Forwards and backs work on skill drills and in particular passing and catching drills.

League forwards who switch to rugby usually have very good ball skills and can offload in traffic.

Crichton played league in his youth and switched to rugby when he went to Scots.

Quite a few of the Waverly boys do the same. As mentioned, some continue with rugby after leaving school and some stick with league.