Waratahs v Jaguares, Round 16 - Saturday 8 July, Allianz Stadium

[Brumby Runner]

On average 50% of a game is defense you need to be able to adequately fulfill the defensive responsibilities of your position. It's a particular problem in Australia we only ever look at a players attacking ability, hence why when end up with the issue of Bernard Foley, Quade Cooper and others.

All you need to do is go look at the Australian Schools Championship thread plenty of players praised for their attacking ability, nothing on defense or off the ball work.

You are right KP but it doesn't only apply at schoolboys level. Matt To'omua was the bast defensive No 10 in the country for years and hardly got a look in by any of the national coaches. Had he had an extended time in the Wallabies, he possibly would have still gone o/s to be with Elise but just maybe a few other prospective No 10s around the country might have tried to emulate him in defense if they thought it might enhance their chances of playing at higher levels.

 

[RedsHappy]

This is a quote from the planetrugby review of the ponies/Reds game but I think it is apt for this game as well

"There has been plenty of criticism aimed at the standard of play delivered by Australian teams during this year's tournament and judging from this encouter that criticism is justified."

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

Very slow learners over there.

 

[KOB1987]

Is 5 pages a record low for a Tahs match thread?

 

[Froggy]

This is looking like the worst Tahs side I have ever seen! Looking at this game a bit analytically, rather than just saying 'everything was shit (which would be justified)' the main things that stuck out for me were:
* Defence close to the breakdown was non-existent
* Defence was passive, no dominant tackles, which allows the offloads
* Passing was woeful, particularly in the centres (Horwitz & Horne) who theoretically should be the best
* No-one making the effort to back-up a break or, if you can't get there quick enough, at least be at the tackle to protect the ball. This happened with breaks by Kepu, Fitzpatrick, Nayarovaro and Clarke. When Nayarovaro was caught, Hanigan was on his own in the breakdown against about 4 Jaguares, with Mumm & Wells about 5 metres away with their hands on their hips watching!
There were plenty more problems,but those immediately come to mind for me.

 

[Froggy]

Looking at individuals, we have problems aplenty.
Mumm and Horne won't be missed, they've lost their enthusiasm for the game. Ryan, McDulling, Wells, Toleafoa, Ta'avao, R Robinson and Hegarty are just not up to Super rugby standard.
But the most disappointing thing is that a range of exciting young prospects, most of whom made debuts in Super rugby last year and showed a mountain of promise in the NRC, have just not progressed. In fact, with the exception of Hanigan and Latu, they've gone backwards. I'm thinking of Robertson, Holloway, Dempsey, Gordon, Horwitz, Simone, Kellaway and Jones.
This has to be at the coach's feet. The trouble is, I don't see a ready replacement. For that reason only, Gibson probably gets another season, but he has to be on notice.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Is 5 pages a record low for a Tahs match thread?

For the time being

 

[GTPIH]

Any of you who put yourself through watching this game deserve a medal. Just flicking through these pages is enough.

It's about this time that Wamberal will tell us that this disaster has nothing to do with the NSWRU

I actually attended the game. Where do I collect my medal?

I'm a stadium member and was at the Swans, and since I was next door thought I'd wander over. They had the Lions Test on the big screens prior to the game. As I was entering, I saw several groups leaving since the Test was over, and organising the rest of their evening. I should've joined them. Their plans sounded much more exciting.

 

[p.Tah]

I actually attended the game.

I was wondering who that other person was. I probably should have said hi

 

[wamberal]

It's about this time that Wamberal will tell us that this disaster has nothing to do with the NSWRU

Just for the record, I have never defended the NSWRU. I have simply pointed out the stupidity of blaming the ARU for all the game's problems.


And also for the record, I did switch over to watch the game after we finished watching the Loins Test on replay. Just in time to see the Hanigan incident.


Again, and again, and again. FFS, it was pretty obvious what happened. Penalise it and move on. And as for the Argie writhing around in a good imitation of Diego Maradona trying to milk a penalty, I would love to see the referee giving him a card for something or other. Unsportsmanlike conduct, conduct likely to bring the game into disrepute. Time wasting. Any bloody thing.


I then switched off.


As for blaming anybody for that particular idiocy, enlighten me, what on earth does it have to do with the ARU, the NSWRU, or Daryl Gibson? I am sure you can find a way.


That is exactly the sort of thing that turns people off in droves.

 

[W-TARED]

A

Looking at individuals, we have problems aplenty.

Mumm and Horne won't be missed, they've lost their enthusiasm for the game. Ryan, McDulling, Wells, Toleafoa, Ta'avao, R Robinson and Hegarty are just not up to Super rugby standard.

But the most disappointing thing is that a range of exciting young prospects, most of whom made debuts in Super rugby last year and showed a mountain of promise in the NRC, have just not progressed. In fact, with the exception of Hanigan and Latu, they've gone backwards. I'm thinking of Robertson, Holloway, Dempsey, Gordon, Horwitz, Simone, Kellaway and Jones.

This has to be at the coach's feet. The trouble is, I don't see a ready replacement. For that reason only, Gibson probably gets another season, but he has to be on notice.

Although I've lost a lot of faith in Gibson as a coach and his ability to create a team, surly he can't be responsible for recruitment or "pathways'' which appears to be a complete shambles, what backroom bunny is in charge there?

 

[Inside Shoulder]

A




Although I've lost a lot of faith in Gibson as a coach and his ability to create a team, surly he can't be responsible for recruitment or "pathways'' which appears to be a complete shambles, what backroom bunny is in charge there?

Didn't he stick his nose into that recently?
He wants to remove the EPS and make U20s U 19s.

