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Australian Junior Rugby Union

Discussion in 'Rugby Discussion' started by Hugh Jarse, Sep 4, 2012.

  1. Hugh Jarse Rocky Elsom (76)

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    This probably deserves a thread in its own right, rather than being buried in NSW Junior Representatives 2012 thread.

    I am sure that we need more governing bodies to “control” teenage rugby, and it is great to see that the Australian Junior Rugby Union has apparently been reformed.

    Does anyone know what are their objectives, roles, constitution and funding source of this very important body?

    I expected that an august body, possibly even the peak body for Junior Rugby in Australia, such as the Australian Junior Rugby Union would have all that information on a fancy web site with links to all the junior affiliated bodies web sites and vice versa. Imagine my surprise to find that that there is more information on the inner workings of the Australian Secret Intelligence Service than the Peak body for Junior Rugby Union in Australia.
    George Smith tells us of this inspired measure for what I assume will be the first $100k to be spent by the AJRU.

    With approximately $2.00 profit made on every snag sold at Junior Rugby BBQ’s, that is only 50,000 sausage sangers that we need to sell to cover the Administrator’s costs before any other costs at the village clubs are covered. Wonder how much a tour or championship would cost?
    IIRC I have read somewhere that ARU tip in $100k to run the Open Schoolboys competition. On that benchmark, that is another 50,000 sausage sangers that we need to sell in suburban ovals.
    If each rugby oval can sustain 6 games of rugby per Saturday, over the 8 hour period from 9am to 5pm, and there are 20 players in each team, with each player bringing 2 spectators along, and 30% of the total people at the oval that day buy a snag, with $2 profit to go to AJRU to fund the Administrator and one Championship, over 450 all day Junior rugby sausage sizzles have to be held across this wide brown land before a cent is available for the clubs running the BBQ.
    Taking a stab in the dark and assuming that there are 100 Ovals in Sydney alone. I have no idea of the actual number, but many of them do NOT run all day rugby, but stay with me here. SJRU typically run a 14 week competition. This will give us 1400 BBQ opportunities, of which 450 (or approx 33%) are needed to cover AJRU costs. Assuming that Sydney JRU represents 25% of all JRU ovals in Aust, then 25% of 33% (or approximately 10%) of all sausages sanger revenue at ALL junior rugby games in Australia will go directly to the AJRU to fund its operations. GST is 10%. AJRU is GST on Sausage Sangers.

    Taking this one step further, it takes 2 people to operate the sausage sizzle. These two people (or a rostered combination) are required to be there for the full 8 hour period of the 450 BBQs above. The 450 BBQ’s then would require 900 volunteer days effort. With the average worker working 200 days per year, and the average wage in Australia being $60k, the Junior Rugby Volunteers are “donating” $270k in labour to raise the $200k needed to cover the Salary of the AJRU Administrator and one Championship. Very clever indeed (figures are rounded up/down for simple illustrative purposes).

    Some background reading from the other threads attached.

  2. Hugh Jarse Rocky Elsom (76)

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    Some information on this little known organisation taken from last years ARU Annual Report available from ARU web site.

    They didn't seem to achieve too much in 2011, but it looks like that did notice that QLD and NSW juniors had a state tournament each which others attend. They also seem to take credit for organising a 3 day tournament somewhere for 3 teams from 3 associates across 3 age groups which one of the participants visited WA on the way home.

    There is also an intent to break out of a burdensome funding cycle. No details of how they will break that cycle. Maybe they intend to talk to the Balmain Rugby Club.

    The AJRU executive appear to have earned their salary.
    Man on the hill likes this.
  3. Hugh Jarse Rocky Elsom (76)

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    And here is what they said in 2010 in the ARU Annual Report:

    So the President sets 3 objectives himself: Improve a relationship, attend an AGM, and develop a strategic plan.
    The Strategic plan objective was not achieved, but it must be assumed that the AGM was enjoyed and the relationship improved. Not hard to achieve the latter because there was NO mention of AJRU in the 2009 Annual Report, so the existance of this contribution in the 2010 report is evidence that the relationship has improved.

    Two out of three ain't bad. The third (and arguably key) objective of developing a strategic plan was not achieved. What's more, it is of such import that the lack of a strategic plan, or achievement of one is not mentioned in the 2011 AJRU contribution to the annual report.

    We seem to be well served by goal focused success oriented achievers.
  4. Man on the hill Alex Ross (28)

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    Given that NSWJRU has only 2 members - Sydney & Country Juniors, you have to wonder what they are upto to allow NSWJRU to get so apparently out of control. As to egos - i hear on good authority that the past president of MSWJRU had a healthy one.
    Rugby Mum likes this.
  5. TOCC Guest

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    Everything in NSW rugby highlights why we need a independent commission to restructure rugby in Australia.

