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England v Australia - Twickenham, 14 Nov, 4:30am AEDT

upthereds#!

Peter Fenwicke (45)
Valetini had what 1 run for 0 metres on the weekend?
Yep - shocker. I've said in other posts I think the game plan/execution was massively flawed. No centre field momentum in the tactics so big boys like leota, thor, skelton and valetini were invisibile.

But Valetinis individual stats on Saturday has nothing to do with why Wilson wasn't selected to tour almost a month ago.
 

Derpus

Tim Horan (67)
Whoever picked this touring party has a bit to answer for. The obvious problem of building a game plan around players who weren’t going to Europe wasn't a great idea. And this front row issue could’ve been avoided. Pone didn’t (I think) play any Super Rugby TT because of injury and hasn’t recovered? That was a long time ago and Surely the medical staff would have an idea of recovery time, but he’s still not good? I’m sure he’s not happy with being injured, but we have flown him here, there and everywhere when he’s never been physically ready to play. It’s not his fault, but who picked him? People may ask who’d I’d pick instead. Anyone who is fit capable of playing would be a start.
A lot of it surely stemmed from those Covid limitations imposed on the squad early on. Then there were the communication issues (i.e. Scott Johnson & self-interested Japanese clubs) around the availability of Kerevi etc.

I doubt the make-up of the squad is any one persons fault.

Also - I'd argue our game plan has been more or less the same with or without Quade Cooper/Kerevi. It just worked better with them.

Finally, surely Rennie picks his squad (in consultation with his team)?
 

PhilClinton

Peter Fenwicke (45)
Also - I'd argue our game plan has been more or less the same with or without Quade Cooper/Kerevi. It just worked better with them.
Yes agreed and I think that is the biggest takeaway from this tour.

We lauded the Wallabies for their winning streak, but it's really made us look like a one trick pony. Without Kerevi giving us that extreme go forward, our game plan has been undone. The Chicago Bulls weren't winning any rings without Jordan.
 

Derpus

Tim Horan (67)
Yes agreed and I think that is the biggest takeaway from this tour.

We lauded the Wallabies for their winning streak, but it's really made us look like a one trick pony. Without Kerevi giving us that extreme go forward, our game plan has been undone. The Chicago Bulls weren't winning any rings without Jordan.
A temporary respite from the symptoms of the exodus.
 

Brumby Runner

Tim Horan (67)
I'm not going to criticise the coaching staff and selectors for picking a team from the players available to collect two wins over each of South Africa and Argentina. I also applaud them for coming up with a game plan that took full advantage of those available resources.

They were dealt a bit of a wild card defeat by the Japanese clubs who made it clear they didn't want to lose the three Japan-based players during their pre-season.

I believe they then picked about the best touring side they could, with perhaps two or three surprises omitted from the squad. I am also comfortable with them bringing in four overseas-based players to supplement the squad in the UK. I might personally have gone for others in place of a couple of those extras, but it is what the coaches wanted. Unfortunately, two of the extra players hardly justified their selections in the test against Scotland, but I suppose the chances are that they will improve with more time in the squad to become familiar with the team tactics and strategies. I only hope, that if they aren't improving during training this week that the coaches have the fortitude to admit an error and leave them out against England.

Anyway, despite the injury setbacks afflicting the team, I am confident they'll give a good account and maybe even hook a win at Twickers.
 

qwerty51

George Gregan (70)
I was really surprised HJH (Harry Johnson-Holmes) wasn't picked maybe a casualty of the Tahs' season but IMO his scrummaging is fine; he's a player for the future and most importantly he seems to have a pretty big trait that maybe only Tupou has; he's fantastic 1m out from the line. He's the most likely to backup Tupou in 2023 IMO.
 

Braveheart81

James Horwill (77)
Staff member
Whoever picked this touring party has a bit to answer for. The obvious problem of building a game plan around players who weren’t going to Europe wasn't a great idea. And this front row issue could’ve been avoided. Pone didn’t (I think) play any Super Rugby TT because of injury and hasn’t recovered? That was a long time ago and Surely the medical staff would have an idea of recovery time, but he’s still not good? I’m sure he’s not happy with being injured, but we have flown him here, there and everywhere when he’s never been physically ready to play. It’s not his fault, but who picked him? People may ask who’d I’d pick instead. Anyone who is fit capable of playing would be a start.

Pone get injured at training in the week after the squad was selected and didn't tour. Rennie opted not to replace him (like Koroibete wasn't replaced when he withdrew).

After they got through Japan unscathed I guess Rennie thought that 5 props was adequate to get through the tour. In hindsight that was a poor decision after losing two props to injury in one game.

If AAA is good to go this weekend though, chances are we'll get through the tour with those five props.
 

dru

Rod McCall (65)
A lot of it surely stemmed from those Covid limitations imposed on the squad early on. Then there were the communication issues (i.e. Scott Johnson & self-interested Japanese clubs) around the availability of Kerevi etc.

I doubt the make-up of the squad is any one persons fault.

Also - I'd argue our game plan has been more or less the same with or without Quade Cooper/Kerevi. It just worked better with them.

Finally, surely Rennie picks his squad (in consultation with his team)?

It depends how deep you go into the implementation. With Quade WBs only needed the one playmaker. With Lolo they looked for better handling to top it up at 12.
 

Braveheart81

James Horwill (77)
Staff member
It depends how deep you go into the implementation. With Quade WBs only needed the one playmaker. With Lolo they looked for better handling to top it up at 12.

The only test Cooper played where he didn't have Kerevi at 12 was against Japan and we certainly looked nowhere as good there.

Cooper was a hugely pleasant surprise in terms of how well he played for the Wallabies but I think you have to put a lot of credit on Kerevi. He provided consistent penetration and skill that none of our other backline players have close to.

If you were going to name who the most important component of our backline going forward was, it has to be Kerevi.
 

Joe Blow

Jim Lenehan (48)
Yep - shocker. I've said in other posts I think the game plan/execution was massively flawed. No centre field momentum in the tactics so big boys like leota, thor, skelton and valetini were invisibile.

But Valetinis individual stats on Saturday has nothing to do with why Wilson wasn't selected to tour almost a month ago.
As said, Cooper was so good at bringing these guys into play around the ruck and wider. Because he plays relatively flat he is able to put them into holes before the defence is properly set. JOC (James O'Connor) is going to have to not play so deep and the halfbacks should also be picking out the big runners.
 

Joe Blow

Jim Lenehan (48)
The only test Cooper played where he didn't have Kerevi at 12 was against Japan and we certainly looked nowhere as good there.

Cooper was a hugely pleasant surprise in terms of how well he played for the Wallabies but I think you have to put a lot of credit on Kerevi. He provided consistent penetration and skill that none of our other backline players have close to.

If you were going to name who the most important component of our backline going forward was, it has to be Kerevi.
I think they both played a part and Kerevi would not have been as effective if Cooper was not there.
 

Brumby Jack

Steve Williams (59)
Staff member
FD6PoTZWYAA2AXu
 

Mr Pilfer

Ted Fahey (11)
Thought he would give Perese the start after his impact, deserved it over Beale.

Our locks and back row need to step up this game

England an inexperienced bench, new boy at 10, center on the wing, so not only us with some potential issues
 

Lightblue

Bob Loudon (25)
Fullback is definitely our weak link....no one has really stood out and claimed the position .. Hope Beale pulls off a vintage display ....O’Connor to play flat too... We have to beat the bloody Poms at Twickenham....
 
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