Australia v South Africa - Perth - 6 September 2014

[Blue]

Surely Potgeiter playing Super Rugby is a better option that Juan Smith playing Top 14? I am a huge Smith fan but you don't know where he stands in the pecking order based on those performances.

Is Potgeiter actually available or does his Japanese contract have no release clause for test duty?

Absolutely Pottie is a better option. Picking Smith turned out to me a mare.

Interesting point about Potgieter. Will see if I can find out.

 

[Ulrich]

Meyer seems hell bent on not playing a 13 at 13. All the players you mention except Foutie of course are not natural 13's

Meyer places more value in a big guy at 13 than he does someone who is skilled in the position.

I thought Taute was the worst decision he ever made. Then he surprised me and picked De Allende at 13.

Jordaan was in great form last year until he got injured. But he is too small for Meyer.

I think not giving de Jongh a real chance and playing guys like JJ Engelbrecht ahead of him is pretty stupid.

JJ got loads of game time and did nothing. Juan gets a few cameos and then dropped.

I'll take the stupid back. It's idiotic and perplexing.

At least Serfontein has the skills set but he needs to now give him time. Of all these names he is the best equipped to make it work.

I am of the opinion any of 10-15 in the backline can play any other position from 10-15 in the backline given enough time there.

JJ would have been awesome at 13 had he actually gotten his defensive game right because he is amazingly fast and very strong. Given what I have said above he probably could have been international standard by now had Meyer stuck with him, but it would have been nice of the Bulls to assist in this regard in the same manner that using Hougaard exclusively at 9 would also assist.

Instead, we have had at least two outside centres each season now and that makes it difficult for anyone not accustomed to the position to establish rythm before building confidence.

It is a fairly tricky position to play in because there's not much leniency for error. One mistake and your winger (if even present) could be in a world of trouble, when this does not happen a change of direction could open up the opposite side for the opposition. The guys on the inside have the knowledge that there's a few people outside to make up for a slight mistake.

Your 13 does not have that luxury and the nature of his position means by the time he has to make a defensive decision (rush in for intercept or to close off, tackle inside player, tackle outside player or shift) he is already in a fair amount of trouble with fast runners coming from several angles.

Anyway, at least we have a coach who tries to solve a problem. It is evident what his motives are. Not long ago we had a real crisis at lock and now we're in a position that if everyone were fit it would give us Eben, Lewies, PSdT, that dude from the Lions, Lood de Jager, Juandre Kruger, Flip vd Merwe as well as the old guard in Bakkies and Matfield. That's 9 locks excluding Andries Bekker yet.

 

[Blue]

Your last two paragraphs contradict your first two.

It's a specialist position. Test match rugby is not a training ground for 13's who have never played there.

 

[Ulrich]

Your last two paragraphs contradict your first two.

It's a specialist position. Test match rugby is not a training ground for 13's who have never played there.

It's not meant as contradictory, it's meant to say time is required there. I don't see anyone else at 13 at provincial level that shines. Jordaan is a possibility and so is de Jongh but I'm not convinced on either. Other than that I'm afraid Meyer has to experiment if the franchises are unwilling.

Big heavy blokes make sense in frigid conditions for next year. If you looked at it differently, had JJ or de Allende paid off we'd have a rockstar at 13 now.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Yep, outside centre is a specialised position, especially on defence. It's the toughest spot in the backline and you want a proven performer there. Other places you can chop and change a bit, but not at 13. I'd even venture to say that in many cases you build the rest of the backline around them to a degree.

 

[Blue]

It's not meant as contradictory, it's meant to say time is required there. I don't see anyone else at 13 at provincial level that shines. Jordaan is a possibility and so is de Jongh but I'm not convinced on either. Other than that I'm afraid Meyer has to experiment if the franchises are unwilling.

Big heavy blokes make sense in frigid conditions for next year. If you looked at it differently, had JJ or de Allende paid off we'd have a rockstar at 13 now.

Well then we need Meyer to sit down with the Super coaches and plead with them too play JJ, De Allende and whoever else at 13 so they can learn at Super level.

But we know that's not going to happen.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Blue, out of interest -- who would be your preferred centre pairing?

