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Wallabies v Italy - 9 November

Tomikin

Michael Lynagh (62)
Unless max j is at fullback, then the drop from wright to the next can be huge if kellaway has a stinker especially.
You put max at 15 and you lose a lot on the wing - tho I think piestch is pretty handy so would bring him back in.
Lose ikitau and paisami is a big step down. I’d try Filipo or be looking at who else below that’s a big body who can get some good game time next year.
Lose white and mcd and scrum half is challenged. Lose lolesio and carter and we’re way off at 10.

there’s perhaps a bit more depth in the forwards but it feels like Skelton and frost pretty key partnership.
Valetini must still be coming back to not be starting.

again we just lack depth. Marky Mark (Nawaqanitawase) (Nawaqanitawase) back will help for sure re high balls but we need centre and half depth in the backline.
Carter looked like glad he’s back and having Noah back as imperfect as I think he is will be positive for depth too
Errgghh, I'd go Jorganson at fullback till Wright (is hopefully back) but he hasn't shown too much atm.. Im just hopeful he can.. I'd go Piestch and Filipo on the wings. Potter's to rocks and dimonds for me, Tooles to small and we dont use him right. Ikitau and JAS in the centres.. probably Carter at 10... and 9 I'd start Longers .. as i think Gordan can spark a comeback and Ryan can kick 100 million times better then any of the other pricks starting...
 

Joe Blow

John Hipwell (52)
I also think we downplay how much we miss our best players. I think any test team will struggle without their genuine best 5 players not playing. Lenny, skelton, wright, JOC (James O'Connor) (James O'Connor), jorganson for example. They are not just slightly better than paisami, toole, Kellaway, Williams, Tane. They are miles ahead. The difference in quality is massive in these players.

I still think any of the top 6 teams can beat Italy without 5 or 6 of their best players because their next best players are not that far behind in quality.
The two we miss the most are Nic White and Tate. Since they have gone we have looked toothless in attack. They both dictate the speed of the game and the rhythm of our attack. Gordon has always lacked feel for the game. Lonergen has speed off the deck and promise. He should start with Gordon at 10 and take the goal kicking duties.
Of course Skelton and Ikitau are also missed. Joe just going through the motions. The extension should not have been pushed onto him.
 

Major Tom

Chilla Wilson (44)
Errgghh, I'd go Jorganson at fullback till Wright (is hopefully back) but he hasn't shown too much atm.. Im just hopeful he can.. I'd go Piestch and Filipo on the wings. Potter's to rocks and dimonds for me, Tooles to small and we dont use him right. Ikitau and JAS in the centres.. probably Carter at 10... and 9 I'd start Longers .. as i think Gordan can spark a comeback and Ryan can kick 100 million times better then any of the other pricks starting...
I’d back jorgo at fullback because we’ll need some options in case wright does his acl again and then we’re stuck with an older kellaway. Wingers we have depth.
 

Joe Blow

John Hipwell (52)
I guess he was trying to rest a few? Not sure what’s going on with Bobby V. He looks tired and disinterested. Always taking the pill standing still and trying to muscle his way forward from a standing start.
TT and Gordon the only two that came out of the game with any cred.

edit - C. Gordon
 

KOB1987

Tim Horan (67)
I guess he was trying to rest a few? Not sure what’s going on with Bobby V. He looks tired and disinterested. Always taking the pill standing still and trying to muscle his way forward from a standing start.
TT and Gordon the only two that came out of the game with any cred.

edit - C. Gordon
McReight was carrying the team a bit, much like M Hooper used to as well. Must be a core role of Aussie #7s.
 

Tomikin

Michael Lynagh (62)
I’d back jorgo at fullback because we’ll need some options in case wright does his acl again and then we’re stuck with an older kellaway. Wingers we have depth.
Yep, He ain't no Wright yet, but he has all the skill, we need that organiser and danger from our 15.. Some one that can put you on the back foot or put someone through a hole..
 

Tomikin

Michael Lynagh (62)
I guess he was trying to rest a few? Not sure what’s going on with Bobby V. He looks tired and disinterested. Always taking the pill standing still and trying to muscle his way forward from a standing start.
TT and Gordon the only two that came out of the game with any cred.

edit - C. Gordon
McReight and Hooper too... There's something up with Bobby V, he still great, but the dude just may need a break to get his calf right.. His not what he was..
 

notdeadyet

Chris McKivat (8)
What a mess. Anyone who thinks our defensive systems are fit for purpose are delusional. Giving a team that is faster than we are room to run is madness.
The forwards lost this game for us by being slow to the breakdown, even being out mauled and pushed off the ball by Italy. Frost and Williams are poor locks and Wilson seems to have lost his ability to get over the Ad line.

