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Wales v Australia, Sunday 21st 4.30 am ADST.

Derpus

Tim Horan (67)
The yellow card for the swinging arm to the back of a prone players head is the most egregious error made by the officiating team.
 

Pfitzy

Jason Little (69)
Should have beaten an understrength Wales. Didn't in part because we continue to do stupid things.

There are some definite brainfart merchants in our side who are slow to learn the lessons of playing up north, and unless they educate themselves, we won't build on this excellent progress we've made so far. Rodda changing his line for the chasers off the restart. Yay. Give up 3 points as soon as we had a lead and were reset to go again. Brainless.

Valetini's red was deserved, and lazy. That's the simple truth. Plenty of time to get lower and cut the Welsh bloke in half, and chose to go for the big hit instead.

Wright... I mean FFS mate you're not that talented you can continue to do dumb shit and get away with it.

Beale kicking the ball away in the last couple of minutes did not help, particularly when we had a narrow lead. At least get it to the sideline and force Wales to throw. Fucking hell, just knock it on yourself because we had them on toast at scrum time.

I've made my comments elsewhere on home broadcasters affecting the TMO; it needs to stop.

This has been a good year, and I see us growing into 2022 and 2023 with the core of this squad, some others sprinkled in, and more time.

Beat the French, Boks, Japan, and Argies. Should have beaten England, Scotland, and Wales. We're actually a lot closer to NZ than the scorelines suggest.

But we won't get those clutch wins without the top 2 inches.
 

barbarian

Phil Kearns (64)
Staff member
Beale kicking the ball away in the last couple of minutes did not help, particularly when we had a narrow lead. At least get it to the sideline and force Wales to throw. Fucking hell, just knock it on yourself because we had them on toast at scrum time.

From memory, the issue wasn't the kick or the decision to kick IMO, he just did it half a step too late and was grabbed from behind as he kicked. So instead of a lineout deep in Wales territory they had a much more stable platform.

That said, we still should have been good enough to keep them out from there. They played pretty good rugby in those final minutes.
 

Drew

Trevor Allan (34)
Can't agree with the second part of your suggestion for 2 reasons:
1. the sent off player will be suspended from playing anywhere from 2 weeks to life, depending on the severity of his offence.
2. why should the other 14 players (23 if you include the whole squad) and the team's fans have to be punished for one players actions.

Even more so when the ref & TMO could give the wrong decision e.g. red card rather than a yellow.
Its just bullshit when a player gets red carded very early in a game that denies the public an opportunity to enjoy a much anticipated contest.
It should be 20 minutes always & I'm hopeful this Valentini situation will change the ruling.
I’m talking deliberate, borderline illegal foul play. A team and it’s fans should suffer if someone is blatantly sticking fingers in eyes, punching people, shoving a ref, kicking someone in the head, that sort of thing. To me that’s pretty clear. If it has to be looked at more than once, it’s not blatant. I doubt anything of that nature would happen in a big time game, but weekend warriors play the same rules as the pros.
Edit: this is for the “rulings” page as that’s not what happened in the game. Sorry to sidetrack
 

The Nomad

Nicholas Shehadie (39)
From memory, the issue wasn't the kick or the decision to kick IMO, he just did it half a step too late and was grabbed from behind as he kicked. So instead of a lineout deep in Wales territory they had a much more stable platform.

That said, we still should have been good enough to keep them out from there. They played pretty good rugby in those final minutes.
Should he have kicked it though?

90 secs on the clock, if he manages to find support and a ruck is formed , the whole Welsh team minus the fullback are offside with our support players coming forward onto the ball . The game would have nearly been over by the time they were back onside.
 
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eastman

Cyril Towers (30)
From memory, the issue wasn't the kick or the decision to kick IMO, he just did it half a step too late and was grabbed from behind as he kicked. So instead of a lineout deep in Wales territory they had a much more stable platform.

That said, we still should have been good enough to keep them out from there. They played pretty good rugby in those final minutes.
He also did the exact same thing in the last play before half-time - we got an opportunity to attack on turnover ball after we disrupted their line out and Kurtley kicks away the ball downfield after finding a bit of space. He could have easily held his feet and waited for support, White could have then made the decision to continue attacking or kick for half time.
 

barbarian

Phil Kearns (64)
Staff member
Should he have kicked it though?

90 secs on the clock, if he manages to find support and a ruck is formed , the whole Welsh team minus the fullback are offside with our support players coming forward onto the ball . The game would have nearly been over by the time they were back onside.
I don't think there's a wrong answer. Each option had pros and cons. He kicks it well and it's a Wales lineout in their own 30 and they have a long way to go to get within PG range.

