Rugby News from unexpected places

[The Ghost of Raelene]

It doesn’t. It’s why the idea of our Clubs being a third tier is absurd. The resources required for the uplift would be crippling and not bare the fruits of the cost.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

And yet you suggested that clubs like Glendale, OMBAC and NYAC should have been the vessels in the States?

I just pointed out having actively followed the game in the States alongside other T2 nations for quite some time now that these clubs have resources on the level of Subbies clubs. It's been tried and failed in the past.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

For the standard of the MLR it could develop Eagles and the game in the US. Very different to the goals of RA and the Wallabies.

The sleeping giant spiel about the US is garbage. They will never be a top tier nation. More likely to be good at Soccer before Rugby.

I follow these comps as well. Know many involved across them. A lot of people do if you’re around circles here. I don’t care so much about Currie cup players and even ITM cup. Edmed went and brained it…then you have 14 Currie Cup teams minus all the guys overseas…

Was said by a few weeks ago that I’ll be surprised if the MLR exists in 3-5 years but good luck to some Clubbies if they can get some coin out of footy. It’s a tough gig to earn.

 

[Rebel man]

They could easily become good at rugby if the game was well run

 

[pnut]

It doesn’t. It’s why the idea of our Clubs being a third tier is absurd. The resources required for the uplift would be crippling and not bare the fruits of the cost.

rubbish. The current pathway is broken. Get your involved with it but 3 east coast teams is not a pathway. Different ways to fund it rather than super clubs wasting it.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

I have zero involvement. I promise you.

Do you genuinely believe Australia’s Club ecosystem has the ability to provide a professional environment without being a complete burden on RA that would cripple other things? Just geographically the cost would be immense.

I love Club Rugby and think it will always have a place and I get the romanticism of it being something greater but it’s not the way forward.

I’d love someone to show a business case for it working and what would it take.

 

[Wilson]

The sleeping giant spiel about the US is garbage. They will never be a top tier nation. More likely to be good at Soccer before Rugby.

While there are people making the 'sleeping giant' argument, I don't think it's the actual goal of any of the major decision makers. All they really want is a stable foothold in the market - if MLR got to anything near where MLS has (even relative to the scale of Rugby vs Soccer) it would be a very solid market that would enable the rest of the Americas to take a big step forward.

I do think it's in a pretty dire state though, the only real caveat to collapse is that the 2031 world cup has pushed the US into "too big (or important) to fail territory" from a world rugby perspective for the next 5 or so years. If I were an ambitious tier one nation or top flight professional club side, I'd be actively courting USA Rugby, MLR sides and most importantly World Rugby to try and get my share of that investment (bail out money) to come.

That is all said from a very 'men's game' perspective though, on the female side of the game they're already a fairly strong force and the sleeping giant moniker is much more apt. Arguably MLR should be looking to run an equivalent Women's comp and let them drag the men along with them, basically the opposite of how the women's game is building elsewhere. If they were running dual men's and women's sides at every club and playing either double headers or Saturday/Sunday paired games each weekend for a double round robin they might actually have something both sustainable and with solid growth potential, even if they had to fall back to 6 clubs to do it.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

A women's 'pro' league launched this year. Womens Elite Rugby or WER.

 

[Wilson]

How closely bound is it to the MLR?

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

Not at all.

 

[Wilson]

That's probably good for the Women's game but a huge missed opportunity for MLR. Being able to offset some costs and broaden the market would've made a huge difference for some of these teams, particularly at the salary base they're currently operating at.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

What's intetesting is that they operate in mostly different markets. With the exception of Boston (who actually have a relationship with the Freejacks) and Chicago the rest are in markets with no MLR presence.

 

[Wilson]

Not at all surprising but World Rugby are set to massively increase their investment in USA rugby:

World Rugby to invest $250 million or more in U.S. ahead of upcoming World Cups

World Rugby plans to invest $250 million or more in the U.S. ahead of upcoming Men's and Women's World Cup as it seeks to make long-term gains in the American market.

www.sportsbusinessjournal.com

A lot of talk will be around opportunities to play tier 1 nations (the wallabies should get in on this), but I reckon the real opportunities here are going to be for top flight pro teams willing to both tour the US playing MLR sides, and maybe even hosting the Eagles to give them more opportunities and exposure. Our super Rugby clubs should be getting on the front foot here, this is a great chance for them to get more off season rugby in at a reasonable level, and hopefully have at least part of the bill picked up by World Rugby.

 

[PhilClinton]

The rugby approach in the US always seems to be a step behind soccer.

The MLR seemed to pretty much copy the MLS model of chasing aging stars.

And I can’t help but feel this is a bit of scramble over there in preparation for the FIFA World Cup next year which will no doubt see soccer skyrocket again in popularity.

 

[Crashy]

remember the US has a massive diaspora of South Americans in the US. ( well for now anyway).
That helps drive the popularity of the game.
The US have their Irish* with roots to rugby.

* someone who has a great, great, great, great, great grandparent who came over from Cork.

 

[The Ghost of Raelene]

Soccer is also a mass participation sport in youth and the US are a powerhouse in the Womens game.

Rugby is a niche sport in the US like Baseball in Aus. There are regions that seem to really get into it but it's way down the list. Hopefully this investment means the sport has a permanent and steady footprint by the RWC and not seem like the World Expo just showing up, hosting then vanishing.

 

[Omar Comin']

The short cut for rugby getting bigger in the US would be for the men's national team to become competitive with the top nations. This would cost less than $250 million.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

The short cut for rugby getting bigger in the US would be for the men's national team to become competitive with the top nations. This would cost less than $250 million.

A lot of it is earmarked for participation and womens rugby.

 

[Strewthcobber]

The short cut for rugby getting bigger in the US would be for the men's national team to become competitive with the top nations. This would cost less than $250 million.

Depends what you mean by competitive, and over what time frame, but I'm not so sure, especially when the salaries for pro sports over there are so much higher (not just players - coaches, admin, even the S&C).

Australian rugby has spent (and generated) $1B+ over the last 10 years, with a lot more investment in the decades before that. We'd be nowhere with "just" $250m

 

[Omar Comin']

Depends what you mean by competitive, and over what time frame, but I'm not so sure, especially when the salaries for pro sports over there are so much higher (not just players - coaches, admin, even the S&C).

Australian rugby has spent (and generated) $1B+ over the last 10 years, with a lot more investment in the decades before that. We'd be nowhere with "just" $250m

Lets say at a level where they would be a legitimate chance of making the world cup quarter finals, with the ability to pull off an occasional upset against a top 5 team (similar to a country like Fiji now).

You could fully professionalise the US national team so that they play ~25 games a year, roughly half of those being test matches and half against whichever pro clubs they can organise games against. Pay enough to recruit a few more high quality foreign developed pros who are eligible for the Eagles (all but any top tier guys who can earn big contracts in Europe - for those you offer reasonable match payments if they represent the Eagles in test windows).

It's basically what Japan did leading into the 2019 world cup, and they were awesome there. I remember very few Japanese test players were playing for the Sunwolves in 2018/19 - they were mostly in this extended 'Wolfpack' squad that trained and played together over that period.