SRP (Super Rugby Pacific) 2023 General Chat

[WorkingClassRugger]

Because I'm a punishingly boring cnt, I have a quick and dirty look at the attendances per franchise, based on the 2023 SRP (Super Rugby Pacific) (Super Rugby Pacific) matches Wikipedia page. Brumbies would be the most accurate, but it still only covers ~2/3rd of their matches.

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Not much you can reliably tell from 2-7 matches, but killed half an hour. Just need these bastards to mandate publishing attendance figures...

If I'm reading it correctly those numbers albeit from a smaller sample size look better that 2022.

 

[Ignoto]

. My solution if feasible, would be to make a "kids go free" to every game, as well as more 2 PM Sat/Sun kickoffs.

I distinctly remember my old rugby director on a Friday assembly announcing he had tickets to the Reds game and to come get some off him.

Makes sense to get any and all school kids there. They always seem to have a blast and I csnt imagine it's as costly as one would think.

 

[VassMan]

Well done Force on the win last night.

Genuine question for the Force fans, are they happy that teams continually aren’t sending their best line up out West this year? Personally I’d be happy with the wins but I know there is a lot of chat about quality etc. in the comp causing decline in attendance and viewership. Be curious to know if it’s impacting their perception of their experience?

I didn't go last night for various reasons. Would have definitely gone if all the Wallabies were playing. People on the Sea of Blue Facebook would say that means I'm not a real fan. This is one reason why we are averaging on 6k each game.

 

[Wallaby Man]

I didn't go last night for various reasons. Would have definitely gone if all the Wallabies were playing. People on the Sea of Blue Facebook would say that means I'm not a real fan. This is one reason why we are averaging on 6k each game.

To be honest I’d be happy because I’m more interested in winning than who it’s against. But can get the other side of the argument.

 

[Dan54]

Was having a think, we have been upset that games are supposedly predictable, Haven't the Reds and Force reminded us over last couple of weeks, why it's called sport, and nothing is too predictable.

 

[Dctarget]

So apparently Mauger has resigned as HC of Moana Pasifika after two seasons and only two wins. Apparently players are refusing to sign contracts and Levi Aumua is rumoured to crusaders. Just wrap it up.

 

[qwerty51]

Just end Super Rugby already. Pack it up. Start again.

 

[hoggy]

Just end Super Rugby already. Pack it up. Start again.

For years I could never put my finger on why exactly the game or Super rugby in particular is such a bloody mess, pretty much a university course on how not to run a sporting competition.

I've advocated since day one from an Aus perspective for a domestic product only to be shouted down endlessly that this would be the demise of the code here, yet i look around and just shake my head at the outcome of the this cross border marriage.

I've given up on solutions, i've got no idea anymore. But one thing while the game is operated by two rugby boards thats sole purpose and energies are focused on there own national teams and who over twenty five years have proven utterly incompetant in running a basic sporting competition. Then sadly nothing is going to change.

 

[Dan54]

I've given up on solutions, i've got no idea anymore. But one thing while the game is operated by two rugby boards thats sole purpose and energies are focused on there own national teams and who over twenty five years have proven utterly incompetant in running a basic sporting competition. Then sadly nothing is going to change.

And yet RA is seemingly refusing or at least very every reluctant to go ahead with an independant board so the comp is run just as that a pretty stand alone tournament . Not sure what the reasoning. I will add the NZR CEO said exactly what you said while they trying to run it they only putting part time recourses into it.

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

Ominous headline in the NZHurld wrt future of Super Rugby.

Super Rugby Pacific’s future in doubt after Rugby Australia’s ‘betrayal’ of New Zealand Rugby​

Byline is Gregor Paul so should probably be taken with a grain or three of salt, but still...

 

[zer0]

Full article.

Super Rugby Pacific was celebrating late last year after it was agreed that New Zealand and Australia would both commit to the competition until 2030. But now the Australians are reneging on key features of the deal they signed, and fears are rising that Super Rugby Pacific is going to fall apart, leaving professional club rugby in the Southern Hemisphere with a bleak and uninspiring future. Gregor Paul reports.

In December last year, months of what had been tense and at times confrontational negotiations concluded when the rugby unions of New Zealand and Australia signed a joint-venture agreement to commit to Super Rugby Pacific until 2030.

The deal, described by then Rugby Australia chief executive Andy Marinos as “the dawn of a new era”, was built on the three pillars of a short-term revenue sharing agreement, the appointment of an independent commission led by a chief executive and governed by a nine-person board, and a general commitment to give Super Rugby Pacific greater commercial and management autonomy and a stronger identity.

The commission, it was agreed, would have a remit to drive commercial revenue, oversee rules and regulations, shape the future strategic direction and generate fan-first initiatives.

