Waratahs vs Sharks. Sydney.

[rugbywhisperer]

We disagree over the red card rw but I see your point. It shows that international rugby has no balls unfortunately, and why the sanctioned cheating and foul play will continue.
And anyone calling for a penalty try based on the argument that a yellow card was awarded: give yourselves an uppercut. Follow it with another. It was a gutless joke of a decision by Marks to award the card in the first place and therefore no chance of a penalty try.

Those continuing to praise Burgess should have another look at the tape. His passing, whilst generally quicker, is still off target and the receiver generally has to reach up or stoop down to collect the pass. Sure a prime requirement for a half-back is to consistently hit the breadbasket?

I agree with you in principle Mr Chairman, but when you've got your playmakers being either the solid club man attacking the line or the import who stands 10m behind it, I reckon its a difficult job

I don't know that Intn'l rugby has no balls but it does show that locally, the ground rules have been set and there should be NO divergence.
Unfortunately the International area of the game is refereed (interpreted and adjudicated) at a different level to national. Actually, even 'National' matches do not have the 'crimes act' on which to rely - it's all in the hands of the ref and as we saw last night - some refs have no clue and are gutless. It is the hard decisions that maketh the man and Paul Marks should wear a skirt and sit down to take a piss.

 

[MajorlyRagerly]

And anyone calling for a penalty try based on the argument that a yellow card was awarded: give yourselves an uppercut. Follow it with another. It was a gutless joke of a decision by Marks to award the card in the first place and therefore no chance of a penalty try.

Not sure if you could miss the point by further, therefore suggest lining yourself one up instead.

If it's not a yellow card and Beale was actually going for the catch (an argument with merit) then it should be scrum Sharks, fine, no problems. However, as the ref has stated yellow card for a delibrate infringement preventing a try, then the next decison he must make is that would have the try definately been scored, and if so, then it's a penalty try.

It maybe 30 metres, but a if clear run in with no defenders by a player who has already demonstrated speed by scoring another try isn't a sure thing, then I don't know what is.

 

[fatprop]

I always thought that you could attempt an intercept and it was deemed a intercept attempt if the hand is moving up and not just knocking the ball down

 

[the gambler]

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that the performance wasn't that bad.

With 25mins to go they were leading by 11 points, had scored 3 tries and should have been able to kick on and score another one or two and we would have won by 20 with a bonus point and be alot happier with ourselves. However they butchered another kick off and all of a sudden it was a 4 point game and they went into close out mode and ruined everything but did manage to hold on for an important win.

Few points.

Fitness - Whether it was the trip back from S.A and altitude, or just a lack of work in pre season, the Tahs did not look fit enough. Burgess was replaced because he could not lift his legs (watch him try and retire out of the ten after a kick after about 60 mins). If it doesn't look better next week I'll be blaming Hickey.

15 vs 13. From my memory the Tahs only chose to set one scrum while playing 15 vs 13, possibly 2. I would also say that a scrum was the right option. However after 2 resets, Marks pinged TPN for an early engagement, the Sharks cleared and from the lineout scored an intercept try from a relatively quick lineout. Poor execution but not exactly poor tactics.
If you want to be pedantic you could say that the try shouldn't have been scored as the lineout should not have been allowed to happen. The Sharks players including Kank were not in the lineout and were offside for not being back 10m. If you say it was a quick lineout so they cant be offside, then the lineout should have been stopped as a different ball was used. But the Sharks were obviously trying to slow the game down and took their time getting there and had the intercept not been taken and play stopped the Tahs would be complaining about time wasting so dont actually have a problem with the decisions. But again think the tactic of trying to pick up the tempo was right, just a little unlucky in the execution.

Kicking - Still holds an important point in the game and for the first 55 mins I didnt think the Tahs kicked too badly or over excessively. There were one or two times they could/should have run with the ball but from most of the kicking duels the Tahs gained territory and often possession in better parts of the field. The last 25mins was just crap.

restarts- Very poor on our own ball, a little bit better on theirs. Mumm and Dennis both dropped balls cold and will probably blame the conditions, but at least we didnt let balls bounce like they did.

Defence A hell of a lot better this week. Hangers in particular made some great tackles, backs and forwards together took a couple of opportunities to counter ruck, Dennis made a nice pilfer in a dagerous position and generally there seemed more intent and purpose than last week. While it was ugly at times they held on for a win so thats a big positive.

Tom Carter - Was it cyclo that called him a handbrake? That has been my pet name for him for the last 5 years. Barnes set up a lovely hole for him but he was backing off as he knew he didnt have any pace. He did play better in the 2nd 40 and got over the advantage line a few times but he just doesnt have the attacking ability to be a 13 at Super 14 level. That counter attacking opportunity when he ended up throwning an inside ball to TPN(?) demonstrated that. Given all the Mowen love on this site put him at 13 ahead of Big Tom. With Carter and Anessi (also should go) in the same side the Tahs backs just dont have the pace to capitalise on any half chances created with teams prepared to let them go knowing they can chase them down. Not helped by the fact Hangers and Barnes have no pace but can get away with it being inside backs.

TPN For a man who was under an injury cloud he had a great game and played himself to a standstill. Worried he might get penalised for one of his torpedo tackles at players knees as he doesnt really use his arms, just dives at their feet. I think refs just think that if he is brave/stupid enough to do it they aren't going to penalise him.

Dennis- Didnt think he was that bad with the kick off reception and Jacobs try the exceptions. Was particularly good in the first half where he made a lovely run and offload off Burgess, pilfered a ball, tackled strongly and jumped well in the lineout. Will keep an eye on him if I watch it again but from what I saw I thought he was one of our better players.