Yes if he held it we could have attacked, found space and/or drawn a penalty. Or we could have given away a penalty at the ruck. He didn't know how much support he had and he might have thought he was at risk of being isolated. Refs are always looking to penalise an attacking team that is trying to run out the clock, and the ref we had was coming down on the side of Wales on all the line-ball decisions.

In the end Kurtley's actions in taking the kickoff, finding space and kicking it was far from the worst thing that oculd have happened after the PG. We made Wales do a lot to beat us, and unfortunately they did.
 

Brumby Runner

Tim Horan (67)
On a bright note, was very impressed with the French contingent.

Latu- was pulled early but definitely an upgrade on FF (Folau Fainga'a) (Assuming this was a tactical decision in case we needed him back on the field).
Arnold- Great at set piece and lifted his work rate across the park
Beale- Some great touches but some errors which are in his DNA. He is best suited to the bench and can provide genuine spark
Skelton- Much more assertive this game, some good carries and an important turnover with minutes to spare, shame we couldn't D up to ice the game

Looking forward to seeing these guys + Quade/ Kerevi in the mix next year.
For the record, Latu was responsible for the first Welsh try. Two Aussie players down and Wales have a lineout about 5m out. Latu is positioned as the only defender on the sideline. Tha Welsh win the ball and form a maul with the ball at the back. The maul is stationary as the Welsh clearly have a move they want to play. Latu for reasons known only to himself joins the maul even though it is stationary leaving the blindside entirely without cover. Unsurprisingly the Welsh go down the channel left vacant, with the ball, carrier and one support player, which was probably their intention all along. First White (I think) and Tupou try to get across in cover, making a tackle on the ball carrier but just marginally unable to stop the support player scoring. If Latu remains on the wing where he should have been, that try does not get scored in that movement. What might have happened then is anybody's guess but it is conceivable that the Wallabies could have defended their line.
 
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Braveheart81

James Horwill (77)
Staff member
It was Daugunu and Tupou. White was defending in the 10 channel effectively.

In hindsight Latu shouldn't have joined but it was hardly clear cut. Wales take the ball and Aussie forward engage at the catch but Wales shift immediately to the pod at the front which has no defenders. I don't think it is crazy that Latu sees this and joins.
 

Brumby Runner

Tim Horan (67)
Should have beaten an understrength Wales. Didn't in part because we continue to do stupid things.

There are some definite brainfart merchants in our side who are slow to learn the lessons of playing up north, and unless they educate themselves, we won't build on this excellent progress we've made so far. Rodda changing his line for the chasers off the restart. Yay. Give up 3 points as soon as we had a lead and were reset to go again. Brainless.

Valetini's red was deserved, and lazy. That's the simple truth. Plenty of time to get lower and cut the Welsh bloke in half, and chose to go for the big hit instead.

Wright... I mean FFS mate you're not that talented you can continue to do dumb shit and get away with it.

Beale kicking the ball away in the last couple of minutes did not help, particularly when we had a narrow lead. At least get it to the sideline and force Wales to throw. Fucking hell, just knock it on yourself because we had them on toast at scrum time.

I've made my comments elsewhere on home broadcasters affecting the TMO; it needs to stop.

This has been a good year, and I see us growing into 2022 and 2023 with the core of this squad, some others sprinkled in, and more time.

Beat the French, Boks, Japan, and Argies. Should have beaten England, Scotland, and Wales. We're actually a lot closer to NZ than the scorelines suggest.

But we won't get those clutch wins without the top 2 inches.
I reckon after he gets over the all too familiar (to us) bias of the referees against the Wallabies, Rennie will be the right man to start getting the dumbness out of our players and their play. Despite the results of the EOYT there has been significant improvement in the talent available to the Wallabies and in the way they are now playing. Looking forward to further improvements in both over 2022 and 23.
 

Brumby Runner

Tim Horan (67)
It was Daugunu and Tupou. White was defending in the 10 channel effectively.

In hindsight Latu shouldn't have joined but it was hardly clear cut. Wales take the ball and Aussie forward engage at the catch but Wales shift immediately to the pod at the front which has no defenders. I don't think it is crazy that Latu sees this and joins.
I thought it was crazy the moment I saw it. I still reckon, andf I haven't seen a replay, that the ball was already at the back and the maul was stationary when Latu charged into it.
 

Braveheart81

James Horwill (77)
Staff member
I thought it was crazy the moment I saw it. I still reckon, andf I haven't seen a replay, that the ball was already at the back and the maul was stationary when Latu charged into it.

They had just passed the ball to that pod and no Wallabies had joined it. Latu and Arnold then join.

Several Wallabies ultimately make poor decisions.

Rodda joins the maul after the ball has already been passed out of it.
Daugunu takes the halfback and leaves the hooker unmarked outside with no one to cover when Tupou most likely had the halfback covered.

