• Welcome to the Green and Gold Rugby forums. As you can see we've upgraded the forums to new software. Your old logon details should work, just click the 'Login' button in the top right.

Australian Schoolboys / Under 18s 2019

rod skellet

Bob Davidson (42)
Yes they did



I understand it was self inflicted, but what is it that is wrong with the current system that needed improvement. How is tribalism and pride in your jersey and playing in the top team in your state now accomplished. I am ex Churchie in Brisbane and Barker in Sydney, both strong rugby schools and I cannot understand why the best of these two rugby nurseys will no longer get a chance to play each other. Parrashooting a kid into a state side without being tested leaves the system open to favouriteism by the coach. Playing over a week against the best of each state at least gives you the chance to prove yourself against the best. It is also a transparent process. The selection of example a Carlo Tizzano can still happen if you are not at school but if a kid from Moorabbin school who has not played at State level gets selected over a standout player a from the schools carnival that the school of public opinion agrees is the standout then how is it justified???
 

Hound

Bill Watson (15)
I can understand the idea of broadening the horizons for selections and agree that it is a good idea. Poorly implemented for this years cohort. During the GPS trial games thus far I have already seen a number of academy boys (so far) outplayed by opposing and own team members. Lets hope the is some common ground before next year. There can be big changes with boys from 15 to 18.
 

The Nomad

Bob Davidson (42)
^ All the Academy teams still play one another. Sept 22 at Ballymore is the final round of Academy games with the main game being Tahs U18's v Reds U18's , the Australian U18's ( & Schoolboys) get named by the following day and go straight into camp before touring NZ the first week in October.

Reality is the system changed because RA wanted control of it, they had little input into Schoolboys other than some funding.

You can try and justify the pros of each pathway to explain why that is the way to go , but at the end of the day it comes down to control. RA didn't control Aussie Schoolboys, now I guess they do.

The only issue up here has really been about the failure to integrate the two pathways like seems to have happened in other states.
 

The Nomad

Bob Davidson (42)
The Academy teams are said to be fluid, hopefully Hound , if boys are getting out performed , they will get replaced. Whether that happens remains to be seen.
 

Garry Owens

Alan Cameron (40)
I can understand the idea of broadening the horizons for selections and agree that it is a good idea. Poorly implemented for this years cohort. During the GPS trial games thus far I have already seen a number of academy boys (so far) outplayed by opposing and own team members. Lets hope the is some common ground before next year. There can be big changes with boys from 15 to 18.

I am not sure how the State Championship format through QSS excluded opportunity to participate and be identified if you were a kid from Peninsula or Central Queensland or wherever.

The existing format already provided for the casting of a net over the entirety of QLD School Sport.

It was more about the conscious desire and will to lessen the volume of participation ,and talent, to lower a standard of competition - for the sole purpose of providing better chances to shine for the marginals.

When it came down to it, the overwhelming majority of the boys that got selected were from Terrace or AIC schools with a liberal dose of Sunshine Coast thrown in ( given they made the final ) and who had already had been heavily combed through after they had made the semis of the U15 tournament 2 years prior up in Townsville.

So clearly it was rooted 10 ways to Sunday and didn't really meet the aim of what was desired by the Reds and for why.

And here is the thing ........3 years prior in U15 JGC , Hamiso Tabuai-Fidow , played on a team of modestly talented teammates from FNQ , where , they largely got beat every game . But the inclusiveness of the Carnival and trying to get the best guys trying out to play only made it clearer that he wasn't being protected in some cupcake event - that he was the real deal and a priority target for Rugby. They missed. But that is not the point.

If you are a genuine talent from a marginal region - you should get noticed - you shouldn't need the competition to be taken down a few notches for this to happen.

It seems as though everyone is so willing to be Jedi Mind Warriored into submission on this one.
 

DaSchmooze

Bob Loudon (25)
The only issue up here has really been about the failure to integrate the two pathways like seems to have happened in other states.


Tend to agree with this. If QLD had done a better job of integrating the new system with the old one, I dont think we'd be getting the push back from some pundits on this thread that we are. If the Qld GPS had sent their boys to the school trials there wouldn't be an issue.

Perhaps they'll sort that out next year.
 

rod skellet

Bob Davidson (42)
Why are the qld and nsw school rugby calendars not aligned??

NSW CAS/GPS/ISA schools all started playing trials, very competitive trials at the end of March. Sure it overlapped with the end of the rowing and cricket seasons but that's when the squads came together and started playing other schools. Our comp which is just 5 games long for both CAS & GPS started 2 weeks ago after 8 weeks of solid trials.

By way of example, Barker played St Edmunds, St Stannies, Oakhill, Riverview, St Joesephs, Kings, Shore, Newington (and a 2 game tour of Qld schools in holidays) before it played its first CAS comp game against Cranbrook 2 weeks ago.
The selectors have been going to all of these games.

The selectors have seen all the lads playing against their main competitors for positions in the NSW squads so every kid has had a chance over time to impress the selectors.

What is going on in Qld since end of March??
We are all hopefully aligned in trying to get the best outcome for Australian rugby, and the schools system is critical to making the national team strong. Surely the Qld Rugby union can co ordinate things to provide a better outcome for Qld schools and co ordinate the respective calendars to align so the best of the best come together having all been given the opportunity to impress.

As it stands the National schools tournament in a weeks time is going to be a white wash with no doubt NSW 1 & 2 playing each other in the final.

