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ARU Junior Gold Cup - National Junior Championships

Discussion in 'Schoolboy Rugby' started by George Smith, Oct 18, 2012.

  1. George Smith Ted Thorn (20)

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    For information and discussion about this new tournament being developed by the AJRU
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  2. George Smith Ted Thorn (20)

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    National U17 RESULTS at Caloundra (October 2012)

    U17 results.jpg

    QLD won the Chris Latham Shield in defeating NSW 21-19
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  3. George Smith Ted Thorn (20)

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    This is the team selected by John Connolly and Tony Dempsey over the Fri & Sat at Coloundra as announced:

    2012 AJRU Merit U17 XV
    1. Benroy SALA (Sunnybank/QLD)
    2. Jeremy LEBER (Wests/ACT)
    3. Harrison LLOYD (St Edmunds College/ACT)
    4. Nikola LATUHOI (Werribbe High/VIC)
    5. Josh VAINIKOLO (Entrance/CRU/NSW)
    6. Sam CROKE (Lennox Head/CJRU/NSW)
    7. Brandon PAENGA-AMOSA (Sthn Dist/Sydney/NSW)
    8. Nathan HAAR (Sunshine Coast/QLD)
    9. Brendan TRUDGEN (St Edmunds College/ACT)
    10. Harrison BUREY (Wagga/ACT)
    11. Sam HYNE (Red/QLD)
    12. Jason TOMANE (Sunnybank/QLD)
    13. Trent WINTERSTEIN (Merrylands/Sydney/NSW)
    14. Bill VALETINTI (VIC)
    15. Ben COTTON (Dural/Sydney/NSW)
    16. Alistair STEWART (Darling Downs/QLD)
    17. Mark HIGGINSON (Moorabbin/VIC)
    18. Blake WALSH (Wanderers/CRU/NSW)
    19. Max ALLEN (Sunshine Coast/QLD)
    20. Fereti SAAGA (Northern/VIC)
    21. Brent WHICKER (Hawkesbury/Sydney/NSW)
    22. Christian KAGIASSIS (Canterbury/Sydney/NSW)
    23. Shane PARKINSON (Sunshine Coast/QLD)

    AJRU U17s (2012).jpg
    The 2012 AJRU U17 XV with Tony Dempsey & John "Knuckles" Connolly (Team Selectors)
  4. George Smith Ted Thorn (20)

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    It seems that Mssrs Connolly and Dempsey did an excellent job over the tournament in selecting an inaugural team. These two well credentialed gentlemen should be considered for further 'selector' gigs IMO as they saw through the results and have got the best players for each jersey in the team.

    percentage.jpg
  5. Hugh Jarse Rocky Elsom (76)

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    Why have they chosen U17 as the flagship, and not U18 or U19?

    The AJRU has a charter to go to U19 according to the constitution of that body - (only heard that from another gaggerlanger, never seen the document).
  6. George Smith Ted Thorn (20)

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    Probably on a strategic note. For the AJRU want to provide an alternative pathway to the Australian Schoolboys which is seen by many as elitist. Ultimately the AJRU wants to have international tours. This year they tried unsuccessfully to get to Fiji. The end goal is to have regular tours and ideally even to Europe.

    Through the introduction of the National Club Rugby Championships the AJRU have provided a pathway to the club player. Firstly, in the interstate series at U15s then the NCRC at U17s (note the ARU sponsored National U16 Rugby Championships fits between these age groups). Then with the Aust Schools U18 champs and also the Aust Schools (U18) rep team there is now a good stepped pathway for the older junior rugby player to be developed before they embark on their senior careers.
  7. Lee Grant John Eales (66)

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    I like this idea - and as you mention GS, the U/15 and U/17 JRU comps straddle the existing Oz Schools U/16 championships.

    The lads who play only for their school get their pathway through the various school association rep games and the national championship, and the best get in the two Oz Schools teams and maybe get on a tour, depending on the year.

    The other lads, who play for their clubs, can get on a path outside the school system through their state JRU rep games and National Club Rugby Championship.

    No doubt some can have a go at the NCRC if they miss out on the Oz Schools pathway but it the main the NCRC will cater to all the players missed by the Schools system, and let's not quibble; that is elitist.

    Is that about right GS?`

    There may be some naysayers who reckon that most of the best U/17 and U/18s should be caught by the Oz Schools net anyway. There will be others not wanting Australia to be represented on tours by U/18 players when they reckon most of the best ones in that age group are in the Oz Schools system.

    Well, too bad; if anybody thinks the Oz Schools system succeeds in catching all the good players in the two main rugby states they are not being rational; country players, in particular, are often overlooked.

    The ironic thing is that we can't prove that so many people missed out on taking their career further because there was no backup system to offer them a path, because they are not around to be counted.

    We have to go with the vibe.