It was being set up to take the lower-level decision-making and day-to-day running out of the hands of Sanzaar, the Sydney-based administrative company owned, funded and governed by the national unions of New Zealand, Australia, South Africa and Argentina.

The 12 Super Rugby Pacific clubs are unanimous in their belief that Sanzaar is conflicted as it primarily exists to protect and promote the interests of the national bodies it represents and its decision-making over the last two decades has reflected its desire to put the international game first.

What NZR and Rugby Australia agreed when they both signed the term sheet securing Super Rugby Pacific’s future through to 2030, was that the new commission would manage, market and promote Super Rugby, Sanzaar would continue to do the same for the Rugby Championship and that decision-making authority for “major matters” such as negotiating broadcast deals, changing eligibility laws, expanding the number of teams or materially changing the format of either competition would remain categorically with the national unions.

The significance of the agreement was enormous as it ended what was a real prospect of Southern Hemisphere rugby being destroyed by an ongoing and seemingly irresolvable feud between NZR and Rugby Australia which began in June 2020 when NZR unilaterally blew up the competition, announced it was launching a new one and then told Australia only three of their teams would get in.

The Australians never quite got over being treated like that, and in mid-June last year unexpectedly announced they were ready to quit Super Rugby Pacific at the end of 2023 and set up their own competition — a threat that seemingly ended with the joint-venture agreement until 2030.

“This long-term agreement provides certainty for players, coaches, fans, sponsors and broadcast partners,” declared NZR chief executive Mark Robinson in December last year.

“And it solidifies our joint commitment to ensuring Super Rugby Pacific is the most entertaining, innovative and fan-focused cross-border club competition in the world.”

But six months on and the sense of certainty has been replaced by what is beginning to feel like betrayal as there is still no independent commission or board in operation, and according to multiple sources, Rugby Australia is reneging on or at least trying to alter many of the conditions that were included in the term sheet it signed.

The fear in New Zealand is that Rugby Australia is trying to unpick the deal that saved Super Rugby Pacific and persevere with an archaic and conflicted management model that leaves it under the control of national unions and forced to pander to the needs of the Wallabies and All Blacks.

As the Herald understands it, an independent chair and four independent directors have been found to join the CEOs of NZR and Rugby Australia and the heads of the New Zealand and Australian professional player associations to form a nine-person board as per the terms of the deal.

But it is believed Rugby Australia chairman Hamish McLennan is claiming that neither he nor his board were made aware of all the conditions in the term sheet and that they don’t support an independent commission being set up.

It is understood that Rugby Australia now wants an unspecified, but smaller number of people handpicked from the two national unions and participating clubs to run Super Rugby — more as a committee than an active, funded body empowered to drive change.

That would effectively leave Super Rugby under the management and governance of Sanzaar — whose chair is McLennan.

Several sources have confirmed this change of heart occurred after McLennan failed to get his way over the appointment of a chief executive for the independent commission.

Sources say Rugby Australia wanted to hand-pick the appointment, whereas NZR felt it was more appropriate to run a process. When they couldn’t agree, Rugby Australia then began walking back its commitment to the commission.

The Herald has also been told that despite the signed term sheet clearly spelling out that “major matters” remain entirely within the control of the national unions, Rugby Australia has aired concerns that it believes the commission would be able to kick Australian teams out of Super Rugby Pacific on a whim and renegotiate broadcast rights.

Rugby Australia’s refusal to commit to what it agreed last year has left Super Rugby Pacific in a state of limbo at a time when some of the key metrics around the competition are showing growth.

Broadcast audiences in New Zealand are at their highest levels in five years and NZR wants the commission — which would effectively be a super-charged marketing arm — to be in place to capitalise on this fan revival.

NZR and New Zealand’s clubs also believe that the commission would play a vital role in driving fans back to games as while broadcast numbers are climbing, attendances are suffering an overall decline, albeit with major spikes for specific, high-profile games.

And there is universal agreement on both sides of the Tasman that more needs to be done to address the inequity in the competition which has seen a gulf open between the top five teams and bottom seven.

Robinson says that talks with Rugby Australia will resume this week, but that NZR remains committed to implementing the terms agreed last year.

He said: “New Zealand Rugby and our clubs’ position is that we see benefit in having a more dedicated, focused Super Rugby in the shape of a commission with dedicated resource around governance and management model that might have more a singular focus and bring fresh perspective to some of the challenges we have historically seen in the competition.

“We continue to work in partnership with Rugby Australia to work through these matters.”

Given that Rugby Australia has signed a legally binding contract, it’s unclear what will happen if it continues to refuse to accept the commitment it made last year.

NZR would presumably be reluctant to head to court due to the expense, permanent damage it would inflict upon the relationship and lack of certainty that it would deliver a beneficial, practical outcome.

