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Reds 2015

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BDA

Jim Lenehan (48)
Hard to read to much into these trial games. I will say though I was watching the Asian Cup final at the same time this was on so I only saw periods of the game, mostly in the second half. The one main observation I took from the game is was Paia'aua.

He had a bit of a shocker and I worry that he might be slightly out of his depth in terms of a starting 10. It might be wiser to develop him off the bench rather than throw him to the wolves. To'omua will eat Paia'aua alive in round 1 and that will do nothing for the bloke's confidence.

I hate to be "that guy" because I'd much rather use O'Connor on the wing, but I think he (or Frisby) might be the best option to start him at 10, at least at the start of the season whilst Cooper recovers and Paia'aua develops some confidence in that role. Anyone who has read my opinions in the past know that I lambasted Deans for playing O'Connor at 10 during the Lions series. Whilst I don't think he is a particularly great 10, I think he's a decent option at Super level. We need someone with composure and good hands at 10. He's played there before for the Force, the Rebels, London Irish and Toulon as well as 5 or 6 games at test level (with varying success). That makes him our most experienced, and probably best, 10 by far. Injuries aside, we seem to have some decent talent out wide so I don't think JOC (James O'Connor)'s absence from the wing will hurt us as much as throwing in a developing rookie with no experience. Is JOC (James O'Connor) a world class 10? - No. But he's decent enough to hold his own at Super level and in fact has proved on numerous occasions that he is a useful "back-up" 10 to have in a squad. I'd feel much more comfortable giving him the reigns to start the season.
 

Ignoto

Greg Davis (50)
I'd rather us keep arguably a world class player in the position that they're best in. For James, his best games in the national colours were out wide so lets keep him there and utilize him. We'd be better off developing at 10 than using a fill-in who's not as effective as he could be there.

Rather than concentrating on what he didn't do, why don't we tell the guys around him to pick up their game an extra bit and take some of that pressure of him. With Hunt being so new, we didn't have an extra play maker to come in an help elevate the pressure on Duncan. So essentially, the burden is all on the young fly half. As he an Hunt spend more time on the field they'll develop more.
 

BDA

Jim Lenehan (48)
@ Ignoto - a few points in response to your post.

1. Having a decent 10 to lead the team around is much more important than having a world class bloke on the wing...unquestionably.
2. In their present state, you'd pick James over Duncan every day of the week, in terms of the better option at 10. Duncan might have potential but he's raw, untested and inexperienced. There is no substitute for experience.
3. I agree that we should be investing time in developing Duncan, but sometimes it can be counter-productive to throw guys in the deep end. You rightly point out that there is a fair bit of inexperience in the midfield and he's not getting much help at the moment. I don't think much will change prior to 14 Feb. JOC (James O'Connor) will be able to deal with that pressure better.

Again I'm not ruling the bloke out, I just think a guy as green as that should be developed off the bench.
 

Scrubber2050

Mark Ella (57)
@ Ignoto - a few points in response to your post.

1. Having a decent 10 to lead the team around is much more important than having a world class bloke on the wing.unquestionably.
2. In their present state, you'd pick James over Duncan every day of the week, in terms of the better option at 10. Duncan might have potential but he's raw, untested and inexperienced. There is no substitute for experience.
3. I agree that we should be investing time in developing Duncan, but sometimes it can be counter-productive to throw guys in the deep end. You rightly point out that there is a fair bit of inexperience in the midfield and he's not getting much help at the moment. I don't think much will change prior to 14 Feb. JOC (James O'Connor) will be able to deal with that pressure better.

Again I'm not ruling the bloke out, I just think a guy as green as that should be developed off the bench.

Wasn't that how Quade got his start as a "kid" Supposed to come off the bench, the regular 10 (cannot remember who) became injured and QC (Quade Cooper) chucked in at the deep end.

Recall that he was shithouse initially but grew into the spot fairly quickly
 

BDA

Jim Lenehan (48)
True, but from memory the Reds didn't win that many games that season. They lacked experience, amongst other things. I want us to be finalists, not spoilers.
 

Scoey

Tony Shaw (54)
Just flicking through Instagram and RedsRugby has just reposted a post from Nick Stiles. It adds a bit of context to how we looked for those that were expecting more from the boys.
He's talking about the post match review and says, ".....Always want to win any match but great to have 40% of last nights squad play 1st game for @RedsRugby....."