    The very fact that NSW Rugby holds the majority vote at the ARU is scary enough considering the shambles and disconnect of groups and bodies within the state.
  6. Hugh Jarse Rocky Elsom (76)

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    The Draw for the AJRU U17 Nationals has been released:
    Friday 5th October 10:30 am Opening Ceremony
    Friday 5th October 11 am VIC vs QLD (22 min each way)
    Friday 5th October 12 pm ACT v NSW (22 min each way)
    Friday 5th October 3 pm VIC v NSW (22 min each way)
    Friday 5th October 4 pm ACT v QLD (22 min each way)

    Saturday 6 October 9:30 am VIC v ACT (35 min each way)
    Saturday 6 October 11:30 am NSW v QLD (35 min each way)
    Saturday 6 October 1 pm Announcement of AJRU U17 Merit XV, and Tournament Closing Ceremony

    In parallel with that NSW, QLD 1, QLD 2 and VIC are playing some U 15 Interstate games, which I think AJRU will be taking credit for but, unlike the U17's, they are not awarding these games the title of "Nationals".

    Friday 11 am VIC v QLD 2 (22 min each way)
    Friday 2 pm VIC v QLD 1 (22 min each way)
    Friday 4 pm NSW v QLD 2 (22 min each way)
    Saturday 9:30 am NSW v QLD 1 (22 min each way)
    Saturday 12:00 am VIC v NSW (22 min each way)

    Games to be played at Caloundra Rugby Club.

    Just when you thought that AJRU would deliver nothing for the year. This will undoubtably be the highlight of the year for this august body.

    I wish the players all the best, and know that they will play their hearts out. Same for the coaches, managers, support staff, referrees and the volunteers from the Caloundra Footy Club.

    I sincerely hope the AJRU Opening and Closing ceremonies are appropriatly ceremonial, and the AJRU Officials are resplendently attired as befits their status.
  7. Don Parry Bob McCowan (2)

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    The problem with 'blogs' like this is that there is no requirement for the writer to research the topic or in any way be factual.

    As the AJRU Vice President and QJRU President I wish to add a few facts to the discussion.

    No member of the AJRU Board is paid. I have never received an item of clothing for serving as a volunteer on this junior body. I have also never asked nor been given compensation for travel, phone or other costs by the AJRU.

    The AJRU does not receive grants from the ARU nor any government department.

    Many of the pathway opportunities in rugby are the domain of schools rugby and often elite schools rugby. The AJRU simply wishes to provide club juniors opportunity.

    No junkets, no waste - just a group of volunteers trying to give junior club rugby players opportunity.

    For the above stated reasons I find many comments in this thread truly offensive. After a wonderful, positive weekend in Caloundra I find this thread steals a volunteer's most valued possession - PASSION.
  8. hollowman Peter Burge (5)

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    Its most likely that both pathways are supported by passionate volunteers with only good intent. I observe a few problems
    • the people involved in each pathway seem focussed on the faults of the other
    • or competiting against each other rather than collaborating
    • that both suffer from a lack of transparency and/or communication in their administration, selections etc etc.
    Unfortunately this undermines the credibility of junior rugby pathways and those volunteers involved. There seems to be a lot of constructive feedback in these forums that might be good guidance for making the necessary improvements.
    Newbie likes this.
  9. Hugh Jarse Rocky Elsom (76)

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    So what are the AJRU objectives, roles, structure, constitution and funding source?

    Who are the affiliated entities?

    Where can we find information about the body?

    How are the officials elected/appointed?

    Are AGM minutes made available?

    Any plans for a web site containing information aout the body?

    Has a full time administrator been appointed in Brisbane (circa $100k pa) and if so where is the funds coming from for this?

    Any plans for tours and National representative teams?

    Are there any plans for funding to be raised from a levy on all junior players (incl minis)?
    Rugby Mum, Newbie, Jets and 1 other person like this.
  10. Jets John Hipwell (52)

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    Don it would be great if you could proved us with the information mentioned by Hugh above. If you read through the thread I think you will notice that a lot of points have been raised that could be answered with some transparency from the AJRU. I for one don't see the point of the organisation but could be convinced if provided with some relevant information, the goals of the organisation and a strategic plan to achieve these goals. If you put an article together I am sure they would post it on the blog page and the AJRU would generate some interest among passionate rugby people.
    RugbyReg likes this.
  11. zacf01 Stan Wickham (3)

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    Transparency is a foreign word to the QJRU and i am now getting the feeling that it goes all the way to the AJRU.
  12. Don Parry Bob McCowan (2)

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    I love someone who complains about transparency and then publishes as zac101

    Here is a few sites you may like to look through.



