NSW AAGPS 2017

[Azzuri]

Ten games of Rugby for the majority of opens players (14 + games for the rep players) is hardly a big ask IMO. Especially when you consider that many of these lads would have been playing two games of rugby a weekend up to the age of 16 before their big bad Rugby masters and conflicting game times restricted opens players playing club and opens School Rugby.

I'm sure many opens players go on to colts after school where there are a minimum of 18 games a season plus four if they are lucky enough to make finals. So why would you want to limit exposure to the sort of competition that will help prepare their bodies for the serious leap into colts footy and in some cases Grade.

Injuries in our sport are unfortunately unavoidable and inevitable and have ended many a promising career. Limiting the number of games must certainly have a statistical impact on limiting the risk of season/career ending injury but in doing so aren't we also going to limit the exposure to the sort of hard competition the lads will need to help ease the transition to post school Rugby?

Soon we will be down to four games a year because it's been discovered that Schoolboy Rugby is responsible for world hunger and child poverty ..... and by 2025 the referees will be joined on the field by a distinguished gentleman with a handlebar moustache, wearing a top hat and walking briskly ahead of attacking players waving a red flag and ringing his big brass bell warning the defending team of an impending collision...

To quote the introduction of a well known TV series from the early 1960's

...."There is a fifth dimension beyond that which is known to man. It is a dimension as vast as space and as timeless as infinity. It is the middle ground between light and shadow, between science and superstition, and it lies between the pit of man's fears and the summit of his knowledge. This is the dimension of limited imagination. It is an area which we call the Nanny Zone.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Ten games of Rugby for the majority of opens players (14 + games for the rep players) is hardly a big ask IMO. Especially when you consider that many of these lads would have been playing two games of rugby a weekend up to the age of 16 before their big bad Rugby masters and conflicting game times restricted opens players playing club and opens School Rugby.

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I am sure you've seen the attrition rate just as I have.
I reckon these been a massive increase in injuries since they doubled the competition season.
That doesn't prove cause and effect but its not a bad start.
Your point about Colts is well made and, IMO, is a not insignificant reason why many schoolboy stars do not go on to be adult stars: its a bloody long season with no breaks for holidays, 21sts, weddings, long weekends, rain (well maybe these days), disinterest, etc etc.

 

[Quick Hands]

To be fair to Joeys they do have the most logistical problems as they have the largest number of teams. Organising opponents and then getting teams to those fixtures must be an organisational nightmare for the SJC rugby master, although it's sad to read they won't/don't want to go to Armidale. The thirds comp these last few years has been competitive and riveting.

Everyone has logistical issues - Joeys actually have a considerable advatage having most of their players living on site, which makes organising training, meetings, filling late withdrawal and communication much easier.

Everyone has unmatched fixtures, but these changes won't reduce the number of unmatched fixtures for Joeys - they will still have more teams than anyone else, so they'll have to organise/have organised for them the same number of unmatched fixtures no matter what the format.

Surely the rugby master isn't the person organising buses and/or meals for boarders at sport? Wouldn't there be at least one staff member (non-teaching) employed for such admistrative tasks.

 

[Quick Hands]

Ten games of Rugby for the majority of opens players (14 + games for the rep players) is hardly a big ask IMO.

Although a one round format is hardly a novelty. Rugby was a one round competition for well over a hundred years.

 

[Quick Hands]

I think your edit must be right, although there might be the odd ad hoc game when the New 3rd team (if and for as long as there is one) might need to find a comparable opponent which might be grammar/high's 2nd team.
If this is the model then it bears even less relationship to the traditional AAGPS comp of the White Australia Policy era and is opening the door to combining with CAS - just as happens in non traditional sports.
So something good may yet come of it.

It's a really poor decision by Newington IMO. IIRC they had 5 open teams this year, and while their 3rds weren't particularly strong, they didn't finish last and player safety doesn't seem to have been a consideration.

It would seem that they just prefer to play ther 3rds in 4ths - incredibly shortsighted and hardly in the spirit of rugby.

