How to fix the wallabies

[upthereds#!]

The same Etsebeth who played for the Boks at the age of 20? Brodie Retallick is another top lock who broke into the ABs at about the same age. Age has got nothing to do with it. If you are good enough, you are old enough. If Akira Ioane was available, I bet he would be in the Wallabies squad, and you would be cheering him.

Etzebeth. And I think I may have not emphasised the term 'prematurely' enough.

And I'm not saying young people can't be wallabies. JOC (James O'Connor), Beale, Quade, Slipper, Sio, pocock and now hodge, robertson etc etc etc all debuted very young or will debut quite young.

I'm talking about guys who have barely made a dent in Super Rugby like Hanigan and Kellaway that are being called upon for higher honours.

At least Etzbeth, Rettalick and Ioane ripped people to pieces even when young. Their call ups were not premature, they regularly and consistently dominated in their positions prior to their opportunities.


Im concerned about putting promising youngsters in a compromising position by expediating their development & involvement beyond a point where they have shown they have capacity to play. Eg...don't talk about hanigan as a wallaby until he can earn a bench spot at the tahs....

I'm also concerned about putting toooooo much faith in teenagers, elevating them to full time time professionals straight out of school and u20 as opposed to putting them into wider development squads, provincial teams etc, as I believe it costs the opportunity to see other players who developed in a different environment, away from the eyes of the governing bodies.

Even Ioane at 19, played a season of ITM Cup in conjunction with NZ 7's before he got his chance at the Blues.

Etzbeth played Varsity Cup then was regular as a starter for the stormers before being called into boks squad.

Rettalick did the same, but obviously in ITM and Chiefs.

Point is, even the freaks who are the best players in the world had to dominate at a lower level before even getting talked about.

 

[Highlander35]

Fundamentally, more players outside the 18-22 year old band playing very well in State Comps should be given more opportunities at NRC level and Super Level.

At the end of the day however, Super Rugby is a competition that a) provides little disincentive to near bottom on the table and b) is fundamentally a development vehicle for international sides.

Sam Ward is clearly one of the outstanding performers at both club level and NRC level, and deserves a shot for higher honours, and in fact for mine, would have been preferred at the Rebels over Fox this season just past.

However, if at 26 years of age, turning 27 in March, there's no potential for him to get Wallabies caps, a Super Club has little incentive to invest in an unproven player at Pro level, when younger options, or even those playing professionally overseas, can be picked instead.

Can't be changed without a cultural shake up. That's not going to happen due to circumstances.

 

[Gnostic]

Wing is bloody wing. We drafted in Sailor, Rogers, and Tuqiri and they showed some of our blokes what professional fitness and application looked like. They had their flaws, but name someone who was better than them at the time.



Now look at our wing stocks. We've got busted-arse old man Mitchell riding the pine as the only "wing" in the squad for two Bledisloe games. Before Morahan came back, the others were all fullbacks or centres!



No gas. Need gas.

It depends on what you want. Jones wanted 100Kg+ wingers who didn't do anything but run. No passing, no kicking and no much of anything else. In that case Tiquri and Sailor fit the bill very nicely. Rogers was the most skilful pure league convert I have seen in Australian Rugby. A special case.

Lets not forget the Tahu case of fast tracking.

At the time of Tiquiri and Sailor there were others around that were certainly more skilful and if not faster in a straight line could at least change direction effectively and certainly had far better Rugby nous, for instance Peter Hewat and Peter Hynes. There were others, lots of others, but few tipped the scales over the 100Kgs that Jones was after.

In the current situation we have a situation that it doesn't matter that much because our players have been de-skilled to the point that what ever an individual brings to top level rugby is under current coaching and mentoring their peak performance. So in that case look for people who already have the skills that are needed, because no much development will happen post signing.

(NB - I am hoping that Mick Byrne can have a massive influence on this, but it won't be seen for a long time.)

 

[Gnostic]

Out of curiosity, what is/are your solution/s?

Very very shortly -

1) the game is dying, financially. The first order of business is financial stability across the board. That means we cannot have a situation where the broke ARU is bailing out, or in current parlance creating "alliances" with unsustainable franchises. That means simply that to create a funding model that is sustainable the number of franchises must be cut back to match the revenue generated. IMO that means 3 Super teams, maybe 4 at the very most though that is a stretch I think and people with far better managerial experience than I would need to crunch the numbers.
2) the amateur club game must be taken back to that. Amateur. Kill the payments and third party deals etc. However as far as I am concerned this is the true third tier of the Australian Rugby landscape, and it is where the skills are learnt in depth. The decline in the Australian Rugby skill base started with the decline in pro players playing rugby week in week out and training with people of differing skill levels.
3) my views on the NRC are very well known......
4) No more jobs for the boys. No more global searches for a class/club mates to take a top, well paying, plum job.