Carter Gordon excellent in a very poor game by us.
this, this and this ...
 

notdeadyet

Chris McKivat (8)
So we may as well go back to eddie accountability. You guys are just soft and crap. Don't see Les saying that Either.

Eddie broke the team morale, He too suffered a big run of injuries but the damage was in the the treatment of the players.

I am not saying that I agree with every selection Joe has made, but, I do think he is in the trench with the team and fighting hard to finish what has been a very very long year.

Look at the change he has been through:

1. Noah Neck
2. Lynagh
3. Porecki (retired due to repeat serious injury)
4. Wright ACL
5. Skelton (Rule 9)
6. Gleeson Injury and went overseas
7. Tizarno PCL or MCL
8. Donaldson Ulductor
9. Ikitau Gash
10. Jorgenson Flu and there was something else
11. Tate Hammi
12 Pietch Jaw
13 Slipper Retirement
14. Bobby V for much of the year.

And that is just without thinking about it. There were more. It would be over a team. And, we just don't have that much depth.

Put another way, How many of the starting 15, would have been picked over the Italian starting team. Not to many I would suggest.
PCL ? very rarely loses integrity.
the ACL ???
 

TSR

Simon Poidevin (60)
2031 by the time these cohorts are entering their prime though. Going on history we have no idea what the environment or structures are going to be by then.

05-09 had a good group come through as well and they ended up with a WC final appearance which is a decade ago now.
I think the change happened a few years ago and some of the kids have been signed to senior squad contracts for 2025 and for 2026. But will still be a bit off being established test players. Jorgenson is probably the front end of it. But then there is guys like Wilson, Ieli, De Lutiis, Martens and a raft of the NSW kids like Harvey. The very best of them will be in contention for debuts as early as next year and a few will feature in 2027. The rest are probably going to come into contention with the changing of the guard in 2028.
 

TSR

Simon Poidevin (60)
I guess he was trying to rest a few? Not sure what’s going on with Bobby V. He looks tired and disinterested. Always taking the pill standing still and trying to muscle his way forward from a standing start.
TT and Gordon the only two that came out of the game with any cred.

edit - C. Gordon
I thought Bobby V still looked off too - but then I checked the stats and he had 12 runs in the time he was on the field and he also made some strong tackles.

Maybe not as far off we think - just not good enough to turn around a generally ordinary team performance.
 

notdeadyet

Chris McKivat (8)
A couple of observations from me -
- Schmidt must regret tying himself to Fisher’s ‘connected line speed’ defence. It’s been our biggest issue and continues to be
- although our ability in the air is a close second
- early in the season our discipline was very good. Now we seem to have fallen back into old habits. We are constantly giving easy metres/points to the opposition team
- on top of that 4 kicks out on the full :( . Basic forward passes off set plays. Basically we were just kicking our selves in the nuts
- early in the year our bench was providing a step up for us. The likes of McDermott & Tizzano off the bench were a point of difference. Williams off the bench was a very different player to Williams starting. We no longer have Bell coming off the bench either. We aren’t getting that lift anymore.
- I don’t think Frost & Williams works as a starting pair.
- our best two halves this year have been White & McDermott. Gordon is a step down. If Schmidt doesn’t trust Lonergan than maybe give Thomas a go. At least he might bring some spark. But I wouldnt mind seeing Lonergan get a start
- without Ikiatau, Wright & Jorgenson the backline has lost a lot of bite. But it still doesn’t explain why we’ve reverted to such a narrow game plan
- I thought C Gordon did pretty well. Hope his quad is okay. But don’t like the idea of using Kellaway as goal kicker

Positives - McReight & Hooper both did very well. Tupou is playing his best footy for some time.

Hard balance for the next test. As much as change is needed large scale changes aren’t going to get a better result. Ikitau and Skelton to come back in - or if Skelton isn’t available play Salakai-Loto. Bring Jorgenson back. I dunno who else.
post of the thread award goes to ...
 
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