    GS - you have probably mentioned this before but who funds the state JRUs and the AJRU?
    .
  8. George Smith Ted Thorn (20)

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    Funding for the various Junior unions is a mixture of grants from the ARU (passed/trickled down through the affiliates) and player levies.

    ARJU has received monies from its direct affiliates. They will also be searching for grants from the ASC. On of the requirements for this is to have a CEO. Hence, Brendan Ryan was appointed. His main job, I understand, is to get in sponsorship to help alleviate his $100k salary.

    If you are looking for the NSWJRU finances you will not have any luck. They haven't been audited for several years and although accepted at last years AGM they have not been published.
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  9. Jaghond Ted Fahey (11)

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    Nor have Annual Reports been published on their website since 2008.
    One could ask, respectfully, where is the accountability...
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  10. Hugh Jarse Rocky Elsom (76)

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    I like the idea of more skills development and benchmarking opportunities for the next generation of Men in Gold.
    The big problem I see with it is that there is no central coordination, and consequently there are a number of headless chickens running around doint what they believe is the right thing.
    The player pool and parents are confused about the development pathways. Schools, Juniors, or Colts?

    The idea of a seperate pathway outside the schools solely for junior club players is a wonderful concept, but there are plenty of kids who play both club and school, (not so prevelant within School 1st XV and 16A at CAS/GPS).
    There are plenty of kids enticed to the GPS/CAS system from the juniors pathway at U15 and above who then get locked away from the Junior pathway, weakening it significantly.
    To maintain its relevance, eligibility criteria within Juniors Club footy seems to be manipulated.
    The standard of U17 and Opens grade SJRU rugby is nowhere near as competitive to GPS/CAS as it is at U14 and U15.
    Talented kids at non-regular rugby Schools often register for the local Colts programme.
    Last time I looked, the Sydney Colts players are not affiliated with Sydney Juniors, yet these kids turn up in NSW Schools and NSW Juniors representative Selections.
    It is this struggle for relevance as their player base is eroded by Colts and Schools from Under 16 onwards that undermines the credibility of the second (Junior Club) pathway.

    Schools RU selects players who are not regularly playing rugby for their School.
    Juniors RU select players who are not playing in junior competitions, either from Schools players or Colts players.

    In addition to the Schools and Juniors pathway, and to an extent drawing off it, the ARU has a well documented pathway to gold development pathway, but others seem to want to run their own pathway outside that, or in competition to it.

    Parents and players just want to play rep footy.
    Our scarce resources seem to be used inefficiently.

    There should be one and one organisation only responsible for all rugby from under 13 - Under 19.
    This organisation should have competition committees rather than seperate accountable affiliate status to arrange club and school representation programmes.
    By all means, have National U15, U17 and U19 competitions to go along with the already establised ARU sponsored National U16's, and the Aust Schools U18 competition.
    Do not pretend that they are "special" to one competition organisation, and then manipulate the eleigbility criteria to allow individuals who are outside the organisation to represent it.

    Allow all kids playing rugby to nominate for the district/state/national team regardless of whether they are registered with one or more of: School, Village Clubs or Colts.

    Do away with the affiliate organisation represention "pretence" and focus simply on an age group cohort.
    If a School, or series of schools will not release their players for representative duty for a certain age group, then so be it, other kids will get a chance in front of the selectors and scouts.

    One pathway, one organisation, one goal.
    George Smith and Inside Shoulder like this.
  11. hollowman Peter Burge (5)

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    Great situation analysis. Couldn't agree more. Seems to me like there are plenty of win/win opportunities. Beyond creating awareness how do we make this happen? Is there a forum where schools and clubs (including colts) could work together? Perhaps this has been tried before?
  12. Hugh Jarse Rocky Elsom (76)

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    The affiliates of the NSWJRU are SJRU and NSW Country JRU.
    NSWJRU is affiliated to NSWRU.

    One would have thought that the NSW JRU affiliates, Office Bearers, or AGM would not have passed the annual financial statements without these being audited. There are two Executive Vice Presidents of the NSWJRU. These are the Duly elected President of SJRU and NSWCJRU (or their delegates). The List of Office Bearers includes a further delegate from each of the two affiliates (NSWCJRU and SJRU).

    I have known of instances where an AGM has passed unaduited financial statements with a proviso that the Audit is completed by [insert date], and that the Audit contains no findings. In those instances, the Executive Committee have really been on edge, until the Auditor has completed their report.

    It is highly unusual for this situation to go for so long, and unconstitutional.

    Clause 31(e) of the NSW JRU Constitution states "The accounts of the Union shall be audited by a qualified auditor who shall not hold any other office in the Union."
    Clause 16 (g)(i) states "The business to be transacted at an Annual General Meeting shall be consideration and adoption of the Annual Report and Audited Balance Sheet of the Union."

    At a casual glance, and if the statements made by others are correct about the financial statements and balance sheets being unaudited for a number of years, then you do not need to be Professor Julius Sumner-Miller to draw appropriate conclusions.

