2014 – ITM CUP - NZ's 3rd Tier Competition

[Inside Shoulder]

Tell me, desperate Kiwis, is the ITM of a lower standard this year or have I acclimatised to the pace?
(should I make a comeback?)

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

Tell me, desperate Kiwis, is the ITM of a lower standard this year or have I acclimatised to the pace?
(should I make a comeback?)

IMO there's no comparison between ITM & the old NPC in which every fit AB played, often twice a week & within days of a Test. In saying that the comp still fulfils its purpose in terms of identifying players of Super Rugby & potentially AB standard.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

IMO there's no comparison between ITM & the old NPC in which every fit AB played, often twice a week & within days of a Test. In saying that the comp still fulfils its purpose in terms of identifying players of Super Rugby & potentially AB standard.

How many "ABs" don't play? (Is it only the match day 23 (when the ABs are in NZ), is it the wider squad or what?)
My recollection is that it seemed stronger even last year - I assume that the numbers of ABs playing has not changed since then?

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

Extreme example I know, but we've gone from this:

September 14, 1985
Auckland 28 Canterbury 23

Auckland: Lindsay Harris, John Kirwan, Joe Stanley, Terry Wright, Kurt Sherlock, Grant Fox, David Kirk, Glenn Rich, Mark Brooke-Cowden, Gary Whetton, Andy Haden (c), Alan Whetton, John Drake, Iain Abercrombie, Steve McDowell.

Canterbury: Robbie Deans, Dennis Woods, Victor Simpson, Craig Green, Warwick Taylor, Wayne Smith, Bruce Deans, Dale Atkins, Don Hayes (c), Albert Anderson, Andy Earl, Jock Hobbs, Chris Earl, John Buchan, Murray Davie.

(22 AB in the starting 15's)

And this (can't locate team lists but you'll get the gist):

"Wellington played Manawatu in the most important NPC match of 1981 the day after the infamous ‘flour bomb’ test against South Africa at Eden Park. Four Wellington players and five from Manawatu had taken part in the test and all played the next day at Athletic Park."

To this:

August 16, 2014
Canterbury 48 Auckland 9

Auckland: 15 Hadleigh Parkes, 14 Lolagi Visinia, 13 George Moala, 12 Francis Saili, 11 Charles Piutau, 10 Gareth Anscombe, 9 Junior Poluleuligaga, 8 Peter Saili, 7Sean Polwart, 6 Joe Edwards, 5 Jack Whetton, 4 Liaki Moli,3 Ofa Tu'ungafasi, 2 Tom McCartney, 1 Sam Prattley.

Canterbury: 15 Richie Mo'unga, 14 Patrick Osborne, 13 Adam Whitelock, 12 Tom Taylor, 11 Johnny McNicholl, 10 Tyler Bleyendaal, 9 Willi Heinz (c), 8 Luke Whitelock, 7 Jed Brown, 6 Matt Todd, 5 Scott Barrett, 4 Joel Everson, 3 Nepo Laulala, 2 Codie Taylor, 1 Alex Hodgman.

(4, of whom only Todd is even close to being a regular).

Remember also that Dan Carter's half-game v Southland was his first appearance for Canty in 5 years.

 

[Dan54]

Tell me, desperate Kiwis, is the ITM of a lower standard this year or have I acclimatised to the pace?
(should I make a comeback?)

Not sure about lower standard IS, maybe down a little bit, but do think for some reason a lot of teams are younger than usual this year, that could be reason. Look at Waikato for instance, seems like there backline are all only 1-2 years out of secondary school, same as Manawatu, running a couple of 20 year old 10s etc. Still think the skill level shown by the players is really high, and I talking about the passing skills in particular. Lol so all in all I not sure if it is down but after watching the Tangwha last night, I was actually comenting to son that it was a game I would use as training tool for anyone in how to play the complete team game, where everyone supports each other and seems to always trust that there will always be someone on shoulder.
Haven't really answered your question have I mate, just got carried away with how much I love it!!

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Not sure about lower standard IS, maybe down a little bit, but do think for some reason a lot of teams are younger than usual this year, that could be reason. Look at Waikato for instance, seems like there backline are all only 1-2 years out of secondary school, same as Manawatu, running a couple of 20 year old 10s etc. Still think the skill level shown by the players is really high, and I talking about the passing skills in particular. Lol so all in all I not sure if it is down but after watching the Tangwha last night, I was actually comenting to son that it was a game I would use as training tool for anyone in how to play the complete team game, where everyone supports each other and seems to always trust that there will always be someone on shoulder.
Haven't really answered your question have I mate, just got carried away with how much I love it!!

No - i think you have. I don't watch as much of it as when it first came on our TVs or when I have been over there so I am interested in what the aficionados think.
It may be that the defence does not seem as good.

 

[Dan54]

Probably right about defence IS, once again this maybe because there seems to be a lot of younger players, or perhaps teams are just stretching them more this year by running more. I do think with the workload of playing up to 3 games in a week, the teams are certainly not training as much, some teams won't sneak a proper session in some weeks, they perhaps don't get the time to try and cancel out opposition teams strengths during the week. As we all know defence is one of the easiest things to fix, if you have time!

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Jimmy Cowan is a first class pest that plays the yappy cheating runt halfback role so well. You just want to thump him.