I may have a couple of these guys wrongly pegged but it would be close. E.g Paraka, Faagase & Kuridrani have all been on the bench but I'm not sure if they actually got on the pitch. That's 12 out of 28 have never played with the Reds before.

The squad:
Capped Players
James Slipper (C)
Saia Fainga’a
James Hanson
Liam Gill
James Horwill
Beau Robinson
Jake Schatz
Curtis Browning
Anthony Fainga’a
Chris Feauai-Sautia
Nick Frisby
Scott Gale
Will Genia
Sam Johnson
Samu Kerevi
Jamie-Jerry Taulagi.


Reds Debut
Sef Faagase
Lolo Fakaosilea
Michael Gunn
Adam Korczyk
Marco Kotze
Pettowa Paraka
Sam Talakai
Tom Banks
Karmichael Hunt (VC)
Campbell Magnay
Duncan Paia’aua
Chris Kuridrani
 

something

Jim Clark (26)
I have to agree with BDA on this one, why throw Duncan in the deep end when you can utilise JOC (James O'Connor)'s versatility and ease Duncan in off the bench. You don't want to shatter his confidence against To'omua.

That being said Duncan should start against the saders in the second trial.
 

something

Jim Clark (26)
& who knows, he might silence the critics and this time next week we will be advocating for him to start in the first game
 

Brendan Hume

Charlie Fox (21)
JOC (James O'Connor) when available, and I imagine Hunt will be looking to do the same - moving in from the edges in attack to take the pressure off the new 10.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Braveheart81

Will Genia (78)
Staff member
JOC (James O'Connor) has tonsillitis so it makes little sense to rush him back this weekend. I'd play Paia'aua on Friday with an eye to picking JOC (James O'Connor) at 10 in the first round.
 

Brendan Hume

Charlie Fox (21)
You can really only wish them luck. Tough way to start the year. QC (Quade Cooper) had been working so hard. Fingers crossed for the rest of the group to stay healthy.
I was pretty surprised by Holmes' injury - 9 weeks for a thumb ligament sounds ridiculous, it must be pretty nasty.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Scoey

Tony Shaw (54)
O'Connor hasn't been playing or presumably training at 10 for how long? He's new to the team and the structures. K has been training at fullback.
Duncan has been training all preseason at 10. He had a rough debut that he will learn from. The Reds really need to persist with the kid. At this stage I would prefer them looking at starting him over O'Connor in round 1 but I think given our situation, any talk about round 1 is premature anyway. A week is a long time in rugby. See how he goes this weekend.
 

liquor box

Peter Sullivan (51)
I'm looking forward to the coaching input Thompson will add to the squad as much as his on field prowess.
I hope we manage to sign an older player as a future coach when they retire.

Personally I think we should have tried to do this with Brad Thorn, play for a season as a starter, one off the bench and then coach.

We need an older player to set an example of what a pro player has to do as opposed to completing school on a scholarship and getting a contract, it might teach young players that you have to work hard to be good
 

liquor box

Peter Sullivan (51)
@ Ignoto - a few points in response to your post.

1. Having a decent 10 to lead the team around is much more important than having a world class bloke on the wing.unquestionably.
2. In their present state, you'd pick James over Duncan every day of the week, in terms of the better option at 10. Duncan might have potential but he's raw, untested and inexperienced. There is no substitute for experience.
3. I agree that we should be investing time in developing Duncan, but sometimes it can be counter-productive to throw guys in the deep end. You rightly point out that there is a fair bit of inexperience in the midfield and he's not getting much help at the moment. I don't think much will change prior to 14 Feb. JOC (James O'Connor) will be able to deal with that pressure better.

Again I'm not ruling the bloke out, I just think a guy as green as that should be developed off the bench.
Getting the ball to a world class winger may allow tries to be scored, moving this winger to 10 may never see the ball get to the wing or the replacement may not be able to score.

I will say I have never really rated JOC (James O'Connor) but I want him on the wing scoring tries for the Reds and Wallabies to prove me wrong.

I would be more inclined to pick Frisby at 9 or 10 with Genia if Duncan does not work (but keep him on the bench) based on NRC form.

I would pick Frisby over Genia at 9 too.




Imagine 7 or 8 years ago having this debate over players, which world class player will we use to replace another world class player?

Things are positive guys, support you team and they will pull through. I think we are looking great
 

Tomikin

David Codey (61)
On a serious note, they should play him this week and see how he goes, with some time for Hunt there. But really I'd be picking JOC (James O'Connor) there. Proven performer and a F'ing good player.
 
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