Not turning up to this tournament that has history (given Gregory Terrace lads are) leaves open the possibility of a lack of transparency on selections which will only serve to fracture the game.

If the ARU want to control things then they must sit down with all the school associations and work out a process to ensure the opportunity to be selected and the transparency of that selection is clear. This years lads have been ripped off.
 

DaSchmooze

Bob Loudon (25)
If the ARU want to control things then they must sit down with all the school associations and work out a process to ensure the opportunity to be selected and the transparency of that selection is clear. This years lads have been ripped off.


You're assuming that the schools would be receptive to such a meeting. It would need to work on the assumption that the schools have the best interests of the game at heart...
 

rod skellet

Bob Davidson (42)

If the Rebels U18 academy side is playing Qld U18 academy side, how many of those players are turning up to Riverview in the next week to play in the National Schools Champs??
 

Armchair Selector

Johnnie Wallace (23)
If the Rebels U18 academy side is playing Qld U18 academy side, how many of those players are turning up to Riverview in the next week to play in the National Schools Champs??


with the hope to be selected into an Academy that they are already part of????? I think you answered your own question.

Note Australian Schools and U18s teams will only be selected from those who are in an academy program.

IMHO those attending the Australian Schools Carnival will have done so because they either see it as a last roll of the dice to enter an academy or they want to represent their school via schools program at the highest possible level.

Evidence would be the number of boys who withdrew from NSWJRU pathway after being selected for either Sydney or Country or incredibly even when already selected for NSWJRU U18s which included Gen Blue Academy selection for those in the Firsts!

Either they werent that interested in Gen Blue, didnt listen to the presentations on the pathway or were very poorly advised by parents, peers or their schools.

On today's performance, I cant imagine many of the boys representing CHSI who got thumped by GPS1 80 nil at NSW Schools Championship will be offered a Gen Blue opportunity via that pathway......
 

tragickingdom

Herbert Moran (7)
It was great watching the NSW trials today

CAS 2 55 ISA 2 10
CCC 31 AICES 10
CAS 1 24 ISA 1 14
GPS 2 53 CHS 2 0
GPS 1 80 CHS 1 0

some amazing skills shown by many especially the GPS 1 team backline. Best game was ISA 1 vs CAS 1 - closely followed by AICES vs CCC. These two matches in my opinion were the only ones that showed somewhat evenly matched teams(CCC were better than AICES).

Maybe it's time to gather the non regular playing schools (CHS, CCC and AICES) and form a couple of merged teams out of these three to play the regular rugby powerhouses.

possible schools carnival

CHS/CCC/AICES 2 vs GPS 2
ISA 2 vs CAS 2
ISA 1 vs CAS 1
CHS/CCC/AICES 1 vs GPS 1

three squads could certainly combine to make one stronger team.
 

spud

Peter Burge (5)
Although I’m not sure why only 14 x 18 year olds ( out of a match day 23 ) have been chosen in the Reds U18 Team to play the Rebels U18 team on Sunday - with 2 x 16 year olds lacing up the boots

Wasn’t a large part of the initial reasoning based around narrowing the age discrepancy that Australian lads faces when squaring off against NZ Schools and Northern Hemisphere Academy Teams ?

In this team you’ll only find 8 or 9 out of the 50 that were selected for QLD U16 2 years ago

That’s some great pathway management right there


Do you have a team list?
 

RugbyReg

Rocky Elsom (76)
Staff member
Queensland U18s Academy side to face Rebels U18s in Victoria:

1. Harry Vella – St.Joseph’s Nudgee College
2. Jake Tierney – Brisbane Boys College
3. Zane Nonggorr – The Southport School
4. George Gibson – Brisbane Boys College
5. Wilson Blyth – The Southport School
6. Matthew Englebrecht – University of Queensland Rugby Club
7. Will Roach – University of Queensland Rugby Club (VC)
8. Titi Nofoagatotoa – St.Joseph’s Nudgee College
9. Kalani Thomas – Ipswich Grammar School
10. Jake Pappin – Brothers Rugby Club
11. Glen Vaihu – St. Joseph’s Gregory Tce
12. Christian Krause – Ipswich Grammar School
13. Josh Flook – Brothers Rugby Club (C)
14. Jojo Fifita – The Southport School
15. Dion Samuela – The Southport School

Reserves
16. Zack Crothers – Easts Rugby Club
17. John Downes – GPS Rugby Club
18. Tim Faingaanuku – Toowoomba Grammar School
19. Charlie Hayes – St.Joseph’s Nudgee College
20. Keenan Timu – Marsden State High School
21. Finn Hearn – St.Joseph’s Nudgee College
22. Kaleb Ngamanu – The Southport School
23. Mac Grealy – Downlands College

Staff
Head Coach – Ryan Schultz – Brothers Rugby Club
Assistant Coach – Dale Roberson – Anglican Church Grammar School
Assistant Coach – Tyrell Barker – QRU
Manager – Lincoln Clapham – QRU
Talent Manager – Paul Carozza – QRU
Strength & Conditioning Coach: Jamie Youngson – QRU
Physio: Caitlin Bailey – QRU/Souths
 

Jets

Paul McLean (56)
Staff member
Yes they did

I find your phrasing interesting though.

I think they were hoodwinked by the QRU. They should have done what all the other states did and let the players participate in both paths. It would have affected four of the teams at the State Champs at Sunnybank, plus pushed the other players to a higher level.

What's the saying? "Iron sharpens iron"
 
Top