 

[Ruggo]

The most uninspiring of coaches leads his team to the most uninspiring of performances. I noticed during the interview after the game, he had every excuse under the sun. Attitude is everything and he sets a poor example. Take the Reds for example, same cattle, different attitude.

Given some of the teams they are yet to face, they will be murdered if they don't improve.

 

[PaarlBok]

Any Aussie that keep on bagging Saffer refs should take this incident and memorise it!robbed by a home ref if you are a Guppie surporter!

 

[chief]

Any Aussie that keep on bagging Saffer refs should take this incident and memorise it!robbed by a home ref if you are a Guppie surporter!

We will just have to see what Lyndon Bray has to say about the incident

 

[Pfitzy]

If it's not a yellow card and Beale was actually going for the catch (an argument with merit) then it should be scrum Sharks, fine, no problems.

We agree. Any other decision was a travesty against rugby so talk of a penalty try is ludicrous

 

[Pfitzy]

There is one positive I'll take from this: The Tahs got themselves out of a hole when Kankowski scored. They still looked panicky as all fuck but they got back in front and managed somehow to pull it off.

 

[rugbywhisperer]

Any Aussie that keep on bagging Saffer refs should take this incident and memorise it!robbed by a home ref if you are a Guppie surporter!

Paarl - all I can say is go and consult a decent referee or better still in light of your rantings, go and do a level 1 and a level 2 referees course - God knows you need the knowledge..
You were only robbed by the fact that the Sharks couldn't put away a truly hopeless opposition.
You were lucky to get the penalty for Beale and damned lucky it wasn't a red card for the trip.

 

[spectator]

I thought the refereeing contributed to what was an all round shite night. It certainly could be argued that technically at least, Beale was going for an intercept, but that's not how it looked at first pass. Regardless, I agree with those who think the ref erred by not awarding a penalty try when he made up his mind about the yellow. And the earlier trip definitely deserved a red card!

Generally speaking I thought the Tah's got the better of crucial decisions, like the missed knock on before a Tah's try and pulling up play for a forward pass when the Sharks looked to be away.

But, as Waugh keeps saying...a win's a win.

 

[Lee Grant]

Yeah, I've just seen my recording and Beale did enough to make a tribunal of wise men say: "The case for a deliberate knock forward is not proven."

But the tribunal would have Marks' head in the noose for giving a yellow card but not awarding a penalty try. "I didn't think a try would probably have been scored, Your Honours."

"It would certainly have been scored had the pass been on target and taken - both of which were probable. Palu would never have caught Kankowski. Take him down and string him up."

 

[chief]

Okay okay okay, the Saffa TJ called Kurtley Beale for the infringement. Decision had nothing to do with Paul Marks, but maybe he may have overrulled and gone under the posts

 

[cyclopath]

Any Aussie that keep on bagging Saffer refs should take this incident and memorise it!robbed by a home ref if you are a Guppie surporter!

Rubbish. An inept performance from 1 ref does not make inept performances from other refs justified.
And no, I didn't think it warranted a penalty try as I think there was an attempt to intercept, albeit with a very low likelihood of success.

 

[the gambler]

The quality of reffing this year has seemed relatively poor to me. The quality of assistant reffing has been diabolical.

In that one match there were 2 incorrect sideline calls and 2 incorrect recommendations. Has been the case in most matches.

 

[Henry]

I've held off Carter because he can play a role in the right set up, but this isn't it. At present he is a try-butchering clueless attack handbrake on the whole team. Tonight he took it to comical proportions with the inability to run off Barnes or draw and pass. Between him and Anesi, Shmoo must be wondering if he was responsible for a genocide in a previous life.

How frustrating for Turner and Mitchell to have a 13 and 15 who seem incapable of passing...

 

[chief]

The quality of reffing this year has seemed relatively poor to me. The quality of assistant reffing has been diabolical.

In that one match there were 2 incorrect sideline calls and 2 incorrect recommendations. Has been the case in most matches.

What incidents are these?

 

[Gagger]

Even if it was a knockdown (which it clearly fucking wasn''t) I can't remember ever seeing at S14 or international level a penalty try awarded outside of the 22. This is because the convention is that you have to be pretty much falling over the line (or in a scrum motoring over it) for there to be absolutely no doubt.

If you're a saffa/sharks supporter/Tah hater, you might have wanted and needed a penalty try at that point, but it didn't make it right, even if you believe it was a knock down.

Apart from the pen & card on Beale, I actually thought Skid wasn't a disaster ref at all. At least he carded Du Plessis and Goode, and the final obstruction penalty, while ballsy in its timing, was exactly what Andre Watson had asked the refs to look at just this week.

 

[Pfitzy]

Incorrect Assistant Ref calls from this game from that one side - was it a Saffer? One report lists all-Aussie refs.

1) Incorrect call for the trip - recommendation should have been red card. Though Skid should really have over-ruled it

2) Incorrect call on Beale passing the ball back into a Sharks player who then knocked it out - though that was split-second stuff.

3) Incorrect assist on the knock-down for Beale.

 

[Ash]

This is getting silly. How about some video evidence of the Beale penalty on the front page?

In my book he lunged with his left hand and tried to stop the pass going past him. And I was cheering for the Tahs. Plenty of delusion here. Plus you add in he blatant Baxter knock on in the leadup to the Tahs try plus he rubbish call back on the forward pass by Goode and you have evidence of incorrect calls against the Sharks.

And then there's the other knock ons he called backwards and forward passes he incorrectly let go. As the commentators correctly pointed out Marks let much worse go than the Goode pass which looked flat.

It was a rubbish performance by Marks.

I really want to look through the history on the complete lack of complaint here when Hynes I think it was kncocked up a ball 5m out from his tyline vs the Force a few years back an got carded. Went a hell of a lot more upwards than Beale's did.