I agree that Latu made the wrong choice but I can see why he did it. Wales shifted the point of attack to the front pod where zero Wallabies were. If they'd driven the maul there we needed everyone we could trying to stop it. Those first couple of players arriving are crucial.

If you go back two weeks to the test against Scotland, their first try also came from a lineout move where they shifted the ball to the front after initially catching it deeper. Unsurprisingly, Folau Fainga'a also immediately joins onto this front pod in an attempt to try and stop the maul.
 

TSR

Mark Loane (55)
Should he have kicked it though?

90 secs on the clock, if he manages to find support and a ruck is formed , the whole Welsh team minus the fullback are offside with our support players coming forward onto the ball . The game would have nearly been over by the time they were back onside.
I’ll defend him here. If he gets the kick away the Welsh are deep in their own end and have to go length of the field. Judging in hindsight is great but I was thinking in my head ‘hoof it’. If it went out in the 22 it would’ve been our throw, right?

Anyway I was wrong and he was wrong. He should’ve held it. But there was only a bees dick in it and the Welsh guy deserves some credit for his desperation.
 

TSR

Mark Loane (55)
They had just passed the ball to that pod and no Wallabies had joined it. Latu and Arnold then join.

Several Wallabies ultimately make poor decisions.

Rodda joins the maul after the ball has already been passed out of it.
Daugunu takes the halfback and leaves the hooker unmarked outside with no one to cover when Tupou most likely had the halfback covered.

I agree that Latu made the wrong choice but I can see why he did it. Wales shifted the point of attack to the front pod where zero Wallabies were. If they'd driven the maul there we needed everyone we could trying to stop it. Those first couple of players arriving are crucial.

If you go back two weeks to the test against Scotland, their first try also came from a lineout move where they shifted the ball to the front after initially catching it deeper. Unsurprisingly, Folau Fainga'a also immediately joins onto this front pod in an attempt to try and stop the maul.
I know your countering BRs post - but even in noting the decisions as poor I thinks that’s incredibly tough. This is when we were reduced to 13. I thought the players did pretty well to react to the quick shift in focus by the Welsh from the catching pod to the front pod. Unfortunately the Welsh didn’t drive off that, they ran a play. Given how dangerous the driving maul is, the players don’t have 2 seconds to see if a play is run. The designated maul defenders have to act straight away. It was a really well worked move against a reduced defence line. If the forwards don’t commit and they drive over we’d be crucifying them for that. Likewise if Daugunu doesn’t take the first runner, he scores.

The one thing I will say is both Daugunu and Tupou could have been in trouble if the video ref had reviewed. Daugunu appears to lift above the horizontal and Tupou, whilst accidental, comes in with his knees.
 

The Nomad

Nicholas Shehadie (39)
It was a very good play off that maul set up, it went within a bees’ dick of being an obstruction. At first look I thought the second pod reconnected with the lifting pod after taking the ball . In slow mo there was a slight bobble from the catcher that saved them . Pretty much sums up the game for the Wobbs .
 
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Braveheart81

James Horwill (77)
Staff member
I know your countering BRs post - but even in noting the decisions as poor I thinks that’s incredibly tough.

They're only poor decisions in hindsight. I think they were perfectly reasonable in the moment. As you said, they have to act decisively and ultimately they took the wrong option.

It's pretty clear that a big part of that play design for it to be successful is for the defence to commit to the front pod because of the maul risk. Against a depleted defence it is even more likely to work because it needs less people to commit.

I thought the players did pretty well to react to the quick shift in focus by the Welsh from the catching pod to the front pod. Unfortunately the Welsh didn’t drive off that, they ran a play. Given how dangerous the driving maul is, the players don’t have 2 seconds to see if a play is run. The designated maul defenders have to act straight away. It was a really well worked move against a reduced defence line.

Absolutely. I guarantee BR would be also criticising Latu if they had mauled off that front pod and driven over for a try with Latu marking the blindside because "it was the obvious thing to do".
 
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barbarian

Phil Kearns (64)
Staff member
Absolutely. I guarantee BR would be also criticising Latu if they had mauled off that front pod and driven over for a try with Latu marking the blindside because "it was the obvious thing to do".

It's my favourite type of criticism on here.

Beale in the final moments drove me insane. If I were him, after catching the kick-off and making the linebreak, instead of kicking I'd step on the gas, burn off the covering defenders and dot it down in the corner. Clearly that didn't cross his mind - once again brought down by a lack of basic skills and poor decision making.
 

Pfitzy

Jason Little (69)
From memory, the issue wasn't the kick or the decision to kick IMO, he just did it half a step too late

And I've noticed that's a common theme with some of our guys - the offload a touch early or late. Which is why I'm so stupidly optimistic about guys like Paisami, Ikitau, and McDermott. Still kids, practically!

Beale can't use lack of experience as an excuse. Game of inches and all that.
 
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