Now to the upside and what to do:-
1) Genuine coaching development. Not getting bits of paper that becomes an achievement in an of itself and "proves" ones ability to coach. This faux professionalism is an absolute curse in Australia in all walks of life. Genuine KPIs have to be in place and that means some genuine improvements in outcomes on an individual level. Again I'm hoping Mick Byrne can have a huge impact in this area. For many years people here called for a scrum school, what is wrong with an elite panel of proven successful specialists assisting throughout Australian Rugby.
2) Hand in glove with point 1, genuine skill improvements in players and they have to actually play and use those skills in games. No more moving from school into EPS/Elite squads and being cocooned from games.

That surely is enough to get everyone started and ready to explode and petitions started to ban me.

 

[Pfitzy]

At the time of Tiquiri and Sailor there were others around that were certainly more skilful and if not faster in a straight line could at least change direction effectively and certainly had far better Rugby nous, for instance Peter Hewat and Peter Hynes. There were others, lots of others, but few tipped the scales over the 100Kgs that Jones was after.

You're forgetting rugby isn't all about attacking. Hewat was a shit defender. Clever player, great boot, swerve, and eye for an intercept.

I loved watching him play, but he was an utter turnstile.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

Apparently there's are schools Rugby review underway. According to the article it involves longer seasons, restructuring of traditional structures and up to 150 schools. Which is interesting as counting all the schools from GPS, CAS and ISA Div 1 in NSW. GPS, AIC and TAS in Queensland and all the schools from the three other Super Rugby base I got 76.

http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/u...-for-grassroots-of-rugby-20160907-grat3l.html

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

Very very shortly -

1) the game is dying, financially. The first order of business is financial stability across the board. That means we cannot have a situation where the broke ARU is bailing out, or in current parlance creating "alliances" with unsustainable franchises. That means simply that to create a funding model that is sustainable the number of franchises must be cut back to match the revenue generated. IMO that means 3 Super teams, maybe 4 at the very most though that is a stretch I think and people with far better managerial experience than I would need to crunch the numbers.
2) the amateur club game must be taken back to that. Amateur. Kill the payments and third party deals etc. However as far as I am concerned this is the true third tier of the Australian Rugby landscape, and it is where the skills are learnt in depth. The decline in the Australian Rugby skill base started with the decline in pro players playing rugby week in week out and training with people of differing skill levels.
3) my views on the NRC are very well known..
4) No more jobs for the boys. No more global searches for a class/club mates to take a top, well paying, plum job.

Now to the upside and what to do:-
1) Genuine coaching development. Not getting bits of paper that becomes an achievement in an of itself and "proves" ones ability to coach. This faux professionalism is an absolute curse in Australia in all walks of life. Genuine KPIs have to be in place and that means some genuine improvements in outcomes on an individual level. Again I'm hoping Mick Byrne can have a huge impact in this area. For many years people here called for a scrum school, what is wrong with an elite panel of proven successful specialists assisting throughout Australian Rugby.
2) Hand in glove with point 1, genuine skill improvements in players and they have to actually play and use those skills in games. No more moving from school into EPS/Elite squads and being cocooned from games.

That surely is enough to get everyone started and ready to explode and petitions started to ban me.

I suggest you listen to the podcast featuring Peter Playford. Podcast 228 'Rispuct'. A man that has played across the spectrum of Australian Rugby (he played in the ARC) and has since moved into the coaching and administration role at both club and NRC level. You may not like what you hear.

 

[Gnostic]

You're forgetting rugby isn't all about attacking. Hewat was a shit defender. Clever player, great boot, swerve, and eye for an intercept.



I loved watching him play, but he was an utter turnstile.

As I said he was an example, there were others and while he wasn't a great defender, but hardly world's worst either.

 

[formerflanker]

As I said he was an example, there were others and while he wasn't a great defender, but hardly world's worst either.

A man before his time. Played when coaches didn't hide poor defenders, if I remember correctly.
"Utter turnstile" is quite an exaggeration. Was Campese-like at Super level, adding many more points than he ever leaked.

 

[shanky]

A man before his time. Played when coaches didn't hide poor defenders, if I remember correctly.
"Utter turnstile" is quite an exaggeration. Was Campese-like at Super level, adding many more points than he ever leaked.

Yes. I always thought the criticism was overdone

Bit slow perhaps, bit sketchy on D, sure. But by no means, not a quality, exciting player and fan favourite. Good on him.

Would probably get picked at tighthead under Cheika.

 

[Aussie D]

Watching them play last night IMHO we need to move away from the 'width' mantra as it seems to be just chucking the ball across field with little go forward. Australian backline play used to revolve around creating 'time and space' for support players, which is where the running rugby mantra came from. This was then bastardised into 'spin it wide'. Watching the All Blacks play they seem to have taken a page out of Bob Dwyer's coaching manual and adapted it to the modern game.
The basics need to be looked at as well, especially how to carry the ball as Kerevi butchered that try last night by simply carrying the ball in the wrong arm - should have had it in the outside arm so that he could fend or drop his inside shoulder and dive for the line.