    One is left wondering whether the NSW RU is aware of the situation with one of its affiliates, and how comfortable the NSW CJRU and SJRU are with the situation.

    One wouldn't think it would be too difficult a task to produce a balance sheet and present the books for independent audit.

    Would this oversight prevent the body receiving State and Commonwealth funding and grants?

    NSW JRU Constitution (2007) is available on their website at http://www.nswjuniors.rugbynet.com.au/default.asp?type=library
  13. George Smith Ted Thorn (20)

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    NSW JRU - Financial Report and Statements for year ended 31 Oct 2011

    Fellow bloggers, as Paul Taylor (President NSWJRU) obviously does not see the need for accountability I now post the Commercial/Financial Report for the NSWJRU which includes the 2010 and 2011 accounts.

    Looking at the minutes of the 2010 AGM there is no mention of an audit or the need for an auditor!

    In accordance with the NSWJRU Constitution, Paul Taylor as President will need to step down at this year's AGM (unless no one stands for this role) having served three years.

    Watch this space.

    Attached Files:

  14. Hugh Jarse Rocky Elsom (76)

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    Vote 1 George.:)

    Have SJRU or CJRU got a succession plan in place, or is this going to be an sh!tfight to rival NSW Labour party preselections?

    From the Constitution:
    16 (b) The Annual General Meeting shall be held not later than 30th November of each year, and twenty-eight (28) days notice of the date and place of holding it shall be given by letter to each Member Union.

    They will be nearly into the 28 Days notice if they haven't already held their AGM for 2012.

    The Accounts should be finalised by now and be undergoing Audit.
  15. Inside Shoulder Nathan Sharpe (72)

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    Could someone fill me in on the details of this comp?
  16. Hugh Jarse Rocky Elsom (76)

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    ^^^ I think it is an evolving concept that is very much in its immature stages so far.

    On the back of some traditional "friendlies" between NSW, QLD and the ACT organised with a couple of phone calls and run on the smell of an oily rag, it would appear that there is an intent by some to formalise this as part of "the pathway", either in competition with, or complementing the existing U16 and U18 competitions.
  17. George Smith Ted Thorn (20)

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    There is a debate as to the relevency of the Regional champs for Interstate teams as they are basically are selection weekend for the Sydney team. However, SA and WA do not want to play the big unions (Qld/NSW). The Interstate series this year arrived as ACT and VIC suddenly asked for games in Oct (2011) as the same w/e when Qld and NSW were playing at Rat Park but all too late to accomodate. Also, NSW had just played ACT a few weekend earlier. This then forced a re-think for rep pathway. This year's Interstate comp went partway to accomodating these stakeholder groups PLUS allowed for the AJRU to try and gain some much needed relevance!

    For the U15/U16/U17 age groups we need to:
    a) keep the NSW State Champs in June for NSW teams (district and country zone teams only)
    b) dispel with the Regionals and select the Sydney team from the State Champs
    c) for the Interstate Champs adopt the U18 model ie. 2 tier, 2 pool tournament

    This way we do not overburden the talent pool in playing too much rep footy, keep costs down and create a better pathway and supporter interest.
  18. Hugh Jarse Rocky Elsom (76)

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    George, the whole thing is broken. Tinkering at the edges is nice, but..

    There are three four* organisations trying to organise multiple pathways for the same talent pool of 14 year old + boys.

    If the stakeholders could ever get in the same room and ditch the egendas, they would realise that they are all trying to achieve the same outcome. Growth and development of rugby and rugby players.

    Time for the grownups to step in and get the children organised. We do not have the player numbers or finances to keep on doing what we have always done. The Cosgrove report presents an opportunity. The Schools sponsored thinktank in BrisVegas is another. The AJRU Strategic plan - ummmmm.

    We are run by an organisation that can not even manage to present an audited balance sheet at an AGM in direct non-compliance with their Constitution. What hope is there apart from a complete clean out?

    "One Pathway, One Organisation, One Goal".

    Re-assemble everything from the top down. That being said, I like your ideas above. Under 16 and Under 17 is a worry in clubland, there is just not enough players. We need to be working on ideas to develop the non-private school numbers in these age groups, or look to more innovative ways of running the club competitions to de-conflict with Schools.


    * 4 organisations = ARU High Performance Unit, Juniors, Schools, & Colts (to a lessor degree but the State Champs are based on Colts/Grade Districts).
  19. Inside Shoulder Nathan Sharpe (72)

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    so I'm in on the ground floor - haven't missed anything yet!!!
  20. Hugh Jarse Rocky Elsom (76)

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    Ground Floor yes, but being "noticed" in Under 15's makes things relatively easy (if there is such a thing) under the present pathway models.

    People get on and off the pathway conveyor at various stages for various reasons, but older the child is, the harder the entry criteria seems to be.

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