 

[Azzuri]

Although a one round format is hardly a novelty. Rugby was a one round competition for well over a hundred years.

True, but how many games did they play in that one round?

 

[Quick Hands]

True, but how many games did they play in that one round?

Seven.

 

[Troy Dickson]

Seven.

Train all off season and then to play 1 round = 7 games for no grand final ..... bahahah .... what are the kids suppose to do in the spare time? Go play on the play-station or stalk people on facebook ?? Playing rugby is an opportunity to release the energy and to get away from the class room. Reducing the number of games is a joke, but maybe work to the advantage for some of the talent to go play rugby league in harold matthews or SG Ball comps.

 

[Quick Hands]

Train all off season and then to play 1 round = 7 games for no grand final ... bahahah .. what are the kids suppose to do in the spare time?

Possibly the same sort of things that they've done for the past 120 years?

 

[formerflanker]

Train all off season and then to play 1 round = 7 games for no grand final ... bahahah .. what are the kids suppose to do in the spare time? Go play on the play-station or stalk people on facebook ?? Playing rugby is an opportunity to release the energy and to get away from the class room. Reducing the number of games is a joke, but maybe work to the advantage for some of the talent to go play rugby league in harold matthews or SG Ball comps.

If I remember correctly, the introduction of the 2-round system was facilitated by having fewer trial matches. The total number of games in a season remained the same, but with fewer term-time trials and more competition games.
I don't think the athletics season was ever lengthened or shortened, just moved.
Don't forget that sitting behind all this is the ARU and its discussions with 150 rugby playing schools. Do I detect an invisble hand here?
One option for the ARU now is to intervene in private school rugby and organise a wider range of matches.
They could convert what was the first round into an inter-schools competition between ARU-selected, like strength schools drawn from all associations. I guess there would be 3 competition categories, each with its own Cup. During this 5 weeks the Waratah Shield could be run on Wednesdays, open to all comers.
The second half of the season sees the traditional GPS, CAS, CIS competitions take place for one round.
Advantages:
Solves the problem of a long trials period which will occur with only 6 GPS schools playing 1sts.
Answers the problem of giving the players enough quality games per season to improve their skills and maintain motivation.
Pits CAS schools against GPS against CIS and if done correctly will see a greater probability of an even competition.
Exposes players to a wider set of opponents, grounds, and rugby cultures.

Now if I could only work on a plan to explode the rugby playing numbers in the west......

 

[formerflanker]

Train all off season and then to play 1 round = 7 games for no grand final ... bahahah .. what are the kids suppose to do in the spare time? Go play on the play-station or stalk people on facebook ?? Playing rugby is an opportunity to release the energy and to get away from the class room. Reducing the number of games is a joke, but maybe work to the advantage for some of the talent to go play rugby league in harold matthews or SG Ball comps.

You will find that the build up to each match in the old 1-round system was the equivalent of a grand final build up. The intensity of training and mental preparation was huge; I don't think that level of focus could be maintained over a 10 match season.
That being said, time on the paddock under pressure is a vital part of the learning process. Minimising competition games will weaken the players' ability to cope with the realities of rugby after they finish school.

PS: 1 GPS round will be 5 games not 7, making your point even more valid.

 

[The Honey Badger]

Given that the boys at Champs play 4 games in 8 days, you would hope that GPS play more than 5 games in a season.

I can only presume that they are progressing towards the plan to play a second round vs CAS, Surely Wavery cant hold out if that is the will of 13 other schools.

 

[sidelineview]

Given that the boys at Champs play 4 games in 8 days, you would hope that GPS play more than 5 games in a season.

I can only presume that they are progressing towards the plan to play a second round vs CAS, Surely Wavery cant hold out if that is the will of 13 other schools.

What makes you believe Waverley is standing in the way of a proposed expanded comp?
A 2nd-round comp involving GPS. CAS. CIS schools might work but it would need to be graded fairly.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Train all off season and then to play 1 round = 7 games for no grand final ... bahahah .. what are the kids suppose to do in the spare time? Go play on the play-station or stalk people on facebook ?? Playing rugby is an opportunity to release the energy and to get away from the class room. Reducing the number of games is a joke, but maybe work to the advantage for some of the talent to go play rugby league in harold matthews or SG Ball comps.