 

[Ulrich]

Yep, outside centre is a specialised position, especially on defence. It's the toughest spot in the backline and you want a proven performer there. Other places you can chop and change a bit, but not at 13. I'd even venture to say that in many cases you build the rest of the backline around them to a degree.

I don't deny your way of thinking.

 

[Dctarget]

Boks at 2.25. Surely that's some great odds right there? In my mind I have them as favourites.


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[Viking]

Boks at 2.25. Surely that's some great odds right there? In my mind I have them as favourites.


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I have them as favourites too. Just can't see how our forward pack is going to compete.

 

[Blue]

Blue, out of interest -- who would be your preferred centre pairing?

Right now out of the fit players the one that is playing this week. I would like to see them given time to settle down together. They looked good at times last year.

I regret Sias Ebersohn never getting a chance. He plays ten kgs above his weight. Hell of a player. What he could do behind a strong pack and outside a strong offloader is something we never really saw.

 

[Blue]

I have them as favourites too. Just can't see how our forward pack is going to compete.

Your pack usually lifts against us. Except for Brissie last year when they got slapped around like a red headed stepchild.

 

[Blue]

It's not meant as contradictory, it's meant to say time is required there. I don't see anyone else at 13 at provincial level that shines. Jordaan is a possibility and so is de Jongh but I'm not convinced on either. Other than that I'm afraid Meyer has to experiment if the franchises are unwilling.

Big heavy blokes make sense in frigid conditions for next year. If you looked at it differently, had JJ or de Allende paid off we'd have a rockstar at 13 now.

Size and speed is not critical for a 13.

I give you one Conrad Smith.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Size and speed is not critical for a 13.

I give you one Conrad Smith.

Agreed, even though Conrad isn't tiny. He's not Mortlock size, but bigger than BOD. He isn't super quick though, but runs immaculate lines. His ability to read the play is fantastic.

I think what we see with Nonu and Smith is your classic combination of sledgehammer and rapier. That's always been my theory on centre pairings anyway.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

Your pack usually lifts against us. Except for Brissie last year when they got slapped around like a red headed stepchild.

They'll need to. It's not like the Bok pack is any less formidable than the AB's. We need to get better at taking on these types of teams up front before worrying about what the backs will do.

 

[Scrubber2050]

The Bokkies are definitely favourites. We are the underdogs.

 

[Sidbarret]

Regarding Potgieter.

I think his popularity in Sydney is a little out of proportion with his actual contribution. His all action style of smashing into people looks great, bu doesn't achieve that much. He has also been playing lock and at 1.95 he is simply too small to do that job at international level. If we want to go for the big, aggressive and crazy blindside we should rather be looking at Micheal Rhodes, Rynard Elstadt or Jacques Du Plessis. We are really blessed with these types of loosies.

Picking Marcel Coetzee is probably the "right" call, I don't know if he is the "right fit". I think Whitely would have complemented Vermeulen and Louw better. Meyer screwed up not involving Whitely in June.

At center I feel bad for JJ Engelbrecht. I don't think he should have been selected when he was, but he seemed to grow into the role in 2013. On the EOYT he was replaced by Fourie, who stank the place up. I think JJ should have been kept at outside center until he played himself out of the side or somebody played their way in. Alternatively JdJ should be given the opportunity, if on no other basis than he is actually a 13.

 

[PiXeL_Ninja]

Agree 100% that Potgieter is overrated. ^ Jacques de Plessis is >>>>>>

Surprised that I found another poster who thinks JJ could turn into something more, he is a real greyhound. He was quite poor in defense and that is why I think he was dropped. I always thought that it was done as a way to fuel the hunger for more time in the Bok jersey, but he has really been left out in the cold?

Days are bloody dragging along!

 

[Bairdy]

Right now out of the fit players the one that is playing this week. I would like to see them given time to settle down together. They looked good at times last year.

I regret Sias Ebersohn never getting a chance. He plays ten kgs above his weight. Hell of a player. What he could do behind a strong pack and outside a strong offloader is something we never really saw.

Sias or Robert?

 

[Blue]

Sias or Robert?

ROBERT!


phew.