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Ireland NZ Tour 2022

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Lightblue

Lightblue

Arch Winning (36)
KiwiM said:
Historically this is an awful period for the ABs. This ABs team is right in the conversation for the worst AB team of all time.

- The ABs 22-3 deficit at halftime on Saturday was 19 points (22-3 down). That's the worst halftime margin ever for an AB test (home or away).
- Prior to this series the ABs had never lost a home test to Ireland. Now they've lost 2 in a row.
- The ABs have now lost 3 of their last 4 tests to Ireland
- The last 6 big tests the ABs have played the ABs are 1 win and 5 losses (3 x Ireland, 1 x Boks, 1 x France). I'm not counting Wales B as we played them outside the international window so they didn't have their English based players. It's worth noting that 1 win came when Foster and other assistant coaches (Feek, McLeod) couldn't attend training during the week as they had Covid and so Joe Schmidt and former nz scrum coach Mike Cron had to come in and assist during the training week as they had run out of coaches.
- Prior to Foster the ABs had never lost to Argentina - then they lost to them at a neutral venue in 2020 - again by 10 points (25-15).

In addition to the results the style of play is awful - they have next to no attacking shape (it's basically just biff it to an individual and see if he can beat someone) and the defence is passive. I've touched on the selection issues above (seriously - the Codie Taylor / Samisoni issue is one of the worst I can ever remember.)

Ireland deserved to win the series and were brilliant. In large part due to coaching - Andy Farrell has done an excellent job as coach and has advanced the team on from where they were under Schmidt.

Ireland were brilliant, deserved to win and are excellently coached with world class players.

The ABs are a poorly coached mess and it's bleedingly obvious the coach needs to be canned.

Both statements can be true.

I don't understand the argument of 'cop it' - it's like saying an Australia cricket team that loses a home series to Sri Lanka should just cop it because the Black Caps lose to Sri Lanka all the time. That makes no sense. Especially if it's obvious that Australia team is woefully coached (not a perfect parallel because the roles of coach in cricket and rugby are different).

I've also outlined reasons why Foster and co are poor coaches and some selection issues as well.

This isn't just a recent issue with Foster either by the way - he was a hugely divisive selection as AB coach after Hansen (he got fired by the Chiefs in 2011). The public wanted Razor. The public were pissed off that the ABs ran their process so late that the likes of Jamie Joseph & Dave Rennie did not apply.
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You don’t get the record you have for tolerating mediocrity.. I get it… it’s just that you have been the pinnacle of rugby for such a long time and I suppose as an Aussie, to see you guys lose a few tests, it gives us hope!
 
Bullrush

Bullrush

John Hipwell (52)
Lightblue said:
You don’t get the record you have for tolerating mediocrity.. I get it… it’s just that you have been the pinnacle of rugby for such a long time and I suppose as an Aussie, to see you guys lose a few tests, it gives us hope!
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From a rugby fan perspective, the Irish series win is awesome. It looks like this could be the most open and competitive RWC ever which is great for our game.

From an AB fan perspective - fuck the Irish series and this whole 'most competitive RWC' bullshit and just give me ALL BLACK DOMINANCE! LOL....I'm only half joking ;)

What I'm not sure that you understand @Lightblue is that what you are seeing is not some kind of knee-jerk reaction against Foster & Co. simply because we lost this series. From the time he was appointed as an AB assistant, there are those of us who have been concerned about whether he is the right man for the job. Once he was made assistant, most of us knew he was going to be groomed and ushered into the top job when Hansen left. The hiring process - as @KiwiM mentioned - only reaffirmed those worries that there wasn't a REAL search for the best coach to take over and now, just a few short years later, we are seeing AB losses that were once considered unthinkable.

Of course, there is a side of me which says that it is impossible for the ABs to NEVER lose to the Pumas or to NEVER have a series loss to Ireland but again, it's not just that we have taken these losses but HOW we have taken them. Our team just doesn't look good. And the things that the Foster detractors feared would happen are beginning to happen.

There are things that some have just accepted because it's the ABs and they have set the standard for a long time now. Questions that should have been asked perhaps weren't pursued and decisions that should have been scrutinised were taken at face value because....surely the ABs know best right?!

And to be fair - at least the NZ rugby public are looking internally and trying to find answers rather than pointing the finger at questionable ref decisions or other outside factors to explain away results. I have see Australian fans on this page not just hammer players and coaches for Wallaby failures but complain about the laws of the game, refereeing decisions, game scheduling etc etc.

We know we were beat by the better team and we'll take it on the chin.....that doesn't mean we like it or want to get used to it.
 
Bullrush

Bullrush

John Hipwell (52)
KevinO said:
Citing committee agreed with Barnes and Porter has been cleared.
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The former No.1 ref in the world disagree with them. I mean, this is World Rugby's own youtube channel and at around the 3min mark, Owens says "when you get it wrong, when you make that head contact as he did - it should be a red card"

I was all for the Ta'avao RC in Test 2....this should have been a red as well.

 
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Lightblue

Lightblue

Arch Winning (36)
Bullrush said:
From a rugby fan perspective, the Irish series win is awesome. It looks like this could be the most open and competitive RWC ever which is great for our game.

From an AB fan perspective - fuck the Irish series and this whole 'most competitive RWC' bullshit and just give me ALL BLACK DOMINANCE! LOL....I'm only half joking ;)

What I'm not sure that you understand @Lightblue is that what you are seeing is not some kind of knee-jerk reaction against Foster & Co. simply because we lost this series. From the time he was appointed as an AB assistant, there are those of us who have been concerned about whether he is the right man for the job. Once he was made assistant, most of us knew he was going to be groomed and ushered into the top job when Hansen left. The hiring process - as @KiwiM mentioned - only reaffirmed those worries that there wasn't a REAL search for the best coach to take over and now, just a few short years later, we are seeing AB losses that were once considered unthinkable.

Of course, there is a side of me which says that it is impossible for the ABs to NEVER lose to the Pumas or to NEVER have a series loss to Ireland but again, it's not just that we have taken these losses but HOW we have taken them. Our team just doesn't look good. And the things that the Foster detractors feared would happen are beginning to happen.

There are things that some have just accepted because it's the ABs and they have set the standard for a long time now. Questions that should have been asked perhaps weren't pursued and decisions that should have been scrutinised were taken at face value because....surely the ABs know best right?!

And to be fair - at least the NZ rugby public are looking internally and trying to find answers rather than pointing the finger at questionable ref decisions or other outside factors to explain away results. I have see Australian fans on this page not just hammer players and coaches for Wallaby failures but complain about the laws of the game, refereeing decisions, game scheduling etc etc.

We know we were beat by the better team and we'll take it on the chin.....that doesn't mean we like it or want to get used to it.
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Good summation there Bullrush.
I understand the mind of a frustrated All Black fan better now…pardon my ignorance but is Razor, the coach of the Crusaders?
 
ACT Crusader

ACT Crusader

Jim Lenehan (48)
Lightblue said:
Good summation there Bullrush.
I understand the mind of a frustrated All Black fan better now…pardon my ignorance but is Razor, the coach of the Crusaders?
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The story behind the Razor nickname is quite funny. It was during his first season with the Crusaders and they were playing the Brumbies and he got Pat Howard in a big tackle and he proudly told the rest of the boys that he cut him like a razor blade with his shoulder. Then everyone started calling him Razor.
 
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