Reds vs Waratahs - 29th April RD 10

[TOCC]

You can run through every game and finds hundreds of things a ref missed from either side

If that's true then there's serious bloody issues with the game

 

[fatprop]

If that's true then there's serious bloody issues with the game

Nah, there will be always something being missed or ignored to keep a game flowing. Every scrum can be an issue

 

[TOCC]

Nah, there will be always something being missed or ignored to keep a game flowing. Every scrum can be an issue

If like you say, there's hundreds of things been missed or open to interpretation then there's an issue, and it only seeks to reinforce the opinion that refs are susceptible to premeditated bias or home crowd persuasion, neither of which are in the spirit of the game

 

[upthereds#!]

There were 3 Wallabies locks on the pitch last night, yet a 20yr old with 4 Super Rugby caps played better then all of them

I like to think Rodda would have been hot on Tuis heels had he started also. Fantastic to see the young locks of Australia putting real pressure upwards. Coleman and Arnold did it fantastically last year, and Rodda, Tui, Rhp and even Richie Arnold are doing it again. Think we are well placed in that department for 2019 and 2023.

 

[WTF?]

I don't remember the ref lining up to kick penalty goals and converting tried for the Reds? Cooper missed 5 points in kicks which would have won them the game. Don't blame the ref that you didn't score enough points, the opportunities were there.


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[TOCC]

Players are held accountable for their mistakes and actions, if all the team is doing it then the coaches are held accountable... so why aren't the referees held to the same level of accountability when their actions and mistakes have equal, if not more influence on the game then that of the players.

I'm not blaming the ref for this match, that doesn't mean he wasn't below standard, take your blinkers off and look past this game and tel me the standard or officiating this year has been up to standard!

 

[TOCC]

I like to think Rodda would have been hot on Tuis heels had he started also. Fantastic to see the young locks of Australia putting real pressure upwards. Coleman and Arnold did it fantastically last year, and Rodda, Tui, Rhp and even Richie Arnold are doing it again. Think we are well placed in that department for 2019 and 2023.

It's the best crop of locks Australia has had coming through in over a decade IMO

 

[cyclopath]

If like you say, there's hundreds of things been missed or open to interpretation then there's an issue, and it only seeks to reinforce the opinion that refs are susceptible to premeditated bias or home crowd persuasion, neither of which are in the spirit of the game

I don't see how your first statement reinforces the second at all.

 

[cyclopath]

It's the best crop of locks Australia has had coming through in over a decade IMO

It's very encouraging. Hopefully we will have some good choices in years to come, provided the "second string" don't go OS!!

 

[TOCC]

I don't see how your first statement reinforces the second at all.

Simply If things aren't clear, if the rules don't clearly stipulate or World Rugby hasn't clearly defined, then they are open to interpretation...and interpretation can be influenced by external variables..

The larger the number of subjective situations, the greater the probability of interpretation becoming the deciding factor. mistakes will always happens, it's human nature, but it's about reducing the opportunity for those mistakes to occurr.

Not only that, the whistle is getting blown far too often throughout the match, is it over officiating or negative tactics/poor execution by the teams? In either case, there needs to be an assessment on how to change this... I don't watch sport for the ref to take centre stage, he should be a voice in the background.

 

[cyclopath]

I'll agree to disagree - can't see how one really relates to the other.

 

[wamberal]

If that's true then there's serious bloody issues with the game

I have tried to convert a couple of my neighbours. One in particular, he is a former professional league player.


Apart from the obvious complexities of the game, the other gripes he had were that the ball is not put straight into the scrum (and it is not, even though we have bagged the leaguies for years about their "scrums"), and it is not thrown straight into the lineouts.

 

[TOCC]

I'd love to see the figures for time of ball in play and compare it to 10 years or 15 years ago

 

[Brumby Runner]

The ref didn't win the game for the Tahs; Quade actually lost it for the Reds with a very sub-par effort in the second half. Mistake and poor decision after mistake and poor decision.

But that should not excuse the ref from critical examination. Consistency has to be the watchword. In this game, two lineout infractions by the Tahs early in the game went unnoticed by the ref, and the Tahs' scrum is up to its old tricks again of collapsing as soon as the ball is past the front rowers' feet so that they can't be pushed backwards. The Reds were penalised later for the same lineout issue that the Tahs were allowed to get away with, and the Reds' scrum was penalised a few times for collapsing in the front row when the Tahs weren't.

This is my take on the inconsistency shown by the ref last night. I agree with TOCC and others in saying the refs have to be held more publicly accountable or we'll never see them not having undue influence on a game from time to time.

 

[RedsHappy]

Most people don't have the time or inclination to painstakingly watch a whole game freeze-frame by freeze-frame and code it all objectively. From experience, it takes ages. And ultimately, people will still pick selective pieces that piss them off the most and keep throwing them at you. Can be thankless.
I posted it last night here and on Twitter, and watching again has not changed my mind - I thought the Reds played more of the "better" attacking footy, and their defence was more aggressive and forced the higher number of Waratah errors. But it was lost with the loose, and mainly avoidable penalties in the latter stages, from which the Waratahs took full toll, points-wise. Really was a game that could have gone either way, and I couldn't say one served it more than the other.

Of course Cyclo I did not contemplate in making these remarks re in-depth ref performance analysis that people would have the time or inclination to do as I set forth above.

Rather that, if one was truly concerned re ref bias, seriously poor reffing by X ref etc, this methodology was the only accurate way to get to the whole truth of such matters and to verify an initial largely fragmentary and intuitive conclusion.

 

[ChargerWA]

I have tried to convert a couple of my neighbours. One in particular, he is a former professional league player.


Apart from the obvious complexities of the game, the other gripes he had were that the ball is not put straight into the scrum (and it is not, even though we have bagged the leaguies for years about their "scrums"), and it is not thrown straight into the lineouts.

Scrums have changed too much to have straight feeds. There is so much pressure now that if the ball goes in straight it is a 50/50. The idea is the scrum feed is supposed to advantage the team that has it. Its why World Rugby quietly abandoned the straight feed directive after a few months last year. It wasn't working.

 

[Strewthcobber]

I'd love to see the figures for time of ball in play and compare it to 10 years or 15 years ago

WR (World Rugby) do the stats on World Cups.

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[TOCC]

Good find, although i was more referring to Super Rugby

 

[wamberal]

Scrums have changed too much to have straight feeds. There is so much pressure now that if the ball goes in straight it is a 50/50. The idea is the scrum feed is supposed to advantage the team that has it. Its why World Rugby quietly abandoned the straight feed directive after a few months last year. It wasn't working.

Yep, I understand that, and it is a good thing as far as it goes. I was simply pointing out the the unaligned potential supporter has a lot to digest. Some of it is just bloody difficult to grapple with.

 

[wamberal]

WR (World Rugby) do the stats on World Cups.

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And which ones would we prefer to watch, I wonder? The most interesting single thing for me is the doubling of the incidence of rucks and mauls.