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CAS Rugby 2023

WLF3

Darby Loudon (17)
I have mixed thoughts, I would love for barker to have 5 teams in each age group all of which are competitive but at the end of the day you can’t force kids to play a sport they don’t want to it’s good for no one. I have seen some very talented players in a lot of the As side, especially the 14s look to be quite strong. I agree with a lot of your points, I don’t think scholarships are a long term solution and so the future of the program with the amount of teams is slightly worrying. However, I’ve seen great signs in a new development in the coaching programs, 16As now have a preseason and it’s not just the top players who do 1s and 2s preseason that are benefiting. A number of 15s boys are in the 16s side. There’s no instant solution so this will all take time, 9 of the 15 boys who are playing 1sts started in yr 7, and I see massive improvement from year to year in a number of these boys so despite there clearly being some areas of concerns I still remain optimistic
Nice reply, I empathize with you and all the Barker Rugby supporters.

I hope the focus, as you mentioned, on the younger teams does eventuate and it will be interesting to see how the age groups fare tomorrow.

As you would appreciate, like a business, all things start at the top, in this instance I assume it's the Sports Master and Principle.
If they can't see this trend, or have no interest, then it will only go 1 way, unless there is a change of personnel.
I am not suggesting this is the "be all and end all" if it doesn't improve, there are more important things at school, BUT each CAS school, likewise GPS, ISA etc, has a duty IMO to ensure it is capable of at least adequately participating in all the major inter school activities.

Shore has been a great example recently, it faced a similar Rugby situation (but probably not as dire as Barker), and did something substantial about it.

Best of luck tomorrow, but not too much! ;)
 

Flavio

Ward Prentice (10)
Nice photo H,

Just had a look at our joint rugby games for this weekend and sadly noticed that other than the 1sts, which are clearly the pin up boys, Barker only have 12 other Rugby teams, so many of the Waves teams either have a bye or will need to play another another school, if possible.

EXTREMELY sad given this is our CAS comp! I just REALLY hope your 2nds/3rds/4ths can compete, along with each A team in each age group, otherwise, if I were a Barker old boy, I would be furious and asking, other than the 1s does anyone care, and how long can the school be serious in competing in the CAS Rugby comp!

Whilst Aloys constantly cop this focus, for well known reasons, I believe Aloys may have beaten the Barker 3rds and the Barker 2nds weren't convincing at all v Aloys.

What are your thoughts about this situation and the future of Barker Rugby?
As a Barker parent it always concerned the lower rugby programs were not well supported, my boys ended up playing Volleyball with one now in the NSW U21 team, interestingly my daughter played Sevens and still plays for the Armidale Blues.

The difference today is schools are marketing machines an have to been seen to offer a wide range of sports. When I was at school (Alo's) we had Cricket, Basketball and Tennis in summer and Rugby and Football in winter. The list below is the current sports offerings at Barker and naturally it as well as a change in the demographic of the students dilutes the number of kids playing Rugby. Note Joeys has 6 winter sports

Girls' Sport Offered​

Boys' Sport Offered​

AFLAFL
Athletics and Cross CountryBasketball
Basketball Cricket
CricketCross Country
DanceDance
Equestrian Equestrian
FencingFencing
Football Football
GolfGolf
HockeyMountain Biking
Mountain BikingNetball Umpiring
Netball Rowing
Netball UmpiringRugby
RowingSnowsports
Rugby 7sSquash
SnowsportsStrength & Conditioning
SoftballSurf Life Saving
Squash Swimming & Diving
Surf Life SavingTaekwondo
Swimming & DivingTennis
TaekwondoVolleyball
TennisWater Polo
Touch Football
Volleyball
Water Polo
 

Ziggy

Allen Oxlade (6)
Small side note here but seeing that does make the whole "there should be schools of like for like in terms of numbers playing each other in their respective comps" a bit of a dead argument. Even whilst in season, sportsmasters have to schedule games against inter association teams and seem to have no difficulty in doing so.

Another interesting thing to see here is that having a strong 1st XV doesnt appear to be driving participation at Barker.
100% agree. If rugby starts to dwindle and they continue to only field 2 teams per age group, the question that needs to be asked is whether or not there will be a proper rugby program in 5-10 years time.
 