    I accept that the AJRU and QJRU could be better at talking directly to the grassroots of junior rugby rather than attempting to go down the food chain (regions and then clubs).

    Before you completely bag out volunteers please consider whether any level of rugby in Australia is good at communication, consultation and collaboration.

    You are either part of the problem or part of the solution and without having the fortitude to publish under your real name it is difficult for me to appreciate which camp you are in.
  13. Don Parry Bob McCowan (2)

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    I have recently published a consultation (green) paper seeking input in to the future direction of junior rep rugby in Queensland. This has been distributed to all our affiliates (regions). If you haven't seen it the bottleneck is at regional or club level.

    My email address is:- don@qjru.com.au

    If anyone emails me requesting a copy I would gladly send it to you and welcome a response.

    Don Parry
    kiap likes this.
  14. Don Parry Bob McCowan (2)

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    I have been a Level 3 Coach since 1996. I have coached state age and the Australian Women's team (The Wallaroos) to the 2002 World Cup. I am a Life Member of my club and my region. My children are all in the twenties. My only reason to stay involved (volunteering) is to help your children get the opportunity they earn.

    I am not against schools rugby. I have given schools rugby over 20 years of service in one form or another.

    I argue that junior rep rugby (the best kid today) is not the same as talent identification (a guess at who will be a potential professional rugby player in 5 years or more).

    The AJRU and QJRU are 50 years old and are charged under their constitutions to look after junior club rugby players up to the age of 19.

    The AJRU and QJRU have struggled to understand their role since the professionalisation of rugby.

    We might have become dinosaurs of a past era if professional rugby had embraced the understanding that junior club rugby, just as much as schools rugby, is a vital part of their supply chain.

    Like schools rugby has an Australian Schoolboys team as a flagship for participation in schools rugby is it not as valid that the AJRU have an Australian U17 team as a flagship for junior rugby?

    If I am wasting my time or you want to step up and do the job please let me know.

    kiap likes this.
  15. hollowman Peter Burge (5)

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    Good on you for responding Don. Its really useful to hear directly from a representative of the AJRU about what's happening and that you are consulting within your state. I am unaware of any other communication effort.

    Also appreciate that the rugby community is mostly made up volunteers, yet the expectations are that we have the resources to run professional organisations.

    If you are able to answer some of the questions that people have posted we might be in a position to actively support what you are trying to achieve. You may be abe to use this forum to get some useful feedback on your consultation paper.
    Jets and kiap like this.
  16. Bowside Peter Johnson (47)

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  17. Thin Thighs Ted Fahey (11)

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    If the AJRU remit is to go to under 19 for junior club rugby, why is Under 17 seen as the flagship team for AJRU?

    Are schools players eligible for AJRU teams?

    What is the eligibility criteria? What if my son was playing for his club in 2012 at U16, but there isn't enough numbers to have a team in 2013? My boy has played village club rugby since he was 4. Can he register with his club as a 17 year old, even if they don't have a team?
  18. Jets John Hipwell (52)

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    Thanks for that Don. I sent through an email today and look forward to reading it.
  19. Hugh Jarse Rocky Elsom (76)

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    I am in both camps, that is part of the problem, and potentially would love to be part of the solution.

    Like most volunteers in rugbydom, I am a passionate supporter of our game, and for good causes will cook BBQs, raffle, and fund raise for as long as in necessary. (part of the solution)

    I (and many others in grass roots) am not happy working my buttocks off raising money for some "anonymous" levy, or a secretive body which I know nothing about. (part of the problem). Raising this thread to try and bring things in the open is an attempt to be part of the solution.

    An extremely correct statement, but accepting that this must remain the status quo is a defeatist attitude.

    Down here in the Premier State, there is an obvious disconnect in the smooth and efficient communication chain running unbroken between AJRU, and the schools and Village clubs my boys are associated with, because we have heard NOTHING, hence raising this thread to get some discussion going. Others spoken to (face to face not on these anonymous threads) from different clubs, districts and Schools in Metro Sydney are likewise mushrooms.

    QJRU seem to have circulated something. Has NSWJRU done similar? The only thing I can find is the Garling Report. What has the AJRU circulated for discussion, or are they waiting for feedback from others (such as the QJRU green paper) before committing?

    Any chance of the main points of the QJRU draft being tossed out on these threads for discussion?

    There are a few here that would criticise Mother Theresa. Ignore them, but by and large Gaggerlanders are a helpful, passionate and positive bunch. You may be surprised at our capacity.

    We like to feel that we are part of the Steamroller rolling on into the future, rather than part of the road, watching the Steamroller that just ran over us disappear into the distance.
    Newbie, Jets and kiap like this.
  20. Newbie Bill McLean (32)

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    Pardon my pun but a 'SOLID' statement from the Hollowman @ #8


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