 

[Gnostic]

Looking at individuals, we have problems aplenty.

Mumm and Horne won't be missed, they've lost their enthusiasm for the game. Ryan, McDulling, Wells, Toleafoa, Ta'avao, R Robinson and Hegarty are just not up to Super rugby standard.

But the most disappointing thing is that a range of exciting young prospects, most of whom made debuts in Super rugby last year and showed a mountain of promise in the NRC, have just not progressed. In fact, with the exception of Hanigan and Latu, they've gone backwards. I'm thinking of Robertson, Holloway, Dempsey, Gordon, Horwitz, Simone, Kellaway and Jones.

This has to be at the coach's feet. The trouble is, I don't see a ready replacement. For that reason only, Gibson probably gets another season, but he has to be on notice.

How can they progress? Are they playing and refining those skills against players at the same level as they are? That level is club level. The NRC is not a development competition I have been told here, and it is not seriously designed to be one with so few games and the coaches having very little time to concentrate on skill development. How do they progress at Super Level when they are getting flogged and shown up by players who may well be their age but have been playing men for at least a year or two in real development competitions. I have no doubt these blokes are the best innately talented players out there, but they are not being developed. AND that Wamberal is where the ARU and NSWRU and all the RUs have abjectly failed since professionalism, but I don't expect you to see that, its so obviously more to do with the rules isn't it.

The best example out there for under performance is in the two of the first choice Wallabies in the backline Folau and Foley. Neither can kick effectively for their position to really be classed as a test class player for their position. At no stage did any clearance kick find touch outside the 40M. Most of the time the kicks did not even seek touch. So they can score a couple of tries against the Jaguares. Whopee. How much work was done off the ball? How have these "elite" best in Australia players improved in their deficient areas since they came on the scene? Zero, zip, nil..... Foley still misses touch from penalties every other game, his kicking is still weak from hand. Folau still cannot kick effectively and just appears fundamentally lazy in a lazy side.

 

[Teh Other Dave]

The best example out there for under performance is in the two of the first choice Wallabies in the backline Folau and Foley. Neither can kick effectively for their position to really be classed as a test class player for their position. At no stage did any clearance kick find touch outside the 40M. Most of the time the kicks did not even seek touch. So they can score a couple of tries against the Jaguares. Whopee. How much work was done off the ball? How have these "elite" best in Australia players improved in their deficient areas since they came on the scene? Zero, zip, nil... Foley still misses touch from penalties every other game, his kicking is still weak from hand. Folau still cannot kick effectively and just appears fundamentally lazy in a lazy side.

FUCK! FINALLY! Someone recognises the most glaring deficiencies in the national game! Manifested in what is meant to be our most talented state squad.

Our in field kicking is atrocious. To be able to argue that Quade Cooper's kicking in general play is better than the test team's 10 and 15 should be sounding alarm bells.

And as for the work off the ball, that's how the Jaguares won last night. They played athletic, powerful, high risk rugby, that tested NSW's fitness and defensive patterns... and they put 40 on them. Even simple shit like re-alignment looked like NSW circa 1992 - you know, when guys like Marty Roebuck had to run a Physiotherapy Practice, and Rob Egerton was teaching biology.

Oddly enough, these two attributes are the most important attributes of aussie rules (aside from maybe contested possessions and disposals). I wonder if we could poach someone like Michael Voss or Ben Cousins Jason Akermanis Gavin Wanganeen to provide some left field skills coaching.

 

[fatprop]

Don't the swans train in the same area? You would think it wouldn't be hard to do some cross training

 

[p.Tah]

Or perhaps Mick Byrne?

 

[wamberal]

FUCK! FINALLY! Someone recognises the most glaring deficiencies in the national game! Manifested in what is meant to be our most talented state squad.

Our in field kicking is atrocious.

Finally? Some of us have been bleating about the quality of our kicking for a very long time. Modesty forbids, etc etc.

 

[Joe Blow]

So does Gibson

Thats the bottom line. Cheika had them in pretty good shape before handing off the reins. We really need to find some decent Australian coaching talent from within Australia or abroad, most likely the latter, to take over the Tahs and bring them back.
God I wish Link was still in the picture or could be persuaded to return. There are others though that are doing well and may be convinced to return. We have Larkham going to the Wallabies full time soon and we will have another less experienced bloke running the Brumbies as well, albeit with some experience around him.

 

[Braveheart81]

Half of the Tahs defensive problems come down to mental aptitude and concentration in my opinion.

Two tries were the direct result of the first pillar at the ruck (Mumm then Hanigan) not paying attention and being sold the simplest of dummies which resulted in tries. It happened a third time almost resulting in a try as well.

These things have nothing to do with coaching. The player is there, they know what they are meant to be doing and then they lose concentration at a critical time and fail to do their job.

That was very poor by the Waratahs. Their general aptitude this season has been dire.

 

[Quick Hands]

Half of the Tahs defensive problems come down to mental aptitude and concentration in my opinion.

Two tries were the direct result of the first pillar at the ruck (Mumm then Hanigan) not paying attention and being sold the simplest of dummies which resulted in tries. It happened a third time almost resulting in a try as well.

These things have nothing to do with coaching. The player is there, they know what they are meant to be doing and then they lose concentration at a critical time and fail to do their job.

That was very poor by the Waratahs. Their general aptitude this season has been dire.

I have to disagree. You play how you train. All the things you speak of suggests that their training isn't preparing them properly.

 

[fatprop]

I do think the dive was great acting

http://www.theroar.tv/ned-hanigan-made-to-look-like-a-good-fighter-by-diving-player/