Ziggy

Allen Oxlade (6)
As a Barker parent it always concerned the lower rugby programs were not well supported, my boys ended up playing Volleyball with one now in the NSW U21 team, interestingly my daughter played Sevens and still plays for the Armidale Blues.

The difference today is schools are marketing machines an have to been seen to offer a wide range of sports. When I was at school (Alo's) we had Cricket, Basketball and Tennis in summer and Rugby and Football in winter. The list below is the current sports offerings at Barker and naturally it as well as a change in the demographic of the students dilutes the number of kids playing Rugby. Note Joeys has 6 winter sports

Girls' Sport Offered​

Boys' Sport Offered​

AFLAFL
Athletics and Cross CountryBasketball
BasketballCricket
CricketCross Country
DanceDance
EquestrianEquestrian
FencingFencing
FootballFootball
GolfGolf
HockeyMountain Biking
Mountain BikingNetball Umpiring
NetballRowing
Netball UmpiringRugby
RowingSnowsports
Rugby 7sSquash
SnowsportsStrength & Conditioning
SoftballSurf Life Saving
SquashSwimming & Diving
Surf Life SavingTaekwondo
Swimming & DivingTennis
TaekwondoVolleyball
TennisWater Polo
Touch Football
Volleyball
Water Polo
Interesting - is it now starting to cater to its demographic?
Are the boys that Barker are attracting not Rugby players?
It will be interesting to see how close the Rugby games are over the weekend.
 

lincoln

Bob Loudon (25)
Capture.JPG
 

Backintheolddays

Fred Wood (13)
As a Barker parent it always concerned the lower rugby programs were not well supported, my boys ended up playing Volleyball with one now in the NSW U21 team, interestingly my daughter played Sevens and still plays for the Armidale Blues.

The difference today is schools are marketing machines an have to been seen to offer a wide range of sports. When I was at school (Alo's) we had Cricket, Basketball and Tennis in summer and Rugby and Football in winter. The list below is the current sports offerings at Barker and naturally it as well as a change in the demographic of the students dilutes the number of kids playing Rugby. Note Joeys has 6 winter sports

Girls' Sport Offered​

Boys' Sport Offered​

AFLAFL
Athletics and Cross CountryBasketball
BasketballCricket
CricketCross Country
DanceDance
EquestrianEquestrian
FencingFencing
FootballFootball
GolfGolf
HockeyMountain Biking
Mountain BikingNetball Umpiring
NetballRowing
Netball UmpiringRugby
RowingSnowsports
Rugby 7sSquash
SnowsportsStrength & Conditioning
SoftballSurf Life Saving
SquashSwimming & Diving
Surf Life SavingTaekwondo
Swimming & DivingTennis
TaekwondoVolleyball
TennisWater Polo
Touch Football
Volleyball
Water Polo
It is literally a 'choice' for the school in the diversity of sports they offer. Friends kids that go to Barker do not enjoy the rugby programs lack of depth and the aussie rules is a joke where anyone with talent only plays club to the detriment of the school program. By offering diversity of choice they diminish their capability - choice is a wonderful thing but so is balance. I know TKS is challenged on this front, particularly re aussie rules, but is resisting to ensure depth in their core programs. Do you want solid programs or give snowflake the chance to 'do their thang'. Depends on where rugby stands in another decade as soccer/football is probably the #1 sport in most GPS schools these days. God forbid we'll probably end up with league and rules before much longer.
 

WLF3

Darby Loudon (17)
It is literally a 'choice' for the school in the diversity of sports they offer. Friends kids that go to Barker do not enjoy the rugby programs lack of depth and the aussie rules is a joke where anyone with talent only plays club to the detriment of the school program. By offering diversity of choice they diminish their capability - choice is a wonderful thing but so is balance. I know TKS is challenged on this front, particularly re aussie rules, but is resisting to ensure depth in their core programs. Do you want solid programs or give snowflake the chance to 'do their thang'. Depends on where rugby stands in another decade as soccer/football is probably the #1 sport in most GPS schools these days. God forbid we'll probably end up with league and rules before much longer.
WOW B,

Sticking my neck out here, I have to absolutely agree with you that todays world is all about that word WOKE.
Schools are absolute breeding grounds for this SOFT crap and thus the result is kids (which they still are) must have their needs catered for otherwise they will get OFFENDED!

The next co-curricular activity will be Monopoly! and put me down here as an UMP for my winter, AND summer activities.

