Reds vs Bulls Rnd 5 2012.

[qwerty51]

Digby is gone for 5 weeks!! Wow, that's a huge blow for you guys, seems way over the top.

Iain Payten ‏ @iainpayten
Digby Ioane suspended for five weeks for dangerous tackle.

 

[RedsHappy]

That is ridiculous given precedents, and, yes, awful news for us. We're sure to appeal I'd think, with a good chance of getting that materially reduced.

 

[barbarian]

Guys I have started a thread on the Ioane ban, so we can keep this thread for match-based chat.

 

[AlexH]

That is largely your opinion and I, along with many others, would dispute that. However, none of us can be proved correct or incorrect as the players mentioned will not be playing. The fact remains, the Reds have lost their first game and they have one more game to go.

Well, lets look at the last twenty minutes of the Sharks game from a practical perspective. Genia could not slot the first penalty just to the left of the posts inside the twenty-two and we could not take a similarly kickable penalty in the last ten minutes because we had no kicker. If either Harris or Lucas were on the field those goals would have been kicked and the final score would've been 28-27.

 

[Brisbok]

Well, lets look at the last twenty minutes of the Sharks game from a practical perspective. Genia could not slot the first penalty just to the left of the posts inside the twenty-two and we could not take a similarly kickable penalty in the last ten minutes because we had no kicker. If either Harris or Lucas were on the field those goals would have been kicked and the final score would've been 28-27.

That's working on the assumption that firstly, Harris or Lucas would have slotted both penalties. I think we can assume both of them probably would have (definitely in Harris' situation). Secondly, that if either of them slotted the first penalty, the game would have still panned out in exactly the same way and the Reds would have had another shot at goal later in the game. That is quite a large assumption particularly since the restart after the first converted penalty would be a kickoff by the Sharks, rather than a 22m dropout. No one can predict how the game might have panned out from that point onwards. To suggest that the game would have continued in the exact same way that it actually did when you change certain elements (including scoring of points and a change of personnel) is quite ridiculous really and certainly not practical.

 

[PaarlBok]

That's working on the assumption that firstly, Harris or Lucas would have slotted both penalties. I think we can assume both of them probably would have (definitely in Harris' situation). Secondly, that if either of them slotted the first penalty, the game would have still panned out in exactly the same way and the Reds would have had another shot at goal later in the game. That is quite a large assumption particularly since the restart after the first converted penalty would be a kickoff by the Sharks, rather than a 22m dropout. No one can predict how the game might have panned out from that point onwards. To suggest that the game would have continued in the exact same way that it actually did when you change certain elements (including scoring of points and a change of personnel) is quite ridiculous really and certainly not practical.

If my aunt have balls, she'll be my uncle. Brisbok which franchise do you support?

Brutes by 16 now. They look ready to bash the Reds.

 

[AlexH]

That's working on the assumption that firstly, Harris or Lucas would have slotted both penalties. I think we can assume both of them probably would have (definitely in Harris' situation). Secondly, that if either of them slotted the first penalty, the game would have still panned out in exactly the same way and the Reds would have had another shot at goal later in the game. That is quite a large assumption particularly since the restart after the first converted penalty would be a kickoff by the Sharks, rather than a 22m dropout. No one can predict how the game might have panned out from that point onwards. To suggest that the game would have continued in the exact same way that it actually did when you change certain elements (including scoring of points and a change of personnel) is quite ridiculous really and certainly not practical.

Yeah, you are right. We would have slotted the first one and then we would have had structure in attack, a strong tactical kicking game, a goal kicker who could boot most penalties within the 50m mark and, generally speaking, a team that was more capable of mounting pressure on the Sharks. The Reds pack started to lift its act in the second half and the backs were getting plenty of pill to work with too. Yeah mate, you are definitely right, the game would have panned out completely differently.

 

[Brisbok]

Yeah, you are right. We would have slotted the first one and then we would have had structure in attack, a strong tactical kicking game, a goal kicker who could boot most penalties within the 50m mark and, generally speaking, a team that was more capable of mounting pressure on the Sharks. The Reds pack started to lift its act in the second half and the backs were getting plenty of pill to work with too. Yeah mate, you are definitely right, the game would have panned out completely differently.

I'm not going to bother continuing an argument with you when you clearly have such a biased outlook on the game. "IF this happened, then this would have happened and then this, and then we WOULD'VE done this, and then so and so WOULD have done this"

That is all absolute BS and counts for nothing. I could also mount some ridiculous argument on what could have or would have happened IF other events in the game happened slightly differently. But why would I waste mine or any one elses time?

 

[emuarse]

I think the game against the Bulls will be a cracker.
The Reds are hurting from the way they lost to the Sharks, and more importantly they have started to rediscover their mojo.
Lance Jono impressed for the Reds in the business part of the season last year.
The great thing about what is happening here is the uncovering of new talent for the Reds in what is to be a long season.
Frisby last week played extremely well for his baptism, and I'm looking forward to seeing Murphy in his first game. I for one think he is going to surprise us, and more importantly, the Bulls.
The Reds forwards keep their pack intact, with Samo being a forward/backs reserve.
Bring it on!