Canterbury vs Tasman in Premiership and he manages to get into a frank and fearless discussion on handbag selection with 5 other Canterbury players.

It's oranges and 2nd placed (equal on points) Tasman are up 14 - 3 against 3rd placed Canterbury. Go Makos.

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

Foxtel has decided to come back up just in time for me to tune into Cantab Horrorshow III, I know Tasman are a good side but wtf? 10-24 & only 14 to go, gonna take a miracle.

Earlier, Counties 24-10 v Souhland & BOP 33-16 v Otago, not a good day for the deep South. Or the mid South by the look of things.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/provincial/10580528/Counties-bag-bonus-point-win-over-Stags

http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/provincial/10580780/Bay-of-Plenty-too-strong-at-home-for-Otago

Mighty 'nua triumphant again, 23-11 v S Canty it'll be on for young & old @ FatBoys around about now.......... Still 6 teams in contention for the top 4 & we've got Pov Bay in Gizzy next week so still not home & hosed by any means.

FFS Cantabs miss touch from a penalty. Game over, esp as Marty Banks has just gone & nabbed an intercept try.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

There is a bit of talk about Blazer games and 50 games etc from the commentators.

Do the NZ provinces just play ITM Cup games (only about 9 each year) or are there some other games played as well that qualify for a provincial "cap"?

If not, it could take a while to clock up your 50 and 100 games.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

They have just mentioned that Rohan Saifoloi has taken the field for Tasman Makos, after Marty Banks intercept try.

Is that the same bloke that plays for the Hobbits at #10 in Shute Shield?

Meanwhile the Tasman Makos score another meat pie from an intercept. 2 min to go. Lambs getting slaughtered by Mako feeding frenzy 38 - 10.

Edit: Full time. Lambs lead to the Slaughter. 38-10.

Bloody hell, Cantab Captain Nasi Manu's nose is more sideways than certain Wallaby backs attacking runs.

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

There is a bit of talk about Blazer games and 50 games etc from the commentators.

Do the NZ provinces just play ITM Cup games (only about 9 each year) or are there some other games played as well that qualify for a provincial "cap"?

If not, it could take a while to clock up your 50 and 100 games.

Generally everyone gets 2 or 3 pre-season games plus the ITM incl playoffs but yes it takes a while to make the milestones: Tim Boys debuted (for Otago) in 2005 & played his 100th match for Southland last week v Cantabs.

As for tonight's shocker, Cantabs look absolutely shellshocked. Will still make the semis but fuck me they'll be lucky to make the GF let alone win it on current form.

 

[Dan54]

HJ, blazer games can be confusing, some provinces have 50 games, some 20 etc, up to each province.I think generally it has to be comp games to be counted. I know my club in Levin, you were entitled to a blazer after the equivilent of 2 full years games, think it was 20 or some such amount. I know most players that had blazer were incredibly proud, and were always to be seen in blazer and tie after game. Unfortunately the one I got for being manager for a few years seems to have shrunk a little and is now a touch small!!

 

[Hugh Jarse]

<snip> Unfortunately the one I got for being manager for a few years seems to have shrunk a little and is now a touch small!!

It is that sub-tropical heat and humidity in Queensland. Shrinks clothing something terrible.

 

[Dan54]

To true mate, that is obviously what happened to all my clothing, seems to cause problems for scales too!

 

[Dan54]

By geez WOB, that ended up being a good touch up for the Lambs. I think it was another great game where the theory that a team decides they are going to give big bro a bloody nose, nothing stops them. The Makos defence especially b=in 2nd half was pretty good, they just swarmed all over the Canterbury boys, never let them have any space. Really enjoyed the game!!
Geez would be more than happy to see Makos/Naki final!!

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

Hawkes Bay smashed 3-29 by Manawatu but in Palmy North so the Shield's safe. Cruden found his way to the ground but must've slept in 'cos he only played the last 30:

www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/provincial/10581847/Cruden-shows-class-in-good-Manawatu-win

Taranaki too good for Wellington but not by as much I expected, 38-22.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/provincial/10581896/Taranaki-too-good-for-brave-Wellington

Updated points table here (everyone gets 10 regular season games):

http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/scoreboard/9797173/Rugby-Scoreboard

Updated Heartland table here (1 round remaining):

http://www.heartlandchampionship.co.nz

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

Successful return to rugby for SBW, coming off the bench to help Counties smash the Aucks 41-18, 6 tries (incl a PT) to 1. Didn't get on the score sheet but there was a nice assist in there.

Result eases the pressure on Canty a little, but Sunday v Taranaki is still a must-win if they're to secure a home semi. They'll have to do it without DC, he's officially broken again but may be back for SF on the 18th. Odds on him making the EOYT must be lengthening by the day - still expecting him to be in Chicago & maybe captain the side but after that possibly come home & go into rehab.

EDIT: Canty can't get a home semi, currently 7 points adrift & only 1 game to play. Fuck it.

 

[Bairdy]

#FinsUp

 

[Dan54]

Manawatu knock Otago over in another bloody entertainig game of rugby. By gee manawatu must have a few players that Super teams will be very interested in. Otare Black and Jade Te Ruru are a couple of pretty handy 10s, and their outside cetainly look not bad.
Just one thought, after watching the AB/Bok test and these ITM cup games, noone will convince me that rugby needs rules changed to get entertaining rugby, it's more about the teams wanting to play a postive game!