P.S. Always buy Mayfair!
 

Crashy

Trevor Allan (34)
As a Barker Old boy its a disgrace......
The neglect of the grass roots, the fact they play about 20 sports, the imports..... where do I begin.
I couldnt care less and its sad.
 

Crashy

Trevor Allan (34)
wow - talk about missing the point.. by a mile.
Knox is the same. Horrible age group form until under 16s. The here come the imports which all the other parents pay for.....
 

Crashy

Trevor Allan (34)
anyway - we used to have 20 rugby teams at Barker. Now there is apparently 10. good luck when you become the Redlands of the CAS....
 

WLF3

Darby Loudon (17)
Oh dear all showing your age a bit. Offering multiple winter sport options isn’t woke. If you want kids to play rugby then promote it and make it attractive to them, you dont make a deep rugby program by forcing kids to play it. Barker is a co-Ed school so won’t have the same number of teams as all boys schools simple as that.
Well H, I think age really isn't the issue, but the suggestion of woke isn't meant to mean its exact definition.
Let's break down your comment.

Yep nothing wrong with offering multiple winter sports, but there comes a point where too many options require too much resource and so the result for each sport/activity will probably become compromised.

Barker has been a co-ed school for a looong time, and had real Rugby depth for decades, suddenly not so.
I am not sure of the numbers but interested to see how many boys are in year 5-12, I would be surprised if the numbers were significantly lower than other CAS schools, keen to hear back.

Regardless of the reasons/excuses change is needed to avoid the obvious.
 
Well H, I think age really isn't the issue, but the suggestion of woke isn't meant to mean its exact definition.
Let's break down your comment.

Yep nothing wrong with offering multiple winter sports, but there comes a point where too many options require too much resource and so the result for each sport/activity will probably become compromised.

Barker has been a co-ed school for a looong time, and had real Rugby depth for decades, suddenly not so.
I am not sure of the numbers but interested to see how many boys are in year 5-12, I would be surprised if the numbers were significantly lower than other CAS schools, keen to hear back.

Regardless of the reasons/excuses change is needed to avoid the obvious.
So a private school with huge fees is struggling for resources?? Have you seen the Rosewood centre and the S&C team? Barker has been coed years 10-12 for a long time yes but only recently has that extended to the younger years.

Comparison or number of boys per year would be interesting for sure maybe I’m wrong there
 

Backintheolddays

Fred Wood (13)
Apologies my comment wasn’t directed at Barker specifically but rather the ramifications of too much choice diluting the talent pool. Barker is an amazing school and any child would be privileged to attend. My point was intended to be universal, narrower choice generally leads to greater depth, but it is firstly about what suits the child.
 

WLF3

Darby Loudon (17)
So a private school with huge fees is struggling for resources?? Have you seen the Rosewood centre and the S&C team? Barker has been coed years 10-12 for a long time yes but only recently has that extended to the younger years.

Comparison or number of boys per year would be interesting for sure maybe I’m wrong there
H, Relax, I didn't mean $ resources, it is a TERRIFIC school, with TERRIFIC facilities.
Fact is, any way you want to look at it, it's depth of Rugby program is struggling, and BTW, no one is happy to see that!

Good luck tomorrow, but not too much! ;)
 

Ziggy

Allen Oxlade (6)
I think we can all agree that we don't want to see a struggling rugby program at Barker forcing them having to rely on alot of imports to boost their opens.
 

Ziggy

Allen Oxlade (6)
Final Waverley Vs Barker Scores:

13A - Waverley 65-5
13B - Waverley 95-0
14A - Waverley 29-7
14B - Waverley 20-19
14C - Waverley 59-14
15A - Waverley 58-8
15B - Waverley 74-0
16A - Barker 13-5
16B - Waverley 26-22
4th XV - Barker 21-17
3rd XV - Waverley 38-0
2nd XV - Waverley 38-0
1st XV - Waverley 29-17

In summary, the results aren't unexpected... Only 4 close games and 2 wins to Barker.

Unfortunately, I fear for the future of Barker Rugby.

On another note, Waverley have only lost 5 CAS games in total so far. 3 against Cranbrook and now 2 vs Barker.

Would be good if we can get a similar table for Cranbrook Vs Trinity and Knox Vs Aloys
 
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