(a) KIDS should not play 1 sport year round even if it is the exalted game of rugby;
(b) they should play a summer sport as they have for 120 years until the marketing departments decided that inventing a rugby pedigree would fill the roll book;
(c) talent is not a prerequisite to playing league, to my observation - unless the ability to run straight at 3 men with the ball tucked under one arm is considered a talent;

 

[Inside Shoulder]

They could convert what was the first round into an inter-schools competition between ARU-selected, like strength schools drawn from all associations. I guess there would be 3 competition categories, each with its own Cup. During this 5 weeks the Waratah Shield could be run on Wednesdays, open to all comers.

You are nothing if not optimistic in thinking that the ARU could even come up with this plan let alone execute it.

 

[sidelineview]

(a) KIDS should not play 1 sport year round even if it is the exalted game of rugby;
(b) they should play a summer sport as they have for 120 years until the marketing departments decided that inventing a rugby pedigree would fill the roll book;
(c) talent is not a prerequisite to playing league, to my observation - unless the ability to run straight at 3 men with the ball tucked under one arm is considered a talent;

Kids should play a summer sport but the older boys focussed on rugby can opt to participate in a strength and fitness programme over summer. I assume most schools provide for that.

I see you're a one-eyed rugby fan. Anyone who has played league understands the high skill level required to play the game. In fact, boys who have a grounding in league and then play rugby are often more skillful and better tacklers.

 

[I like to watch]

^^^^ that used to be the case,until they stopped coaching tackling & started to teach them to 'catch'.
I've never seen so many hapless defenders as current NRL players.
I see so many guys trundling to the line 10 out,and scoring with 3 or 4 defenders clinging to him.
And,now that Rugby gym programs have caught up,there is nothing to be learnt from the other code,unless you have a desire for the fine arts of tattooing

 

[sidelineview]

^^^^ that used to be the case,until they stopped coaching tackling & started to teach them to 'catch'.
I've never seen so many hapless defenders as current NRL players.
I see so many guys trundling to the line 10 out,and scoring with 3 or 4 defenders clinging to him.
And,now that Rugby gym programs have caught up,there is nothing to be learnt from the other code,unless you have a desire for the fine arts of tattooing

Cynicism, bias and negativity at its best .... basic skills in catching, passing and tackling are being coached by good league coaches in junior league, and the results are seen on the rugby field in the various school age groups.
I see it first hand but maybe you're not exposed to it but are lead by what you perceive to be true instead.

 

[I like to watch]

I've had kids do both codes for many many years.
The more serious/ higher level coaches in league actually coach kids not to pass!
Rep coaches with the philosophy that some kids are literally not permitted to pass the ball under any circumstances.
Players that are criticised for passing the ball to an unmarked player because they were in their own 22.
I could go on & on.
It's not bias without any direct experience , I've seen it close up and I just don't rate it.

 

[Quick Hands]

You are nothing if not optimistic in thinking that the ARU could even come up with this plan let alone execute it.

As a parent, I don't want the ARU involved in my son's education at all.

I find it quite interesting that some posters on this thread seem to think that the involvement of the ARU will solve perceived problems in GPS rugby.

Have any of them stopped a moment to think - the GPS cricket is perfectly fine without being run by cricket Australia, GPS basketball thrives without being run by Basketball Australia, GPS soccer grows every year without FFA running it, GPS water polo also grows every year but has no involvment from Water Polo Australia. So I ask these people, why is it necessary for the ARU to stick their bibs into GPS rugby? It's not as if they're doing such a great job running their own club based juniors. In fact, I'd suggest that even with it's shortcomings school based rugby is run infinitely better than the club based rugby which falls under the ARU umbrella. A point which wouldn't be lost on anyone who has had kids involved in Sydney juniors or anyone who has taken even a passing interest in the train wreck which is the Aust 20s programme.

And again I make the point, it's only rugby where the schools are more efficient than the governing body in doing anything.