 

[tigerland12]

Sharks are a way better side then the Bulls, not as nervous about this one.

 

[rustycruiser]

Sharks are a way better side then the Bulls, not as nervous about this one.

Much better. The Sharks beat them a month a go in Round One. Oh, wait...

 

[Troy]

Sharks are a way better side then the Bulls, not as nervous about this one.

Agreed - Bulls are playing well but nothing like they used to, which is expected giving the changes. The Sharks are building and should get better as they go on..

 

[Brisbok]

Sharks are a way better side then the Bulls, not as nervous about this one.

Agreed - Bulls are playing well but nothing like they used to, which is expected giving the changes. The Sharks are building and should get better as they go on..

25/02/2012 - Round 1 Super Rugby - Bulls 18 - Sharks 13. Bulls were probably more dominant than the score suggested.

 

[qwerty51]

I dunno, tbh the Bulls never looked like scoring a try in that game. Sharks were very ill-disciplined.

 

[Brisbok]

I dunno, tbh the Bulls never looked like scoring a try in that game. Sharks were very ill-disciplined.

The Bulls dominated the forward exchanges and got themselves into the right field position to accumulate 3 pointers. The Sharks looked better for a short period towards the end of the game but for the first 50 - 60 mins the Bulls were clearly on top IMO.

 

[Brisbok]

The Bulls will be stinging after their loss to the Blues at home in their last outing. They will welcome Francois Hougaard and Johan Sadie back to their starting lineup and they've had the bye week to prepare for this game against the Reds. Always hard to tip against the Bulls at Loftus. Bulls by 7 to 10 points.

 

[tigerland12]

Much better. The Sharks beat them a month a go in Round One. Oh, wait...

I love stirring the South Africans on this forum, so arrogant about all your sides. Reading alot of the posts in this thread and the Sharks thread (not necessarily you rusty), I find it annoying that you lot talk with such one-eyed confidence.

But seriously, Bulls don't scare me as much as the Sharks, especially in the forwards. Hougaard is the only real danger I see in that side. That being said it will be a task for Queensland to get up, I reckon the same plan as the Stormers game 2011 will work for this one.

 

[Brisbok]

I love stirring the South Africans on this forum, so arrogant about all your sides. Reading alot of the posts in this thread and the Sharks thread (not necessarily you rusty), I find it annoying that you lot talk with such one-eyed confidence.

But seriously, Bulls don't scare me as much as the Sharks, especially in the forwards. Hougaard is the only real danger I see in that side. That being said it will be a task for Queensland to get up, I reckon the same plan as the Stormers game 2011 will work for this one.

That first point is very rich coming from an "arrogant, one-eyed" Reds fan. IMO my predictions of the scorelines have been quite objective on these two games and backed up with the reasons for my thinking. So far my tipping on these games has been 1 from 1, let's see how I end up after this week's game.

BTW executing the exact same game plan in two different games is a very difficult task, particularly when you have different personnel in key positions.

 

[suckerforred]

You and other Reds fans cannot seem to handle anyone tipping against your Reds. Any time someone does (including Kafe), you believe it is because of some anti-Reds sentiment. You cannot accept people's opinion that the Reds simply aren't as good a team this year as they were last year.

I would be interested to know how many Reds fans actually tipped them for the Sharks game. I for one had a bet each way, for them in one comp against them in another, because I was not sure that they could win, but they have surprised me before in SA (e.g. 2011). I am now at the point that without first and second string 5/8 and kickers then we have even less likely chance of beating the bulls. Not saying they could have before, but they have been know to surprise, and that is before you consider the absense of Diggers.

I don't think that Reds fans in general are nothing but realists. We have been through enough over the last 15 years not to take anything for granted.

 

[AlexH]

Regardless of the circumstances, Kafe predicted they would come back from South Africa without a win. He is only 50% of the way there though, still one big game to go!

Incidentally, if you're betting on a horse race and you back the favourite and then the 2nd favourite has to withdraw....is your bet still valid?

I'm not going to bother continuing an argument with you when you clearly have such a biased outlook on the game. "IF this happened, then this would have happened and then this, and then we WOULD'VE done this, and then so and so WOULD have done this"

That is all absolute BS and counts for nothing. I could also mount some ridiculous argument on what could have or would have happened IF other events in the game happened slightly differently. But why would I waste mine or any one elses time?

My suggestion that Kafe's prediction would most likely have been defeated, but for the injuries of Harris and Lucas during the game, is perfectly reasonable. Mate, you do not have a leg to stand on in calling me bias when you refuse to acknowledge that having a playmaker and kicker on the field would have significantly altered the outcome of the game.