Qantas

[leakytap]

And of course the peoples champion "Dubbya" Abbott has the perfect answer. That it wouldn't have happened under a liberal government.
Geez that bloke has 20/20 hindsight.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

And of course the peoples champion "Dubbya" Abbott has the perfect answer. That it wouldn't have happened under a liberal government.
Geez that bloke has 20/20 hindsight.

I think his point is that if the ALP had not dismantled Workchoices the "rolling industrial action" could not have continued for as long as it did.
There are 2 answers to that:
1. For better or worse the Australian people voted against the Libs and part of the basis is assumed to have been Workchoices;
2. The election that decided the fate of Workchoices was a long time ago and he needs to get over it.

He's said workchoices is a "never ever" policy so he probably needs to tell us what the policy would have been that prevented the dispute getting to the stage it did.

I havent seen anywhere the point made that at the AGM on Friday there was no dividend declared, thereby leaving Qantas with a war chest: that suggests a little more premeditation than Joyce is prepared to concede.

 

[mark_s]

Qantas haven't paid dividends for a few years now....

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Qantas haven't paid dividends for a few years now....

$3.4 billion in cash /$20m per day = 176 days

 

[Scotty]

I understand that other unions (not just the three involved), including Paul howes from the Australian workers union have some involvement in this fair work Australia process. Does anyone know how the he'll that works?

 

[Scotty]

http://www.businessspectator.com.au...-unions-pd20111029-N4BGB?OpenDocument&src=sph

All around Australia militant unions want to have much greater say over the management of companies. And for Qantas, that would mean an increase in costs that would kill the airline.

The unions looked smart because they were attacking without costing members dollars. Now the unions have to decide whether to press on and close the airline as we know it or whether to back down.

 

[Scotty]

I assume both these post pre-date the latest development...I dont think the game will play out over weeks/months...It will days or maybe hours
Joyce has bet the farm: he looks like a bit of goose accepting/proposing whatevering a $2m pay increase yesterday and then grounding all planes (at a cost of $20m per day) today.
This is a fascinating power play.

Apparently his pay rise is in the form of bonuses that only get paid if qantas achieves a certain share price. They are going to take a massive hit on that front tomorrow, so it is pretty clear that he isn't taking this action for personal reasons.

 

[Ruggo]

QANTAS has shown how much it values its workers and now has shown how much it values its customers.


Go and get fucked QANTAS.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

I understand that other unions (not just the three involved), including Paul howes from the Australian workers union have some involvement in this fair work Australia process. Does anyone know how the he'll that works?

I think it's because Qantas is planning to lock out all it's unionized workers today or tomorrow.
On a side note: if this was happening in the US you'd be able to go the new York times and understand the whole dispute by reading one article. Our media is crap.

 

[Slim 293]

Planes flying again from today...

No industrial action allowed over the 21 days while the shit gets sorted...

 

[mark_s]

Good article in today's SMH from malcom maiden summarising various participants views:

http://www.smh.com.au/business/joyc...udacious-roll-of-the-dice-20111030-1mqhg.html

 

[Jnor]

Not the NYT, Slim, but not too bad.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2011-10-29/qantas-factbox/3608330

 

[boyo]

I have refused to use Jetstar because they cancelled a flight on my honeymoon. I will have to reconsider using Qantas.
Alan Joyce has done damage to the Qantas reputation. His actions, and causing the stranding of passengers around the world, are reprehensible.

 

[Scarfman]

We just need Andrew Bolt to put things into perspective:

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/...rit-of-australia/story-e6freal3-1226182949467

QANTAS boss Alan Joyce made a big mistake when he offered to talk to Julia Gillard last Saturday.

He had his spokeswoman tell the Prime Minister's chief of staff, Ben Hubbard, that Mr Joyce was planning to ground his entire airline in three hours.

Oops. No wonder she never called him back over a little detail like that.

Clearly, Mr Joyce should have said he'd just been arrested outside a Bali massage shop with a sack of marijuana.

Ms Gillard would have been on the phone like a shot, as a lucky 14-year-old NSW teenager pinched in Kuta last month could confirm.

But another week, another demonstration of Ms Gillard's cartoonishly inept political judgment.

Here's a woman who can't stop the boats, but can stop the planes - and without even trying.

So now we must wade through the great sewer of bull that Ms Gillard shovels out each time to explain away her latest disaster, this time her failure to head off a two-day shutdown of our biggest airline.

:lmao: Hard to believe this bloke still draws a paycheck. Let's hope he goes the way of Glenn Beck.

 

[I like to watch]

QANTAS has shown how much it values its workers and now has shown how much it values its customers.


Go and get fucked QANTAS.

I don't value workers who gloat that they are going to disrupt the company they work for over the next year, and recommend that the public should use their competitors services to avoid their planned disruptions.

 

[Jnor]

Isn't that called industrial action? I'm not suggesting that everything done by the unions has been fantastic but when the company they work for won't meet their demands for pay and conditions, how else are they supposed to try and get their way?

 

[MrTimms]

Isn't that called industrial action? I'm not suggesting that everything done by the unions has been fantastic but when the company they work for won't meet their demands for pay and conditions, how else are they supposed to try and get their way?

Get another job? No honour in being a prick just because you don't get your own way.

 

[I like to watch]

Yeah I agree Jnor, they are entitled to strike, and they are even entitled to forecast their long term tactics to try and leverage off that.
But the employer also has rights, and they are entitled to lock out, stand down, terminate and relocate.
I don't believe any union has the right to DEMAND the employer build substantial capital projects where and when the union dictates.
Yeah I feel empathy for the guys who's jobs are going o's, but that unfortunately is the way of the world.
It will happen, the only thing we don't know is how long it will take & how much it will cost.

 

[Scotty]

I don't value workers who gloat that they are going to disrupt the company they work for over the next year, and recommend that the public should use their competitors services to avoid their planned disruptions.

The pilots union complain that all they did was wear red ties and make in flight announcements. If one of my staff spoke to my clients like this they wouldn't last long!

 

[Scotty]

Yeah I agree Jnor, they are entitled to strike, and they are even entitled to forecast their long term tactics to try and leverage off that.
But the employer also has rights, and they are entitled to lock out, stand down, terminate and relocate.
I don't believe any union has the right to DEMAND the employer build substantial capital projects where and when the union dictates.
Yeah I feel empathy for the guys who's jobs are going o's, but that unfortunately is the way of the world.
It will happen, the only thing we don't know is how long it will take & how much it will cost.

Which is the biggest problem with the Union demands. They should never have any right to decide the management and direction of a company. They should be dealing with individual staff conditions only.