The more likely consequence is that NZR will withdraw the $7m of annual funding it has agreed to pay Rugby Australia annually until 2025 as part of a retrospectively agreed broadcast revenue sharing agreement.

But the fact that NZR is having to contemplate court action or cutting the purse strings is a worrying sign that Super Rugby Pacific is not on the solid ground it believed it was late last year.

The future of the Southern Hemisphere’s showpiece club competition is once again shrouded in doubt and being held hostage by vested interests and Rugby Australia’s refusal to cede any kind of control.

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

A lot to unpack there & really, really disappointing if even half true. I don't know how you sign an agreement then turn around & claim not to know what was in it, for starters.

 

[Dan54]

Not sure how much is true etc. Do know I have heard Robertson say that NZR's partner in the comp seem to be having problems with the ageement. Not sure how agrrement was signed without knowing what's in it, sounds like if that was true perhaps it speaks of big problems within that board. I remain hopeful that Paul has got it wrong.

 

[KOB1987]

Not sure how much is true etc. Do know I have heard Robertson say that NZR's partner in the comp seem to be having problems with the ageement. Not sure how agrrement was signed without knowing what's in it, sounds like if that was true perhaps it speaks of big problems within that board. I remain hopeful that Paul has got it wrong.

A lot to unpack there & really, really disappointing if even half true. I don't know how you sign an agreement then turn around & claim not to know what was in it, for starters.

'just return the page you signed, don't worry about the rest'.

 

[Ignoto]

"Sources say Rugby Australia wanted to hand-pick the appointment, whereas NZR felt it was more appropriate to run a process."

We've seen NZRU run a process and it almost cost them Razor. I feel as confident in this process as I do when the Reds run a World Wide coaching search only to never leave the car park.

 

[Adam84]

This is a disaster for Moana Pasifika, already a team struggling. NZ Rugby have butchered the delivery of MP (Moana Pasifika), they’re playing in front of empty stadiums in NZ, rarely venturing to the PI they supposedly represent and are now been treated as a recruitment catchment for other NZ teams.

World Rugby will surely pull funding from the Moana Pasifika, which is a massive shame as it was a positive concept.

 

[LeCheese]

This is a disaster for Moana Pasifika, already a team struggling. NZ Rugby have butchered the delivery of MP (Moana Pasifika) (Moana Pasifika), they’re playing in front of empty stadiums in NZ, rarely venturing to the PI they supposedly represent and are now been treated as a recruitment catchment for other NZ teams.

World Rugby will surely pull funding from the Moana Pasifika, which is a massive shame as it was a positive concept.
View attachment 16147

What an absolute dumpster fire. So much potential thrown to the wind with MP (Moana Pasifika).

Extremely happy for Levi, however.

 

[Adam84]

And yet Rugby Australia is seemingly refusing or at least very every reluctant to go ahead with an independant board so the comp is run just as that a pretty stand alone tournament . Not sure what the reasoning. I will add the NZR CEO said exactly what you said while they trying to run it they only putting part time recourses into it.

Well no shit, when you have people in NZR who want to kick out Australian teams, why would any Australia rugby fan want these same turds been given opportunity again to do it.

An independent body that could potentially be made up of majority kiwis directors, doesn’t represent Australia well does it. And kiwis have already shown once before they want to kick out Australian teams.

 

[Dan54]

Well no shit, when you have people in NZR who want to kick out Australian teams, why would any Australia rugby fan want these same turds been given opportunity again to do it.

An independent body that could potentially be made up of majority kiwis directors, doesn’t represent Australia well does it. And kiwis have already shown once before they want to kick out Australian teams.

What don't you understand about independant board? It could potentially made up of Australian members too. And I not sure if it's true, but why sign the agrement if you had those worries anyway?
And out of interest who wants to kick Aussie teams out?

 

[Dan54]

This is a disaster for Moana Pasifika, already a team struggling. NZ Rugby have butchered the delivery of MP (Moana Pasifika) (Moana Pasifika), they’re playing in front of empty stadiums in NZ, rarely venturing to the PI they supposedly represent and are now been treated as a recruitment catchment for other NZ teams.

World Rugby will surely pull funding from the Moana Pasifika, which is a massive shame as it was a positive concept.
View attachment 16147

I think it is shit for MP (Moana Pasifika) too, but he would of had to (from what I believe) align to one of PI teams to stay in MP (Moana Pasifika) and has made it pretty clear that he was born in NZ and his dream has always been ABs. I not sure what answer is, I would love them to be set up in Islands, but would probably lose too many players and they would need to up facilities I think. Have to remember almost all players live with families in NZ and also play in NPC teams. Really struggle to see what answer is, they were basically set up by a lot of work by Ice Jones and Bee Gee, they need someone in Islands to actually run it.